Spotty, yellow, lil brownish, curling

[curbiechris]

In another post in the Infirmary, it came to conclusion the curling was due to over nuting.

i reduced the nutes accordingly.

but

well theyre still curled, and now getting spotty.

 

[curbiechris]

ps.
DWC system
Floranova, liquid karma, hydroguard, cal-mag, hydrozyme...
300 ppm of nutes + 100 of the supplements
PH - 6.6 last night, but i fixed it this morning to 5.8
Room temp - 75-85... since last time.. its been @ 75
humidity 50%

 

[Brother_Monk]

are those the first leaves? Can you get a shot of the whole plant? If it's the cots, i wouldn't worry too much. If the problem starts to go up the plant, then you need to pay attention. Maybe you should bump up the nutes a little...hard to tell without a shot of the whole plant.

Peace
BM

 

[curbiechris]

yeah those are the first "true leaves"

heres a shot of the whole plant.




its the one to the far upper right

 

[curbiechris]

its not the cots...
and
i think upping the nutes caused the problem... well the curling. the spotting now. i dont know.

Close up

 

[curbiechris]

Now it seems my big fan leaves (??) are getting affected

 

[breeder]

try and keep your PH abit more stable around 5.8 for alittle while. i'm thinking this is your issue.
Good Luck

 

[Brother_Monk]

Ok, let me ask you....how did you germinate those seeds? Rapid rooters, rockwool, peat pucks? If this started when you upped the ferts, maybe you should backtrack. 400 ppm dosen't seem like a lot, but some strains are picky.

If you are using tap water, your Ph will naturally want to stabilise, that may be why it keeps rising. Those plants are too small to be absorbing that much food in a 24hr period.(5.8-6.6) I've seen that with MUCH larger plants, but never ones so small.

Also, in my experience, and I'm sure I'll get for this, but organic nutes don't work well in those bubblers. I bought that expensive ass floranova all in one, and had a buncha problems. Mostly calcium, magnesium, and potassium related during flowering. (I bought the flowering formula also) The ppm's never registered right either.

You are using the exact same setup I'm using. Almost down to the exact additives. Floranova worked great for me in soil, I just thought it was not worth the effort, to get it dialed in after spending 60 bucks on a gallon of that shit. Shake your bottle...do you hear anything rattling in there? Undissolved salts is what you hear. Old...sat on the shelf bullshit.

I switched to lucas formula and haven't looked back. Way more forgiving IMO. Anyone else using FloraNova? I'm sure someone else will chime in about this.

Wish I could lock it down to one thing for ya. Like breeder said, keep an eye on your ph. Change the rez again...wait a few days...see what happens. You rinsed the bucket well after you scrubbed them right? Got them airstones bubblin' yet? Rinsed off all the dust from your hydroton?

Peace
BM

 

[Truth]

it is a PH issue, twisted leafs confirm this. fix it. you don't even need to give them nutrients right now, and if you do, you only give 1/8-1/16 of the recommended dosage for seedlings. two plants in one pot is also a no no. separate them now, or you will have problems later...they will over grow each other and it will be harder to separate them root wise.

 

[curbiechris]

i'm using RO water.
and, they are not taking in all that much nutes.
with the saying
if PH goes up then PPM goes down.
the PPM stays the same
im using rockwool
i had some nutes in the rockwool when i germed. very small amount.
i did rinse the the hydroton.
airstones are running.
i have not rinsed out the buckets yet. i did when i bought them of course (if thats what your asking) but
im going to flush again, and readjust the PH (if need be). i adjusted each bucket individually yesterday. but im sure they went up again.
and then scrub the buckets again..

uggh

those spots are whats really messing with me.
it has gotten worse now.
ph is at 6.4


ps.
i figured two plants in one pot wouldnt be such a good idea. but, this is my first grow and i'm trying to up my odds on females. guess that was a bad idea. but, its my first go...

 

[curbiechris]

maybe i should pull the weaker one? since it is a bad idea to keep two in one bucket?

 

[curbiechris]

when should i give nutes?

 

[curbiechris]

ok, i finally got around to cleaning the buckets.
ive been super busy. was suppose to do this a few days ago
anyways,
i found lot of hydroton sediment at the bottom
could this been the cause of the increase in PH?

well if not.
buckets are cleaned
i uprooted plants 1 and 4. now there's only one plant per bucket. (4 was the one twisting and spotting)...

if PH problems persist. i guess ill have to find another solution.
thanks for all the help.
and
chime in if you have any advice, comments, ect.
thanks again
curbs

 

[Brother_Monk]

RO water is ok, if you know what you are doing. Seasoned growers still have problems with it. Once filtered, the water has no buffering capacity of it's own. Not only that, you take all the beneficial micro nutrients and heavy metals out. I know the floranova has some buffering action to it, but for me, when I used my RO unit for growing, it always wanted to level out around 7.0 ph, no matter what I added to the mix. Someone once asked me...why take out all the beneficials micro nuttrients, calcium, magnesium, just to turn right around and add them back in with your suppliments? Now I use tap water exclusively. It comes out of the tap at 7.0, 240ppm. Just let it set out for a day or two to evaporate the chlorine, and it's good to go.

