Watering Coco vs. Watering Soil

[Hell Yeah]

Hey folks,
I've been growing in coco for about a year and recently decided to switch to soil, mostly for ease of use. I had a question about watering soil, with feeding coco in a dtw system as my reference point.


The impression i get from people who use soil is that they water their plants every few days, once one can stick a hand in the soil and it's dry a few inches down. And the idea when watering soil is to just water enough, not for runoff to come out the bottom of the pot. Is this is the conception most people have of how to water soil or is your experience different?


The explanation people seem to give for this is that you don't really need to water until runoff with soil because you don't have mineral nutrients built up in the root system.

In the case of watering coco with mineral nutrients, you want to water in your nutrients until runoff to flush out the old nutrients that are partially deficient because of what the plant used, which means anything left in the pot is what the plant didn't need. In this way the nutrients at the roots are completely refreshed. Does this seems like an accurate conception of watering in nutrients in a DTW system or is our experience different?

Just a thought I had, I've only been growing seriously and reading on it a lot for about a year and a half, so I'm still a beginner.

smoke em if ya got em

 

[MedFaced]

Kinda mostly sorta right. You can still get a salt build up in soil, even the granola head organic soy boys.

If growing with synthetic nutes in soil, it’s still pretty common to water to runoff and flush regularly. The granola heads feed the plants using microbes. Over watering compacts soil, kills off microbes, chokes the roots by depriving them of oxygen, and can cause all sorts of problems. Organic growers tend to be much more mindful of how they treat their soil so the goal is to water to capacity and then back off. Maintain enough moisture to keep the soil living and the plants fed, but not so much so that it has a negative impact on the delicate micro environment.

Soil is king in my book, but as other smarter people have said in their podcasts, growing in soil is an art form, coco/hydro is a math equation.

 

[MedFaced]

Double post....fart

 

[Hell Yeah]

Good feedback thanks medfaced. Just to be clear, if i was not using synthetic nutrients there would probably be no need to flush?

 

[OG_NoMan]

In the same boat as you Hell Yeah. Just went to organic soil being fed with the complete line of general organics with out using cal/mag. I just up potted and am at feeding every 3rd watering. I think I have over watered 2 plants so far so gotta back off on those. I watered till run off on the feed but just try to saturate the pot on water but no run off. Being new to this and coming from coco like you this is definitely taking some getting used too. Good luck its like learning all over again. I am still having a hard time watering in organic feed at a ph of 3 but I guess thats what you're supposed to do and the plants seem to love it still ph'ing my water to 6.7 on the water only days

 

[Hell Yeah]

Good to hear from you OG noman, and i encourage you to come back to this thread and talk about your transition and stuff you're learning.

When i was growing in coco i would go from a clone in rockwool to a solo cup of coco, then to a 1 gallon, then to a 5 gallon. And i would wait until the roots filled up the current container before transplanting.

I'm in a closet now so i didn't want to have to transplant that many times. One thing I'm planning to do in my new grow, which I am in the final stages of setting up, is transplant clones directly into my final 5 gallon pots. I've been told by a friend who uses soil that this is fine, but I'm not going to want to soak the whole pot, just water where the root mass of the plant is until it reaches out and fills up the pot. This way there isn't stagnant water in the pot.

Just thought i would mention that and get people's take on it? I plan to reuse the soil with some topdressing so it would be very convenient to go straight from a solo cup into my final containers.

 

[superpedro]

When i was growing in coco i would go from a clone in rockwool to a solo cup of coco, then to a 1 gallon, then to a 5 gallon. And i would wait until the roots filled up the current container before transplanting.

I'm in a closet now so i didn't want to have to transplant that many times. One thing I'm planning to do in my new grow, which I am in the final stages of setting up, is transplant clones directly into my final 5 gallon pots. I've been told by a friend who uses soil that this is fine, but I'm not going to want to soak the whole pot, just water where the root mass of the plant is until it reaches out and fills up the pot. This way there isn't stagnant water in the pot.

Just thought i would mention that and get people's take on it? I plan to reuse the soil with some topdressing so it would be very convenient to go straight from a solo cup into my final containers.

Hello.
I start my seedlings in a half liter pot. Clones once rooted 3 liters.
Seedlings, once they fill up the small pot gets transplanted to 3 liters and then finally 12 liters.
You can get away with small plants in big containers, but I prefer the ekstra control of a smaller pot. Drying plants out a little bit in vegetative growth in between watering also promotes root growth.
Not getting soil too wet before roots are ready to drain the pot is important.
But once the roots fill up the pot I do want a runoff from the pot.

Get used to the weight of your pot. Best way of telling how much moisture is in the soil. Even though I use big pots and a scrog screen, a small tip of the pots gives me the information i need.
The moisture in your top layer is the combined effect of water content in your soil, your air humidity and the air circulation above the soil.

Make an efford to get the pH of your soil dialed in. One of the holy grails of soil growing..

