"The Beatlab" - Next Level Design Discussion: UC RDWC Upgrade / Overrhaul Brainstorm
Hey all,*
well it has been a while since I have been lurking around here, and given the imminent start-up of my next project, I recently came to the conclusion that what better place to dot the I's and cross the T's so to speak, with respect to a meaningful overhaul / upgrade from my current setup....than the collective genius of the giant green think-tank that is ICMAG!!!!*
ANYWAY . . . I'll try and keep it fairly succinct, first why am I here? *What the hell is this thread all about, or what exactly is it intended to do? *Basically, I have a pretty nice "facility" situated in the glorious state of CO that consists of simple 3 gal smart pots, 8x1000W XXXL 8" hoods, and a few other staple pieces of equipement. *Since its not this system's current specs that I am concerned with...I will leave it vague. *I AM concerned with the plans I have begun to draft up for this system's upgrade to the level I truly have always wanted to see it. *
Here is what I plan on doing, and finally I have posed several open ended questions that I really hope will generate some helpful ideas, thoughts, comments, concerns, and suggestions. *So beginning with the "canvas" so to speak, or the blank slate we will be working with. *I have a rectangular room sized at 10'x20'. *Inside this ex-Man Den, as the prior owner had it done up . . .I have swapped out the lazyboy and tv for 8x1000W HPS lights with Magnum 8" XXXL hoods, I ran waterlines from the main house out to the site as even longer ago, this was a single car garage when built in the late 40's. * Using PEX lines and quick connect hose attachments, I ran a line all around the room, with several handle valves in order to easily control, turn on and or limit where water is availabole and when. *looped into the water line using a standar solenoid valve from a local outdoorplumbing shop, I installed a liquid cooled CO2 generator fired off propane.
Next I employed a few far more sparc-knowledgable homies who as usual love to throw a helping hand when it comes to this kinda work. *I am less fluent when it comes to this stuff, but essentially we ran a 3" conduit underground next to the water line and wired in a control box that I believe was rated for maybe 75-100 amps??(I could be totally off but cant recall) anyway regardless . . .the juice is loose up in that bitch for sure. *sockets everywhere one could conceivve and everything is operated by a sentinel EVC4 *...the one with a co2 sniffer,*
With all this in mind, and including the duct system which runs from one end to the other length-wise in two parallel lines, accessing fresh air out one enclosed-ported large window and down to a Y joint where they combine into one and up out the roof. *with air never actually becoming fully exposed to the funk of the room inside (yet the poor seal of air cooled hoods is a concern. *I have one 10" MAXfan in the middle of each line so as to cut down the noise outside since neighbors are not far at all and I dont want to have that issue. *to top it all off, I recently installed a 24000btu Wall mounted split unit AC system, which I must say kicks ass for my needs currently. *
Sorry for the book here but I want to provide as much background info as possible so that others may gain a full idea of what I am working with and whatI am trying to achieve. *Now for the fun part...The plans...
