Tea Article

[Sourbear]

What do you have in your yard? Google it all.
I'd skip the nutes in the tea. I use them alternately and then only about half strength. Took me awhile to learn that less is more regardless of how often it is repeated here. I get most everything I need from the tea. The nutes are only for insurance of a well rounded diet and to add some P&K in the end. As my tea improves, I use less and less. Most of it comes from compost in different states of decomposition, some aerobically, some anaerobic, plant material, char from different plant materials, some wood ash depending on what I'm burning. Termite infested stuff, ant hill dirt. Mostly stuff off the property. Oats, brown rice, molasses,stuff off the shelf. Alfalfa, stuff from the feed store. Horse shit. Small amounts of manure, chicken shit.Bird shit. Eye of nute. Witches brew. Get crazy. Remember though, Google is your friend. Not really, but use it along with your imagination, a couple of totes, and you might not ever go to the store again. You'll become a recluse and a bitter old man, but that's getting off subject. I'll let you know when the biography is out.

Ok cool, the reason I am adding the nute mix to my teas is because I was just adding water to my plants to see how long a certain soil would hold over for, my earth juice amazon bloom soil help over the plants for.... 2 weeks of veg and 3 n a half weeks of flower, now they are starting early flower yellowing cause of no nutes left in the soil. Even then the nutes i dump into my teas are VERY light, I go about 1/4th of the recommended dose.

I have access to pretty much any type of manure possible....
Brother owns a ranch and grows himself... fucking baseball nugs....
anyways he has horse/chicken and lots of other crap on hand for me. Would I just toss that right into my tea?

Also... for around me... I live in thick redwood/pines with lots of like red clay mudd type ground, LOTS OF PINE NEEDLES, I was wondering instead of burning these pine needles like I do each year should I compost them along with all the other dead leafs in my yard?
Would that compost work in a tea?

big bear what source of castings are you using?
one way to save cash would be to ditch the bottles.

I am using some castings from the "Earthworm Casting Company"
I compared it to my friends Roots Organics EWC and they looked pretty much the same quality.

I would ditch the bottles but you get a good amount of samples from General Organics for like 20 bucks, and I needed it to cure my mid flowering nute problem.

Humic acids can be a good addition. It's a little more expensive, but the LC-10+7 is already chelated with minerals and I think you could ditch a lot of the other bottled products in lieu of ACT, seaweed, and optionally the LC-10+7. I've gotten really good feedback on it from a few different people on here, as well as my own success using it on my container vegetables and houseplants. Here's the link to the pdf. http://www.simplici-tea.com/images/LC-10Plus7Label.pdf

FYI, if you just want the seaweed, KIS can fit up to 3 lbs. in a flat rate envelope with USPS for 5.80 S/H. Keep in mind that you're looking at rates around 1/2 tsp./gal. of water, so a little goes a long way. There's approx. 2.5 cups in a lb.


Hope that helps!

Ah! Humic Acids thats what I was forgetting
So If I where to purchase some Humic Acid's the LC-10+7 line would be what I would go for?

Thanks for the news on KIS, seems like a really solid deal.

 

[CT Guy]

Ok cool, the reason I am adding the nute mix to my teas is because I was just adding water to my plants to see how long a certain soil would hold over for, my earth juice amazon bloom soil help over the plants for.... 2 weeks of veg and 3 n a half weeks of flower, now they are starting early flower yellowing cause of no nutes left in the soil. Even then the nutes i dump into my teas are VERY light, I go about 1/4th of the recommended dose.

I have access to pretty much any type of manure possible....
Brother owns a ranch and grows himself... fucking baseball nugs....
anyways he has horse/chicken and lots of other crap on hand for me. Would I just toss that right into my tea?

Also... for around me... I live in thick redwood/pines with lots of like red clay mudd type ground, LOTS OF PINE NEEDLES, I was wondering instead of burning these pine needles like I do each year should I compost them along with all the other dead leafs in my yard?
Would that compost work in a tea?





I am using some castings from the "Earthworm Casting Company"
I compared it to my friends Roots Organics EWC and they looked pretty much the same quality.

I would ditch the bottles but you get a good amount of samples from General Organics for like 20 bucks, and I needed it to cure my mid flowering nute problem.





Ah! Humic Acids thats what I was forgetting
So If I where to purchase some Humic Acid's the LC-10+7 line would be what I would go for?

Thanks for the news on KIS, seems like a really solid deal.

http://www.simplici-tea.com/humic_acid.htm

It's a little more expensive to ship because it's a liquid and needs more packing. Just give them a call or email through the website if you have further questions about the product.

