Type of flexible wire - not flat type ?

[oldog]

I need 6 ft for 600W lamp to ballast, and 6 ft for ballast to 3 pin outlet.
I don't want the 'type NM-B , 14/2 wire that is flat and stiff.
I want the soft flexible type wire.
What do I ask them to cut for me at the Depot ?

Q2- the ballast has no enclosure- I plan to bolt it to the 3/4" ply
wall. Do I need to make and use a heat sink ? ie like an aluminium
sheet between the wall and the ballast ?
The 175w I had with a similar setup was untouchably hot,
but never set us on fire in a year.

Thanks lots !

 

[madpenguin]

I need 6 ft for 600W lamp to ballast, and 6 ft for ballast to 3 pin outlet.
I don't want the 'type NM-B , 14/2 wire that is flat and stiff.
I want the soft flexible type wire.
What do I ask them to cut for me at the Depot ?

Not sure you'll find what your looking for at HD. A local electric supply house is the place to go. There is a sticky up top. On one of those pages, I've posted all available flexible cord types and their ratings. Table 400.4 in the 2008 NEC is what your after. It's on page 8 of that sticky (http://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=2375433&postcount=107).

I'll save you some time and just tell you. The gauge of wire from lamp to ballast depends on the distance from lamp to ballast. Usually you don't want to exceed 15' for #16 flexible cord. I'm an overkill guy. I'd use #14.

This is from the sticky if it helps you understand any better:

I figured the statement "15' max" was good enough but to elaborate, as Eminem states, the lamp cord length is sized in accordance with the functions of your ignitor, or, the capacitance of the capacitor and the inductance of the secondary winding. The ignitor delivers an ignition pulse which fires the bulb. If your lamp cord length is too long (the distance between the secondary tap and your lamp socket), a heavy ripple current can cause acoustic resonance which can cause the bulb to not fire and/or shorten it's life expectancy.

So, get no more than 15' of #16 STW. Thats for the ballast to the lamp socket. You can use SJEW cord from the ballast to the plug for the wall receptacle.
Look at that NEC table. It will tell you what is rated for 600v and what is rated for 300v. Type ST and type SJ are the most common for 600v and 300v respectively.

Q2- the ballast has no enclosure- I plan to bolt it to the 3/4" ply
wall. Do I need to make and use a heat sink ? ie like an aluminium
sheet between the wall and the ballast ?
The 175w I had with a similar setup was untouchably hot,
but never set us on fire in a year.

I would. You don't want it mounted to a highly combustible surface if it's not enclosed. That's also a pretty big personal safety issue not building some sort of enclosure for your ballast as well, but yea, metal sheating definitely.

 

[EvilTwin]

Oldog,
Looks like Madpenguin has you on the right track. The difference between the flexible wire and the stiff wire is that the flexible wire is stranded while the stiff stuff is solid wire conductors.
ET

 

[sparkjumper]

I would use Type SJ cord actually we used to use type SO but I dont know if thats still available.You can get this type cord at home depot.EDIT Also a "sheet metal enclosure" makes a great ballast box.I think 8 by 8 by 4 would do it.If not 12 by 12 by 4 for sure.Get one with knockouts so you can punch them out to ventilate the ballast

 

[foaf]

---------
added after madpenguins post below - sorry I didnt see that he was from lamp to ballast as he mentions, I was thinking wall to ballast.... so the extension cord deal and the marine stranded tinned wire thought that I had posted is incorrect ...sorry... so I deleted it.

 

[madpenguin]

Guys, let me stress that extension cord is not rated for 600v....... If you want to use an extension cord from the primary tap of the ballast to the wall receptacle, go right ahead. The most that wire will see is 240v nominal.

The secondary tap of your ballast cranks out a lot more than 300v.... Thus the reason for type ST, type SC, type SE and type SO (yea spark, it's still available).