System*- Moving to a 16-site, 8gal UC RDWC system, I will be likely configuring a large (150gal+) reservoir to maintain H2O levels, which also employs the filtration of a 2-stage hydro-logic particulate filtration system to wipe the wonderful CO water absolutely free of all forms of chlorine before use. *Evidently around here an RO system is completely un-necessary and given the waste associated is actually an inefficiency. *Additionally, the whole system will be kept cool via a 1/4HP chiller, which along with the bulk res, and water filter, I am looking for helpful suggestions and ideas for the best means of configuring it all. *
Next, we have the bubbles, the system has a pump capable of putting out 68LPM at 2.1 PSI. *the main module comes with a diffuser membrane but I didnt get the individual airstones for each buck from the guy who sold me everything. I figured that I could easily ereplace them and bump of the oxygen exchange efficiency ratio by using ultra fine diffusers and perhaps cranking up the air pump in use. *for a little extra $$ you can find an ecoair (or somehitng similar) commercially rated airpump with up to 200 LPM for under 150-200. *the pump for the water circulation of everything in the system is a mag-drive 950GPH unit. *
Lights - plan is to Move from 8-horizontal 1000-watt overheads, to a staggered pattern with fewer overhead lights and a few additional vertical hanging lights for added side lighting for the best penetration. *Also, I am considering a switch to Dual-Arc bulbs for the ideal spectrum. *
So taking everything into consideration that I just spewed .. . *.allow me to pose a few quick concerns and questions and then I can only hope that a few of you have got the gears turning upstairs, and get as excited as I do about the shit and are willing to provide some input / help
1. *Plumbing? *space constraints leave me pondering an outside home for the bulk res, but essentially I am just unsure aboute what the best configuration will be for all of the above itemas to operate in seamless harmony with not too much wasted space. *
2. Biggeer = Better Cept for Bubbles???? on the topic of maxing oout my DO levells in the solution, I would love to hear anyones tthoughts on perhaps some alternativee methods of enriching with additional DO, such as Hyddrogen peeroxiide, or maybe even some seriously crafty metthod of employing a powerful Ozone ggenerator in some fashion similar to thhe water purification applications. I understand that O3 readily dissolvves in H2O far more easily than O2 does, however the halflife of the actual O3 molecules is tiny,, like minutes even.. Once broken down back to straight OO2 + aan additional individual O atom...which essentiially is the essence of "dissolved Oxygen" in your solution. While this seemingly makes really interesting and great sense...the main concern and hurrdle I cconcceptually ran into (since I have nnever tried anything like this,, completely theoreetiically in my minnd) is the fact that the mmain use of enriching water with O3 iis for really effective sterilization / Purification techniques. May sound great, however that means yyou dont really understand the whole concept of the RDWC systems and the rreason for their general Head-crashing, asswhoopin, Growth acceleratin,Moster tree makin abilities. The whole rant about DO enrichment is not because roots actually utilize O2 much in thee way like green leaaves use CO2, which they do, its so that your plants wind up sitting in a bucket that mirrors something to the iidea of the Ritz Carlton for Micro-Beastlies, the more aerobic (oxygen enriiched) your rootzones are...the more siignificant of a colony of beni-bactterial and al those other tiny critters we cant ssee but who are said to make your roots abilityy to uptake nutrients much mucch faster and more efficiently will be..
So sorry for the tangent on DO, buut it seems like the critical element.. That ssaid, I am also conssidering simply stepping up the Airpump power ssignificantly, while investing in reallly high qualiity "Ultra Fine Bubble Disk Membrane Air Diffusers" forr each bucket instead of the lamee ass aair stones you put in a fissh tank. iidea being smaller bubbles = more efficient ooxygen transfeer efficciency as smaller bubbles,, in greater numbers = more surface area for O2 & water to pass transfer oxygen!! BRILLIANT!! Anyone ssee why a larger pump may be a not veryy good idea? Aside from cost /bbenefit I dont kknow why it wouldnt hhelp
Lastly along thhe same liness of beefiing up the system's abiliities, the 95GPH Mag-Driver pumpp...ccould be easily swaped out for a 1350 or greeater model and the only downside I can think of would be morre heat...any thoughts???
3. *Cooling capacity? *1/4HP??? *Is this adequate?? *given the AC and light details am I going to wind up looking for a 1/2-1.0HP unit witin the first week of real heat??? *rather know now for sure!*
4. *Light configuration? *I have not experimented with either vertical lighting, or dual arc bulbs. *What might an efficient pattern be for 2 rows of big girls 8 plants or so long equally spaced across the 10 foot width of the room? *wattage for the vertical hangers? *any consideration to a few T-5 4-buld fixtures hanging on the walls for even greater side lighting either instead of the vertical or much more likely, IN ADDITION to??? *
5. *Finally . . . .What other ideas do people have that they would love to see employed and operated in a detailed ICmag journal kept on the initial set-up and operation of this (hopefully) fucking beast of a set-up, yea I know I have seen shit here that makes this look like a little-tykes play set-up, but for what I have space for, and my intentions . . .(simply growing for the love of it) full time job pays the bills...not hydro. *
Thanks so much everyone, hope that yall get some stoke outta this, because I am fired up and cant wait t get it all rolling so I can watch them take off!