Humic acids are excellent, though I think they're microbial benefits may be over-exaggerated. I think they have other plant benefits though, especially in regards to chelation that may prove highly beneficial.

 

[Sourbear]

http://www.simplici-tea.com/humic_acid.htm

It's a little more expensive to ship because it's a liquid and needs more packing. Just give them a call or email through the website if you have further questions about the product.

Humic acids are excellent, though I think they're microbial benefits may be over-exaggerated. I think they have other plant benefits though, especially in regards to chelation that may prove highly beneficial.

Thanks again, And I might try some of this stuff too once I get some more money

Basically I'm doing comparisons and trial/error procedures.
And by doing so I'm also doing LOTS of comparisons, When doing a 4x4 bed of 40 or so plants in 1 gallon pots its easy to compare.


the first being Great White Michrozhite stuff that you pour into water or put into a pot just before transplant. It like attaches new fungal roots to existing roots so that nutes can be absorbed/different better. And so far the plants that got the great white have faster growth than the ones without.

I will have to do the same when doing my teas, I will feed a certain row of plants with the seaweed extract tea, and another row with the humic acid, just see what it does to the plants.


If one thing I've learned so far in growing... just try it and see what it does, don't go of what some 1 else did/said. Just gotta see it for yourself.

 

[CT Guy]

Thanks again, And I might try some of this stuff too once I get some more money

Basically I'm doing comparisons and trial/error procedures.
And by doing so I'm also doing LOTS of comparisons, When doing a 4x4 bed of 40 or so plants in 1 gallon pots its easy to compare.


the first being Great White Michrozhite stuff that you pour into water or put into a pot just before transplant. It like attaches new fungal roots to existing roots so that nutes can be absorbed/different better. And so far the plants that got the great white have faster growth than the ones without.

I will have to do the same when doing my teas, I will feed a certain row of plants with the seaweed extract tea, and another row with the humic acid, just see what it does to the plants.


If one thing I've learned so far in growing... just try it and see what it does, don't go of what some 1 else did/said. Just gotta see it for yourself.

You could source the equivalent of the Great White product locally much cheaper I'm guessing. Where are you at in the country? All you need is a good endo-mycorrhizal product, preferably without trichderma.

 

[Sourbear]

I'm from Northern California

 

[jaykush]

then everything you need is not far, no matter which way you want to grow.

 

[Clackamas Coot]

Humic acids are excellent, though I think they're microbial benefits may be over-exaggerated. I think they have other plant benefits though, especially in regards to chelation that may prove highly beneficial.

I think that's true as well. From my reading and study of humic and fulvic acids, their role has far more to do with CeC, loosening compacted clay soils by removing the positive charge that forms on the negative-charged clay particles. Salts can form a positive charge on the edges of the clay particles thereby causing the clay to bind together. Humic acids (specifically) will remove the salts thereby removing the positive charge and now the clay particles carry a negative charge (like humic & fulvic acids) so that they repel each other = loose(r) soils.

And in the case of the fulvic acid role, it's completely different than the function of humic acids.

Then again I may not have read enough or misread what I have read and studied.

CC

 

[h.h.]

Ok cool, the reason I am adding the nute mix to my teas is because I was just adding water to my plants to see how long a certain soil would hold over for, my earth juice amazon bloom soil help over the plants for.... 2 weeks of veg and 3 n a half weeks of flower, now they are starting early flower yellowing cause of no nutes left in the soil. Even then the nutes i dump into my teas are VERY light, I go about 1/4th of the recommended dose.

I have access to pretty much any type of manure possible....
Brother owns a ranch and grows himself... fucking baseball nugs....
anyways he has horse/chicken and lots of other crap on hand for me. Would I just toss that right into my tea?

Also... for around me... I live in thick redwood/pines with lots of like red clay mudd type ground, LOTS OF PINE NEEDLES, I was wondering instead of burning these pine needles like I do each year should I compost them along with all the other dead leafs in my yard?
Would that compost work in a tea?





I am using some castings from the "Earthworm Casting Company"
I compared it to my friends Roots Organics EWC and they looked pretty much the same quality.

I would ditch the bottles but you get a good amount of samples from General Organics for like 20 bucks, and I needed it to cure my mid flowering nute problem.





Ah! Humic Acids thats what I was forgetting
So If I where to purchase some Humic Acid's the LC-10+7 line would be what I would go for?

Thanks for the news on KIS, seems like a really solid deal.