 

[Teddybrae]

I agree with Mr Pedro below:

I grow Sativa outdoors in the stuff you walk on in big pots and have found that during veg I can give lotsa water. But during veg at my place it's hot as hell and the days are 13 hours. If your place is cool, then it's different.

When the weather cools down and flowering begins the need for water reduces. Then, I stick a finger in the soil as far as it goes and if it comes up dry I give a maintenance water. Which means enough to get the plant thru the next two/three days.

How do I know the plant is getting enough water during flowering? Because it keeps flowering, meaning: the yellow senescent leaves drop steadily day by day and there is a new 'crop' of white anthers on every flower every day.

Do yourself a favour: buy a Soil pH Test Kit!

But once the roots fill up the pot I do want a runoff from the pot.

Get used to the weight of your pot. Best way of telling how much moisture is in the soil.
The moisture in your top layer is the combined effect of water content in your soil, your air humidity and the air circulation above the soil.

Make an efford to get the pH of your soil dialed in. One of the holy grails of soil growing..

 

[Hell Yeah]

Hello.
Not getting soil too wet before roots are ready to drain the pot is important.
But once the roots fill up the pot I do want a runoff from the pot.

Make an efford to get the pH of your soil dialed in. One of the holy grails of soil growing..

thanks for the reply pedro. how much runoff per watering do you usually go for once the plant is fully rooted in it's final container?


i will take your and teddy's advice and get a soil ph test kit and keep an eye on the ph.

 

[superpedro]

thanks for the reply pedro. how much runoff per watering do you usually go for once the plant is fully rooted in it's final container?


i will take your and teddy's advice and get a soil ph test kit and keep an eye on the ph.

Hard to tell exactly. I stop watering when water starts to come out the bottom. They continue to drip off by themselves.
Once your plants are properly rooted, overwatering symptoms only comes from too frequent watering, they won't suffer from the amount you give them each time. They can handle soaked soil if given the opportunity to drain it properly afterwards.
You don't want to flush out the soil though. If you hose them down each time, your soil loses small organic, clay etc. particles.
Try to use as much time watering as possible. It takes time for dry soil to absorb water.

 

[AgentPothead]

With coco you are feeding the plants directly, the nutrients tend to be salts, and those are what are ending up in the medium and need to be flushed out. In soil you feed the biome, which in turn feeds the plant. When I switched to soil, I started using cloth fabric pots instead of the hard aero pots. That way any overflow gets pulled back up the cloth pot and waters from the bottom.

 

[Hell Yeah]

Hard to tell exactly. I stop watering when water starts to come out the bottom. They continue to drip off by themselves.

yeah this is basically exactly what i was asking. thank you.


agentpothead, thanks for the reply. I actually jsut started using the fabric pots for this grow so if that's a benefit of them, great. really happy to get all this feedback yall.

 

[Teddybrae]

EVERYTHING Mr Pedro says!!!

Hard to tell exactly. I stop watering when water starts to come out the bottom. They continue to drip off by themselves.
Once your plants are properly rooted, overwatering symptoms only comes from too frequent watering, they won't suffer from the amount you give them each time. They can handle soaked soil if given the opportunity to drain it properly afterwards.
You don't want to flush out the soil though. If you hose them down each time, your soil loses small organic, clay etc. particles.
Try to use as much time watering as possible. It takes time for dry soil to absorb water.

 

[wutwut]

i am soil grower. i have never tried any hydroponics but under watering pots with soil. now i prefer smart pots. not too big one but not so small neither. i like 5 gallon which allows me to laid-back for 3 to 5 days in flowering stage.

usually i water them first once till to run off and then next time 50-75% amount of water than last time. then again to run off and same goes on. 1 x run off and 2 x 50-75% cycle is great for me.

and one good thing when growing in soil you don't really have to worry about anything else than bugs and mold. it is easy to take one week vacation if needed.

 

[Hell Yeah]

thanks wutwut, i like how specific your advice is and i will try your method when the plants are filling out their pots in flower.

 

[OG_NoMan]

Where do you guys stand on water PH? My water is on the harder side at 400-450 ppm of I don't know what as I have never tested it. It comes out of the tap at 6.2, when running my coco setup I run 50/50 ro/tap which without nutes is 200-220 ppm ph of 6.4 ish so for soil have ben using a couple drops of ph up per gal to get the water to 6.6 ish. Is this what I should be doing or not? I don't PH when I feed because it is all organic nutes and it says not to ph.

 

[wutwut]

thanks wutwut, i like how specific your advice is and i will try your method when the plants are filling out their pots in flower.

your welcome but remember it depends on your setup! 600w add so much more heat than 400w. i don't know about leds. just find your own sweet spot with watering when using your own setup. my temp is 78.8 - 82.4 and humidity somewhere 35-50% with 400w right now.

600w i will water them for 1x run off 1x 50-75% cycle. it depends everything!!