When you refill your buckets, do NOT let the rockwool, set too close to the waterline. Set the cube at least a few inches above. Damp rockwool in dark places spell disaster for root systems.

Mix your nutrients into the water immediately after refilling the buckets. You want it so they will have it as soon as the roots go looking for it. You may have to hand water over the hydroton for a couple days...but just a small ammount because you dont want to soak the rockwool. It would be best if the existing root system went back in undamaged, and as close to the water as possible, without letting the rockwool get too close to the water...as stated above.

If your Ph problem persists, test your tap water. If the Ph is below 8 and your ppm's are below 400-450, I suggest using it.

Once they are big enough, take some clones from each one, and label them, before you put the donors into flower. Hope you get a nice female!

Peace
BM

 

[curbiechris]

thanks for the info brother

but

see, i have a reservoir next to my controller bucket, filled with the same tea as in the controller bucket. and i test that every once and awhile and the PH level NEVER rises.

another thing, ill test the controller bucket PH and it'll be at where i want it to be (5.8), it doesn't rise.
but only within the buckets the PH rises.

someone suggested algae. now. i just cleaned out the buckets thoroughly. didnt find any algae. but maybe i dont know what im looking for. so....

but now everything is light-tight.

so ive perplexed. the only the thing i can think of... is the excessive amount of hydroton dust at the bottom of my buckets that i just recently cleaned out...

i washed the hydroton thoroughly before putting them in... but i guess not enough.

would that cause the PH to go 1.0 in a day?

 

[Brother_Monk]

so ive perplexed. the only the thing i can think of... is the excessive amount of hydroton dust at the bottom of my buckets that i just recently cleaned out...

i washed the hydroton thoroughly before putting them in... but i guess not enough.

would that cause the PH to go 1.0 in a day?

Not that I'm aware of. I mentioned it because it has a habit of gumming up the plumbing. Expanded clay pebbles and the dust, is inert.

 

[curbiechris]

ok, just out of curiousity i went and tested the PH in the buckets 2 minutes ago

now take in account, 4 hours ago i flushed, cleaned the buckets, and readjusted the PH to 5.8

now the PH in the buckets are @ 6.4

......

i guess my RO water just wants to level out to 6.6.
BUT
only in the buckets....
not in my rez or my controller (well my controller went up to 6.0)

could the air bubbles cause the PH levels to go up?

 

[Brother_Monk]

i guess my RO water just wants to level out to 6.6.
BUT
only in the buckets....
not in my rez or my controller (well my controller went up to 6.0)

could the air bubbles cause the PH levels to go up?

I dunno man. Since I switched to tap water, and chemical ferts, my Ph stays rock steady between 5.6-6.4 depending how much I add and how much they are eating/drinking. Never heard of bubbles making Ph rise. I do know, however, that organic ferts in hydro, will give you false readings because of the undissolved solids. Especially true for that lumpy clumpy highly condensed floranova. I only use that stuff for when I'm testing new strains in soil.

edit: Also, are you taking readings as soon as you mix your nutrients in? Because it will fluctuate as the mix settles. Especially in RO water. I'm tellin' ya man, IMO, tap water is the best. Too many problems buffering RO water. Specially for a new grower. Ditch the RO water and you will see. How's your tap water?

Peace
BM

 

[curbiechris]

Tap
7.3 PH
125 PPM

thing is, feel kinda.... jipped by ditching the RO system. Now thats no excuse if tap will make my water more stable and my plants prosper.
BUT
man... the PH only rises severly only when in the buckets... why? (not really asking you, brother... just thinking out loud)

I guess i'm going to do a test run. after this nute mix imma use tap water.
you said to let the chlorine evaporate.. does this make the ppm count go down?
i would assume so...

in anycase, thanks.

but to answer your question. i test it right after mixing, and alteast once every couple days...
it does fluctuate.. but not that much.

*sigh

but yeah, thanks again brother.
-curbs

 

[Brother_Monk]

man... the PH only rises severly only when in the buckets... why?

Very good question! I suggest you ask it in the hydro forum. I have experienced this as well, but only in the hydrofarms i spent 400 bucks on. Once I seperated each bucket from the system, the ph stopped doing the up/down thing. Is your system recirculating? My bubblers are all stand alone. Only because I have a wide variety going all at the same time.

I feel for ya man. My RO unit cost 250. But I still use it for excellent drinking water.

Peace
BM