I haven't had experience with composted pine needles. I believe they contain turpentine and some say they contaminate the soil. Then I read where some use pine in their soil mix. They add acidity.
What I read says they work in the compost, but you need to chop them up due to the waxy coating, or they are slow to decompose. In decomposition, they are acidic. Partially decomposed they should lower the ph of a tea. Burnt, I would think would raise it. I would probably mix them, probably unchopped cause I'm lazy, with their ash in the compost. I would also try to halfway char some to release any volatile gas and break down the coating. Not sure how good that is for air quality though.
Dig down in the old needles in the forest and collect some of the fungi. Oaks, I understand, are good for this.
The chicken poop, I'd would use sparingly, if I needed nitrogen. I can't tell you how much. I'd go after the horse poop though. Often people have a place on their property where they dump it and it's had a chance to age and compost. Make sure they haven't put lime on it though.

 

[CT Guy]

I'm from Northern California

Well then you're not far from Grant's Pass, OR, where 90% of the mycorrhizal products in the country are produced anyway. You should be able to find something locally, but if not....

Thanks goes to CC for a product from Bioag.com. It's a VAM (mycorrhizae) product that contains only endo spores and no trichoderma, and it's fairly cheap. Check it out.

http://bioag.com/oregonorderpage.html

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

Well then you're not far from Grant's Pass, OR, where 90% of the mycorrhizal products in the country are produced anyway. You should be able to find something locally, but if not....

Thanks goes to CC for a product from Bioag.com. It's a VAM (mycorrhizae) product that contains only endo spores and no trichoderma, and it's fairly cheap. Check it out.

http://bioag.com/oregonorderpage.html

white widow from humboldt nutes.
rooters myco from earth juice.
plant success granular myco (not great white)
all easy to find in cali. all endomyco (no tricho)

 

[Madrus Rose]

I think that's true as well. From my reading and study of humic and fulvic acids, their role has far more to do with CeC, loosening compacted clay soils by removing the positive charge that forms on the negative-charged clay particles. Salts can form a positive charge on the edges of the clay particles thereby causing the clay to bind together. Humic acids (specifically) will remove the salts thereby removing the positive charge and now the clay particles carry a negative charge (like humic & fulvic acids) so that they repel each other = loose(r) soils.

And in the case of the fulvic acid role, it's completely different than the function of humic acids.

Then again I may not have read enough or misread what I have read and studied.

CC

Just bought some leonardite based humate from local nursery , just came upon this website agressively denouncing lignite/coal with cited links while making enormous claims for their products of Humics & fulvics....their product called "humisolve" & WuJinSan Fulvics

whats your take if u have time :
http://www.humate.net/


best regards

ஜ۩۞۩ஜ mrose ஜ۩۞۩ஜ

Edit: just ran a search & found your link to bioag.com & hope to find their listd dealers may still carry their products ...

 

[Clackamas Coot]

Just bought some leonardite based humate from local nursery , just came upon this website agressively denouncing lignite/coal with cited links while making enormous claims for their products of Humics & fulvics....their product called "humisolve" & WuJinSan Fulvics

whats your take if u have time :
http://www.humate.net/


best regards

ஜ۩۞۩ஜ mrose ஜ۩۞۩ஜ

Edit: just ran a search & found your link to bioag.com & hope to find their listd dealers may still carry their products ...

Interesting web site and I'm more than a little bit confused. The web site is located in Independence, Oregon - where BioAg is located.

All of the products mentioned in the links are to BioAg's product lines and in particular their HumiSolveUSA humic and fulvic acid products.

You can order direct from BioAg.com and the pricing includes S&H so there's no hidden costs involved. I use the HumiSolveUSA, their liquid golden fulvic acid (both for my plants as well taking it myself), their TM-7 product (chelated minerals in a humic and fulvic acid base - powder form) and their VAM product which is 8 endo strains with no ecto or trichoderma spores.

On the subject of the Mycorrhizal Applications out of Grants Pass, Oregon. These guys have a fairly robust product line most of which is not generally available to the public.

One of those mixes includes both endo and ecto strains as well as trichoderma spores. This is the main mix that is used by commercial nurseries because it's a 'one stop one shop' product meaning that when they add it to their soil bases the mycorrhizal spores are available for any number of plant types - annuals, conifers, flowers, etc.

It's this specific product that is purchased by companies like Advanced Nutrients, Roots (Aqua Serene), et al. and the price races from $10.00 per lb. up to $185.00 per lb. in the case of Advanced Nutrients.

Delusional.

For the straight endo mycorrhizal product from Mycorrhizal Applications it's available in 2 forms - granulated and micronized. The granulated product costs $10.00 per lb. and the micronized runs $16.00 per lb. This is the exact same product offered by Fungi Perfecti and others.

