some questions about Coots super soil

[ramse]

I'm building my super soil for outdoor growth. I was looking at the recipe of Coots.

1/3 Sphagnum Peat Moss
1/3 Aeration (pumice, perlite, lava rock, etc..)
1/3 Compost + Earthworm Castings

1/2 cup organic Neem meal
1/2 cup organic Kelp meal
1/2 cup Crab meal/Crustacean meal

Mineral Mix Recipe
1x – Glacial Rock Dust
1x – Gypsum
1x – Oyster Shell Flour or Agricultural Lime
1x – Basalt

Some ingredients in the country I am in are difficult to find, for example the Crab meal or Crustacean meal. But in part I think I solved it by looking inside the fish farms/carpfishing... or found: Krill Meal and Crayfish Meal; on the manufacturer's website they would look like natural, untreated products...
https://www.ccmoore.com/crayfish-meal-p-2491.html
https://www.ccmoore.com/krill-meal-p-591.html

what do you think?

..instead as regards the Mineral Mix Recipe

I found the Gypsum in two versions:
anhydrous agricultural Alabaster Gypsum and natural hydrate Gypsum.
Which one should be used?
I know that the anhydrous version has a much faster buffering capacity...

Thanks!

 

[h.h.]

Didn't have sugar so I used salt...


Screw the recipe.
Read the package.

 

[ramse]

and why? since when you can't compost / produce yourself organic fertilizers?

I saw that the same Krill meal is sold as a fertilizer in a grow shop... http://www.indoororganics.co.uk/product/crab-meal/

I would have liked to use the original Coots recipe... but if it's too complicated I'll make a mix with dried blood, bones and guano

 

[h.h.]

Its not too complicated.


Look at what you're replacing and the amount used. Compare that to the recommended rate.
Use that ratio against the recommend rate of what you're replacing it with.
That'll get you close.
Close is all you'll get anyway.


You ask about krill. Like a lot of things, not that common.
You need to improvise.
Make it up as you go.
It'll be good.

 

[ramse]

So... the original recipe says: Crab meal (or Crustacean meal when available - it has Shrimp meal with the Crab meal. It's a local product from the fisheries on the Oregon & Washington Coasts)

this is sold on the e-shop buildasoil.com: Crustacean Meal is a seasonal item and will be Shrimp, Crab or a combination of both depending on the time of year and the fishing season.

Krill is a crustacean, so I think it's fine... I could do a 50/50 with the crayfish meal

what do you think? It should be fine... or have I missed something?

 

[ramse]

Its not too complicated.


Look at what you're replacing and the amount used. Compare that to the recommended rate.
Use that ratio against the recommend rate of what you're replacing it with.
That'll get you close.
Close is all you'll get anyway.


You ask about krill. Like a lot of things, not that common.
You need to improvise.
Make it up as you go.
It'll be good.

I read the message later...

ok. thanks for the advices

 

[Chunkypigs]

Yes substitute krill and crayfish meal for crusteacean meal. You could also look for fish meal or fish bone meal, also blood and bone meal from regular agriculture could work to replace the sea products.

Use whatever cheap gypsum and lime that farmers use in your area.

Try to incorporate local microbes, harvest some muck from a pond or stream bed, rake up the top inch or so of decomposing leaf and soil from a forest, yard, or beneath shrubbery, avoid yard areas treated with poisons. Substitute a portion of the peat moss with local ingredients such as these, leaf mold if you can access it is a great local substitute for some of your peat moss.

Look for local sources of worm castings and insect frass as well as compost from local barns that house cows, horses, chickens, goats, whatever. The bigger diversity you can find in your compost the better.

Call some local tree services and find out where they dump their chipped waste, screen well composted stuff and replace for peat moss.

If you have access to a swamp early spring is a great time to harvest willow duff, rake up all the wet leaves and take them and the loose soil under them, the willow mulch is full of hormones that the plants will love.

 

[h.h.]

I see krill doesn't have a recommended rate.


Your one link says krill meal is 58% protein.I found elsewhere it said 35%.
Crab meal in comparison I found at 30% protein.
The default factor of nitrogen to protein is 6.25.

With those figures, Krill meal may have up to twice the nitrogen as crab meal.
4.8% compared to 5.6-9.25% nitrogen.

1.2 teaspoons nitrogen in a half cup compared to 2.2 teaspoons on the high side.


I wouldn't be concerned unless your were getting extra N elsewhere as well.
Natural materials. Nothing is exact. Even if you follow instructions exactly.

 

[sdd420]

You can buy crustacean meal at Ace Hardware in fact worm casting and everything else you need

 

[ramse]

I see krill doesn't have a recommended rate.


Your one link says krill meal is 58% protein.I found elsewhere it said 35%.
Crab meal in comparison I found at 30% protein.
The default factor of nitrogen to protein is 6.25.

With those figures, Krill meal may have up to twice the nitrogen as crab meal.
4.8% compared to 5.6-9.25% nitrogen.

1.2 teaspoons nitrogen in a half cup compared to 2.2 teaspoons on the high side.


I wouldn't be concerned unless your were getting extra N elsewhere as well.
Natural materials. Nothing is exact. Even if you follow instructions exactly.

Yes, right

Crab Meal: NPK 4-3-0

Shrimp Meal: NPK 6-6-0

Krill meal should have a npk more similar to shrimp

 

[h.h.]

The difference I see is that crab and shrimp meal are by products where much of the protein is removed.
Krill meal is used whole as a source of protein.


I saw a post here recently where they were having issues. They had krill in their mix. I thought then maybe it was their issue. Too much protein breaking down in the soil. Don't want to raise false alarms. It sounds like a usable product.

Perhaps they used too much or had a lot of other stuff in their mix.


Personally, I would go for it. Your mix is pretty simple.

 

[ramse]

first off all, thanks for your help

I would have liked to try the original Coots recipe, for the reasoning in the choice of fertilizers behind it... but I can't afford to risk it...
for this reason I asked for an opinion, regarding these not really conventional products

I have to think about what to do...

please link me to the discussion you mention

 

[ramse]

I found this discussion: https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?threadid=344936

certain that the search system of this site is very limited... or is there an advanced search function that I don't know?

 

[h.h.]

That's a better thread actually.
Dog Star on post #8 mentions what I can only suspect.

I'm only speculating.
If I can't find NPK, I look at food values and guess. It gets me close.

 

[ramse]

well... as already mentioned, the Antarctic krill meal has more or less 60% protein, so about 9.6% N

so I should use about 50 ml every 28 liters. 1/4 - 1/5 cup per cubic foot

 

[ramse]

YI write it, maybe it could help someone...

1/4 cup of Krill Meal equals +/- 0.4 oz - 11,34 grams

if you want to stay in the dosage recommended by DogStar, 50 grams max for 200 liters, it should be used 1/6 cup per cubic foot

I also found the shrimp meal, which has less nitrogen than krill but more calcium and phosphorus