peace
Z * * **
Hey all,*
well it has been a while since I have been lurking around here, and given the imminent start-up of my next project, I recently came to the conclusion that what better place to dot the I's and cross the T's so to speak, with respect to a meaningful overhaul / upgrade from my current setup....than the collective genius of the giant green think-tank that is ICMAG!!!!*
ANYWAY . . . I'll try and keep it fairly succinct, first why am I here? *What the hell is this thread all about, or what exactly is it intended to do? *Basically, I have a pretty nice "facility" situated in the glorious state of CO that consists of simple 3 gal smart pots, 8x1000W XXXL 8" hoods, and a few other staple pieces of equipement. *Since its not this system's current specs that I am concerned with...I will leave it vague. *I AM concerned with the plans I have begun to draft up for this system's upgrade to the level I truly have always wanted to see it. *
Here is what I plan on doing, and finally I have posed several open ended questions that I really hope will generate some helpful ideas, thoughts, comments, concerns, and suggestions. *So beginning with the "canvas" so to speak, or the blank slate we will be working with. *I have a rectangular room sized at 10'x20'. *Inside this ex-Man Den, as the prior owner had it done up . . .I have swapped out the lazyboy and tv for 8x1000W HPS lights with Magnum 8" XXXL hoods, I ran waterlines from the main house out to the site as even longer ago, this was a single car garage when built in the late 40's. * Using PEX lines and quick connect hose attachments, I ran a line all around the room, with several handle valves in order to easily control, turn on and or limit where water is availabole and when. *looped into the water line using a standar solenoid valve from a local outdoorplumbing shop, I installed a liquid cooled CO2 generator fired off propane.
Next I employed a few far more sparc-knowledgable homies who as usual love to throw a helping hand when it comes to this kinda work. *I am less fluent when it comes to this stuff, but essentially we ran a 3" conduit underground next to the water line and wired in a control box that I believe was rated for maybe 75-100 amps??(I could be totally off but cant recall) anyway regardless . . .the juice is loose up in that bitch for sure. *sockets everywhere one could conceivve and everything is operated by a sentinel EVC4 *...the one with a co2 sniffer,*
With all this in mind, and including the duct system which runs from one end to the other length-wise in two parallel lines, accessing fresh air out one enclosed-ported large window and down to a Y joint where they combine into one and up out the roof. *with air never actually becoming fully exposed to the funk of the room inside (yet the poor seal of air cooled hoods is a concern. *I have one 10" MAXfan in the middle of each line so as to cut down the noise outside since neighbors are not far at all and I dont want to have that issue. *to top it all off, I recently installed a 24000btu Wall mounted split unit AC system, which I must say kicks ass for my needs currently. *
Sorry for the book here but I want to provide as much background info as possible so that others may gain a full idea of what I am working with and whatI am trying to achieve. *Now for the fun part...The plans...
