Twisted growth, tears in leafs. Help!

[WickedBaked]

Hi all, I'm on my first ever grow and I've been struggling to keep my plants looking healthy.

Some basic info before I describe the issue:

• 250W(from the wall) DIY LED COBS - about 24in above canopy.
• Temps ~65-82 but usually 70-80
• Coco coir + perlite
• General Hydroponics Trio Nutrients + CalMag
• Using GrowWeedEasy's custom coco/GH schedule http://www.growweedeasy.com/sites/growweedeasy.com/files/coco-coir-flora-series-schedule.pdf
• Tap water pH'ed to 5.8
• G13 Haze, Moonshine's Ghost Train, and Black D.O.G strains
• Topped plants with some LST
• Still in veg on 18/6 light schedule

The G13 Haze is a month older then the other two because it was looking really bad and I was going to rip it out and grow the other two, but I have kept it alive and would like to see it flower! The growth tends to come out twisted and full of holes/tears. I have checked almost every leaf for bugs and have not seen any. I've also taken top soil and examined it under a microscope and found no signs of bugs.

The only thing I can think of is maybe the tap water is too hard? Mine comes out of the tap at about 6.5pH with a ppm of ~150-200. Or the nutrients have gone bad(no crystallization in the bottles) from being in the grow closet/being exposed to light. Or air quality.

Any ideas or suggestions are highly appreciated!

 

[WickedBaked]

 

[Bush Dr]

What's your ventilation and air circulation?

 

[WickedBaked]

What's your ventilation and air circulation?

This is in a small closet(just shy of 2x3 and about 8ft high). I have a 4in hole in the bottom of the door for passive intake and I have two 4in holes near the ceiling with 120mm fans blowing out. The fans move about 160CFM. There is also a small fan hanging inside to provide air circulation.

I do vape nicotine in the room adjacent to the closet. But it's low nicotine and people both claim it doesn't affect them while others say it does. I also have windows open in the room 24/7 so fresh air does make it in the room.

 

[Bush Dr]

Poor ventilation is a the root of it all

Numerous nutrient problems are basically due to lack of fresh air, the plants can't use the nutrients without fresh oxygen

Every leaf needs to be moving so the micro environment around each one is constantly being refreshed ...leave your circulation fans on 24/7 and you'll reduce any mould problems too

 

[WickedBaked]

Poor ventilation is a the root of it all

Numerous nutrient problems are basically due to lack of fresh air, the plants can't use the nutrients without fresh oxygen

Every leaf needs to be moving so the micro environment around each one is constantly being refreshed ...leave your circulation fans on 24/7 and you'll reduce any mould problems too

I switched the fans from timer to 24/7 about a month ago and it did seems to help out, the plants didn't look as droopy.

I have the circulation fan mounted in the upper right part of the closet aimed at the bottom left corner. I just don't have enough floor room in there for plants/containers + fan. When the door is closed it seems to create a good air flow as I can see leaves gently moving.

 

[Phaeton]

Adding up the air in the bud room.
Two 42" ceiling fans.
Two 24" by 2500 CFM intake fans.
Four 16" by 1200 CFM updraft fans.
Three 20" by 1600 CFM horizontal fans.
Lung room is fed and exhausted by one 30" by 7,800 CFM exhaust and one 36" by 12,000 CFM intake.

One of the plants keeps getting too close to the intake and the tears in the leaves are pretty much identical to some of those pictured. Buffeting is the cause here. One of the hard parts of the airflow is getting all the air to move instead of punching tunnels of fast air through the still air.
Recognizing the ragged edges and tears from the leaves along the edges of the high speed air got me to post. I usually overthink my solutions, the fans keep getting larger and slower over the years. Those little fast fans kept causing more turbulence.
I fired up the summer fan last week, 36" diameter and 12,000 CFM pressurizes the entire house with cool air from the shadowed north side.

I suck at nutrition but have lots of fans.

 

[WickedBaked]

Adding up the air in the bud room.
Two 42" ceiling fans.
Two 24" by 2500 CFM intake fans.
Four 16" by 1200 CFM updraft fans.
Three 20" by 1600 CFM horizontal fans.
Lung room is fed and exhausted by one 30" by 7,800 CFM exhaust and one 36" by 12,000 CFM intake.

One of the plants keeps getting too close to the intake and the tears in the leaves are pretty much identical to some of those pictured. Buffeting is the cause here. One of the hard parts of the airflow is getting all the air to move instead of punching tunnels of fast air through the still air.
Recognizing the ragged edges and tears from the leaves along the edges of the high speed air got me to post. I usually overthink my solutions, the fans keep getting larger and slower over the years. Those little fast fans kept causing more turbulence.
I fired up the summer fan last week, 36" diameter and 12,000 CFM pressurizes the entire house with cool air from the shadowed north side.

I suck at nutrition but have lots of fans.

Thanks for the reply!