For the pricing that I noted you can contact Concentrates, Inc. in Portland, Oregon and they can provide you with mail order service. This is NOT a grow store but rather an organic farm supply store.

Having said that I feel that the BioAg VAM is a superior product because the spores are contained in a humic and fulvic acid base (powder) and includes the 7 chelated minerals that are important for plant health. The link will provide you with the specific minerals as well as the specific endo strains contained in this product.

HTH

CC

 

[Madrus Rose]

You can order direct from BioAg.com and the pricing includes S&H so there's no hidden costs involved. I use the HumiSolveUSA, their liquid golden fulvic acid (both for my plants as well taking it myself), their TM-7 product (chelated minerals in a humic and fulvic acid base - powder form) and their VAM product which is 8 endo strains with no ecto or trichoderma spores.

Excellent CC , thanks for reply ..

ஜ۩۞۩ஜmroseஜ۩۞۩ஜ

 

[Microbeman]

Hey Coot, thanks for putting up the info about endomycorrhizal spores from straight shooters. It is upsetting (to me) to see mycorrhizal being turned into a cash pig and potentially turning people off of it's true benefits. It is disgusting to me that companies like Myc Applications and Fungi Perfecti seem to have gone down that path.....Advanced Nutrients...well they have always been there.

Nice points on humic acid. All the hype about it being a microbial (fungal) food is pretty much bullshit. The nifty thing about having a good microscope and an IQ over 90 is that no matter how many journal articles support something, one can look down a microscope tube and blow away a lot of 'stated truths' in an instant.....no peer review required because you cannot dispute a negative observation.

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

...no peer review required because you cannot dispute a negative observation.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn10615-your-eyes-can-deceive-you-dont-trust-them.html

In Star Wars, Obi-Wan Kenobi was on the right track in his advice to the young Luke Skywalker. People are fooled by magic tricks, even if their eyes see past the illusion, a new study reveals.

The tricks work by distorting our perception, even though they do not fool our eyes, the research shows. The study demonstrates that the brain pathways for eye movement and perception operate independently, the researchers say...

 

[Microbeman]

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn10615-your-eyes-can-deceive-you-dont-trust-them.html

Obviously you've never used a microscope to observe soil microbes or you would not have posted that. Fungal hyphae is very easy to see and if it ain't there...it ain't there. It is like someone telling you there is an elephant in your backyard and you can clearly see there is not one. Why would you want to waste my time looking at your link when you do not know what you are 'trying to talk about'?

 

[Clackamas Coot]

MM

A couple of quick questions.........

I started using the BioAg VAM product (chelated minerals, humic & fulvic acids & endo strains) by adding it to a rooting gel (like Clonex, Olivia's, blah, blah, blah - it's all the same sh*t, i.e IAA and INA acids as in 'big deal)

My thinking was that by having these specific endo strains in the rooting gel it would help to provide the earliest inoculation possible, i.e. as soon as the root 'nubs' form.

Any thoughts?

Another question about AACT in general - the removal of chlorine and chloramine has been discussed and studied - fair enough. What about flouride? Is that an issue at all?

Thanks for any help!

CC

 

[Sourbear]

Ok woa woa woa!!!!!!
INFORMATION OVERLOAD lol....
lets keep this simple for just a second!
Currently I am mixing general organics organic nutes into my simple mix of EWC/Molasses
Now thats not really mixing a true tea.
What simple ingredients do you think i would need to mix into my tea to hold my plants over for their flowering period.
I am rooting clones and vegging little to no time, all in 1 gallon pots.
I am using Earth juice amazon bloom soil with chunky perlite

So to give the plants the nutrients that they need for their short lives mainly in flower
What should I be putting in my teas?

Seaweed
Humic/Fulvic Acids?

To many rabbit trails before =/

 

[Microbeman]

Obviously you've never used a microscope to observe soil microbes or you would not have posted that. Fungal hyphae is very easy to see and if it ain't there...it ain't there. It is like someone telling you there is an elephant in your backyard and you can clearly see there is not one. Why would you want to waste my time looking at your link when you do not know what you are 'trying to talk about'?

Thom; I am sorry for my comment if you were only joking. Next joke try more than just a link.

 

[Microbeman]

My thinking was that by having these specific endo strains in the rooting gel it would help to provide the earliest inoculation possible, i.e. as soon as the root 'nubs' form

Coot; This is what I do and have been advising; it makes the most sense.

Flouride; A good question I cannot answer.