System*- Moving to a 16-site, 8gal UC RDWC system, I will be likely configuring a large (150gal+) reservoir to maintain H2O levels, which also employs the filtration of a 2-stage hydro-logic particulate filtration system to wipe the wonderful CO water absolutely free of all forms of chlorine before use. *Evidently around here an RO system is completely un-necessary and given the waste associated is actually an inefficiency. *Additionally, the whole system will be kept cool via a 1/4HP chiller, which along with the bulk res, and water filter, I am looking for helpful suggestions and ideas for the best means of configuring it all. *
Next, we have the bubbles, the system has a pump capable of putting out 68LPM at 2.1 PSI. *the main module comes with a diffuser membrane but I didnt get the individual airstones for each buck from the guy who sold me everything. I figured that I could easily ereplace them and bump of the oxygen exchange efficiency ratio by using ultra fine diffusers and perhaps cranking up the air pump in use. *for a little extra $$ you can find an ecoair (or somehitng similar) commercially rated airpump with up to 200 LPM for under 150-200. *the pump for the water circulation of everything in the system is a mag-drive 950GPH unit. *
Lights - plan is to Move from 8-horizontal 1000-watt overheads, to a staggered pattern with fewer overhead lights and a few additional vertical hanging lights for added side lighting for the best penetration. *Also, I am considering a switch to Dual-Arc bulbs for the ideal spectrum. *
So taking everything into consideration that I just spewed .. . *.allow me to pose a few quick concerns and questions and then I can only hope that a few of you have got the gears turning upstairs, and get as excited as I do about the shit and are willing to provide some input / help
1. *Plumbing? *space constraints leave me pondering an outside home for the bulk res, but essentially I am just unsure aboute what the best configuration will be for all of the above itemas to operate in seamless harmony with not too much wasted space. *
2. Biggeer = Better Cept for Bubbles???? on the topic of maxing oout my DO levells in the solution, I would love to hear anyones tthoughts on perhaps some alternativee methods of enriching with additional DO, such as Hyddrogen peeroxiide, or maybe even some seriously crafty metthod of employing a powerful Ozone ggenerator in some fashion similar to thhe water purification applications. I understand that O3 readily dissolvves in H2O far more easily than O2 does, however the halflife of the actual O3 molecules is tiny,, like minutes even.. Once broken down back to straight OO2 + aan additional individual O atom...which essentiially is the essence of "dissolved Oxygen" in your solution. While this seemingly makes really interesting and great sense...the main concern and hurrdle I cconcceptually ran into (since I have nnever tried anything like this,, completely theoreetiically in my minnd) is the fact that the mmain use of enriching water with O3 iis for really effective sterilization / Purification techniques. May sound great, however that means yyou dont really understand the whole concept of the RDWC systems and the rreason for their general Head-crashing, asswhoopin, Growth acceleratin,Moster tree makin abilities. The whole rant about DO enrichment is not because roots actually utilize O2 much in thee way like green leaaves use CO2, which they do, its so that your plants wind up sitting in a bucket that mirrors something to the iidea of the Ritz Carlton for Micro-Beastlies, the more aerobic (oxygen enriiched) your rootzones are...the more siignificant of a colony of beni-bactterial and al those other tiny critters we cant ssee but who are said to make your roots abilityy to uptake nutrients much mucch faster and more efficiently will be..
So sorry for the tangent on DO, buut it seems like the critical element.. That ssaid, I am also conssidering simply stepping up the Airpump power ssignificantly, while investing in reallly high qualiity "Ultra Fine Bubble Disk Membrane Air Diffusers" forr each bucket instead of the lamee ass aair stones you put in a fissh tank. iidea being smaller bubbles = more efficient ooxygen transfeer efficciency as smaller bubbles,, in greater numbers = more surface area for O2 & water to pass transfer oxygen!! BRILLIANT!! Anyone ssee why a larger pump may be a not veryy good idea? Aside from cost /bbenefit I dont kknow why it wouldnt hhelp
Lastly along thhe same liness of beefiing up the system's abiliities, the 95GPH Mag-Driver pumpp...ccould be easily swaped out for a 1350 or greeater model and the only downside I can think of would be morre heat...any thoughts???
3. *Cooling capacity? *1/4HP??? *Is this adequate?? *given the AC and light details am I going to wind up looking for a 1/2-1.0HP unit witin the first week of real heat??? *rather know now for sure!*
4. *Light configuration? *I have not experimented with either vertical lighting, or dual arc bulbs. *What might an efficient pattern be for 2 rows of big girls 8 plants or so long equally spaced across the 10 foot width of the room? *wattage for the vertical hangers? *any consideration to a few T-5 4-buld fixtures hanging on the walls for even greater side lighting either instead of the vertical or much more likely, IN ADDITION to??? *
5. *Finally . . . .What other ideas do people have that they would love to see employed and operated in a detailed ICmag journal kept on the initial set-up and operation of this (hopefully) fucking beast of a set-up, yea I know I have seen shit here that makes this look like a little-tykes play set-up, but for what I have space for, and my intentions . . .(simply growing for the love of it) full time job pays the bills...not hydro. *
Thanks so much everyone, hope that yall get some stoke outta this, because I am fired up and cant wait t get it all rolling so I can watch them take off!
peace
Z * * **