The fan I have moving air *IS* one of the smaller powerful fans. But the fan is about 4ft above the plants and running on low. I'll try to aim the fan at the wall so it's not directly aimed at the plants

 

[Bush Dr]

Nice one Pheaton ....bang on advice

You can't overdo air circulation

 

[Snook]

fresh air is very important . you haven't told us about the GH 3 part that youre using.. whats the total PPMs from GH3part+200ppms tap water? I don't use GH any longer but I kinda remember there was a mixing procedure ??? bloom, then veg then micro?? but screw up the order and bad things happen...

 

[WickedBaked]

fresh air is very important . you haven't told us about the GH 3 part that youre using.. whats the total PPMs from GH3part+200ppms tap water? I don't use GH any longer but I kinda remember there was a mixing procedure ??? bloom, then veg then micro?? but screw up the order and bad things happen...

I have not measured ppm's in a few weeks, but previously it was about 700-900.

The way I mix the nutes is: FloraMicro, CalMag, FloraGrow, FloraBloom, then some pH down to get the pH in check. While I don't know why; all the GH trio schedules I found say to add FloraMicro first and nothing else about order.

 

[EL1M1N80R]

fresh air is very important . you haven't told us about the GH 3 part that youre using.. whats the total PPMs from GH3part+200ppms tap water? I don't use GH any longer but I kinda remember there was a mixing procedure ??? bloom, then veg then micro?? but screw up the order and bad things happen...

Micro>Grow>Bloom

That is the order on the label.

Give the micro a good 10 to 20 minutes to assimilate properly. And mix well.

 

[EL1M1N80R]

I have not measured ppm's in a few weeks, but previously it was about 700-900.

The way I mix the nutes is: FloraMicro, CalMag, FloraGrow, FloraBloom, then some pH down to get the pH in check.

CalMag first (All suppliments first).

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]http://gh.growgh.com/docs/Feedcharts/GH_FloraSeries-REC_03216am.pdf [/FONT]

When using Silicon, it must be used first then water PH'd under 7, other wise the silicon breaks up (can't remember the technical term) the solution.

Then

Micro>Grow>Bloom


I have a similar problem with holes in the leaves and the "rusty" marks but not to the excess you are experiencing.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=341411

I use GH Flora series too. I would recommend Shogun Silicon to give your plant internal protection and resistance by strengthing cell walls. Made my stalks much thicker that using just GH on it's own.

 

[WickedBaked]

CalMag first (All suppliments first).

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]http://gh.growgh.com/docs/Feedcharts/GH_FloraSeries-REC_03216am.pdf [/FONT]

When using Silicon, it must be used first then water PH'd under 7, other wise the silicon breaks up (can't remember the technical term) the solution.

Then

Micro>Grow>Bloom


I have a similar problem with holes in the leaves and the "rusty" marks but not to the excess you are experiencing.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=341411

I use GH Flora series too. I would recommend Shogun Silicon to give your plant internal protection and resistance by strengthing cell walls. Made my stalks much thicker that using just GH on it's own.

Excellent information! I kinda feel dumb for not picking up on the order in the chart. I'll be mixing calmag, micro, grow, then bloom.

 

[samiam]

How do your roots look? Check for bugs in roots.

 

[EL1M1N80R]

Excellent information! I kinda feel dumb for not picking up on the order in the chart. I'll be mixing calmag, micro, grow, then bloom.

Get yourself some silicon for protection. It is a must have for hydroponics.

 

[WickedBaked]

How do your roots look? Check for bugs in roots.

I'm growing in coco so I'm not sure how the roots look.

I've done a few random samplings of the top layer of coco and looked under a microscope for bugs/eggs and I have not found anything.

Get yourself some silicon for protection. It is a must have for hydroponics.

Even for coco? This is my first time growing and have been trying to keep it stupid simple.

 

[Snook]

Even for coco? This is my first time growing and have been trying to keep it stupid simple.

First grow... I remember the anticipation. GL with it all.
bottom line, if environment is good, no need for extras. If yer struggling, a little sillycone cant hurt...
raises PPMs and PH.. < watch these, a little goes a long way.

 

[EL1M1N80R]

I'm growing in coco so I'm not sure how the roots look.

I've done a few random samplings of the top layer of coco and looked under a microscope for bugs/eggs and I have not found anything.


Even for coco? This is my first time growing and have been trying to keep it stupid simple.

Silicon will help the plant's resistance to bugs, heat stress and root rot. It's more prevention than cure. Silicon is does not provide any kind of nutritional value.

Coco and hydroponics are classed as the same, both soilless inert mediums.

Silicon does raise the PH. The correct way to use it is Silicon goes in first. Add the recommended amount, mix well then PH down to under PH 7. Silicon causes nutrients to separate above PH 7 rendering them useless. Very important to PH to under 7.0. Then add supplements and nutrients as required.

Here is a detailed demonstration by Growell.

http://www.growell.co.uk/blog/2013/12/correctly-incorporating-silicon-into-your-feeds