Read table 400.4 from the link that I posted. It's really easy to read and understand. If you want a type ST flexible cord to be rated for wet locations, then get type STW.... W=wet... Not to hard to grasp. If you need flexible cord rated for 600v that your going to install in a garage or something, then get type STOO. O=oil resistant. If the garage is going to be wet, then get type STOOW......

But whatever you do, don't cut up an orange extension cord and use it as your lamp wire.

They do sell type SJ at Lowes or Home Depot. It's the black flexible cord that has a premanufactured plug on it but the other end has an inch or two of the conductors sticking out of the outer insulation. I believe that is #16.

All flexible cord is mandated to have markings on it's outer sheath telling you what it's rated for. Extension cord is not flexible cord by definition, therefore your unlikely to see any markings on the outer sheathing , and if you do, I can guarantee it'll say it's rated for 300V.

 

[madpenguin]

Go back to that electrical supply house and get STW for the lamp cord. The SJOOW is fine to the wall receptacle.

If they don't have STW, which I highly doubt, just tell them you need 600v flexible cord rated for wet locations. We deal with water so it's usually a good idea to have a "W" in your cord listing. If you want to be anal, get STOOW #14. #16 will work but then again, so will #14.

 

[oldog]

Thanks ! I took madpenguins advice and went to an electrical supply
house and I told them it was for an aquarium. They gave me ' 14 awg 3/c SJ or SJ00W 300V ' . Didn't have 16 , said 14 was fine.
I am now going to use probably only a 4 ft run from outlet to ballast and 5 ft
ballast to lamp - should that be OK ?

I asked about enclosing the ballast and the counter man said he thought
it wasn't neccesary. I have mounted it on a concrete wall with an 18" x 18"
metal plate behind it to dissipate some heat. The wall fan will be blowing on it.
The enclosure is for what? Avoid electrocution ? also contain any sparks in case of a short etc ? It certainly should be much cooler when its open.
I have all wires made down solid and properly insulated. Maybe I'll make an enclosure if you all come down on me.

 

[madpenguin]

Thanks ! I took madpenguins advice and went to an electrical supply
house and I told them it was for an aquarium. They gave me ' 14 awg 3/c SJ or SJ00W 300V ' . Didn't have 16 , said 14 was fine.
I am now going to use probably only a 4 ft run from outlet to ballast and 5 ft
ballast to lamp - should that be OK ?

From ballast to receptacle, yes. From ballast to lamp no. This is kinda what I was talking about on one of my previous posts on the sticky above. No one listens... So frustrating.

The secondary tap of your ballast cranks out a lot more than 300v.... Thus the reason for type ST, type SC, type SE and type SO (yea spark, it's still available).

Did I not just post that?

Type SJ cord is only rated for 300v and the lamp wire is going to be seeing around 500v or more.

The enclosure is for what? Avoid electrocution ? also contain any sparks in case of a short etc ?

Exactly. Safety man, safety. Don't take it lightly. You brush up against that thing while you have your hand on the concrete wall (that wall is grounded btw) and your in for a big surprise. It'll go in one arm and right out the other and I guarantee it wont feel good.

I've been shocked from arm to arm on 277 and it made my heart race wildly. Felt like I just snorted an entire 8 ball. Remember, our bodies operate purely on electrical impulses. Your heart is regulated by small electrical charges. What do you think is going to happen if a large electrical charge gets anywhere near your heart. Ventricular fibulation is what's going to happen, soon followed by cardiac arrest. Then you can kiss your ass goodbye. The only reason my heart didn't stop was probably because of my age.

 

[oldog]

madpenguin, I was walking home from school when I was about 10 years old
and stopped to watch a man making concrete blocks by hand
with wooden moulds. I leaned on the guy wire supporting a light post
beside him and it must have chafed on one of the high tension wires above,
so it held onto my hand - I tried to use my other hand to pull it
off and it held that one too. The man ripped off his shirt, put it around my waist and pulled me off. Lucky to be alive !
So.. Yes.... big respect to electricity - I will follow your advice.
Thanks lots.