Some kind of deficiency. Please Help!

[Martin1285]

Hello,

i'am pretty desperate.

First of all I grow Jack Flash and Silver haze in 10 liter flowerpot.
The medium I use is soil and the lights I use are two high pressure sodium lamps(400W).

The plants are in the first week of their flowering period.
The deficiency or illness or whatever it is started about two weeks ago.
The leaves are randomly affected. Mostly the leaves in the middle to the near top. They start to become yellow but the veins stay green. Some of the leaves curl themselves upwards at the sides. I checked the deficiency summary what it could be: maybe Mg, zinc or iron.
But the fertilizer i Use got all this components in it ( I use Hesi).
Now I guess there are sufficent nutrients in the soil but for some reason
the plant can't use them.
I dont know what to do. More fertilizer in my opinion makes it even worse and I transfered the plants in the 10 liter pots a few days ago. So the soil is fresh. Maybe ph trouble???
Please Help and sorry for my bad english.

Martin

p.s: of course i attatched some pics!

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

try raising your pH to around 6.8

 

[oregon bob]

M- if you could give some info regarding the feeds, that'll help.

For now, not knowing why it is a problem, the yellowing of the mid/lower leaves + raising & crisping of the fringes is a pretty severe K deficiency. The tops aren't a lime enough of a green (to yellow) for it to be Fe, though this pops up for me at times of stress... touchy for the plants to take up. I don't see Mg & have never been able to distinguish a Zn problem specifically.

Again, don't know why, so can't recom fix, but the K is definitely manifest. Peace.

 

[Martin1285]

Ok,
I use NPK (4%-3%-5%) 50ml on 10 l of water every three days. 500ml for each plant.
I checked ph of the soil and its less then 5,5 ph . Could this prevent the plant from reciving K. If yes whats the best way to higher the ph of the soil.
What do you think? Are they gonna die or can i sort this out?

 

[B.C.]

hmm....

hmm....

Did you jus transplant into the 10 L pots? if so, what size were they in before? Were they badly rootbound? ...... A PH of 5.5 or lower will lock out some nutes if you don't have enough humus in the soil. What kind of soil is it? BC

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

try raising your pH to around 6.8

 

[MickTheBrag]

best way to set the PH in soil is add some garden lime. this will bring it to neutral 7.0

also it could be the start of some heatstress. make sure your plants are getting clean air. and a fan blowing on the tops from the side.



peace.

 

[Blue Dot]

Mg def

Add epsom salt at 1/4-1/2 tsp/gal

 

[10k]

Ok,
I use NPK (4%-3%-5%) 50ml on 10 l of water every three days. 500ml for each plant.
I checked ph of the soil and its less then 5,5 ph . Could this prevent the plant from reciving K. If yes whats the best way to higher the ph of the soil.
What do you think? Are they gonna die or can i sort this out?

Are you using straight peat moss for soil ?
That would explain that acidic pH.

That low pH in soil can cut all the primary elements.
ps... that looks more like P def imho.
I would follow the advice already given and water in some dolomite lime to get the soil pH buffered upwards.

The pH chart is making the rounds tonight I see...

 

[Martin1285]

Yes it is peat moss soil. Shit!

I'll give it a try with garden lime.

Thanks for the very helpful chart.

peace

 

[Hazy Lady]

try raising your pH to around 6.8

Mg def

Add epsom salt at 1/4-1/2 tsp/gal

And continue with this until flush/harvest

 

[B.C.]

Wait a minute here fellers. I'm I to understand that these plants got this big in petemoss alone? with no lime to adjust the PH, or humus ( from compost of some sort ) to buffer the PH??? that doesn't sound right?........ Btw, topdressing with lime never works out very well, it needs to be worked in the soil at the root zone to work properly, and then given -some- time to react. All part of the "cooking" process when you mix yer own soil, you let it set for a min of 2 weeks so the lime can break down and give up ion cations of calcium and mag to the pete, making the PH raise. It's been awhile, so please correct me if I'm wrong....

I have a feeling they over grew the old pots, and were badly root bound. They look like they should have been in 10 liter ( 2 1/2 gal? ) pots long before now? Keep in mind, a plant that is badly root bound will need water and nutes everyday, and they can indeed look like this from that demand not being met. It's like starving them.

Think a about it, they grew nice and big untill 2 weeks ago. What could have changed? BC

 

[Martin1285]

It's of course not petemoss alone, it 's a normal soil mixture from the gardening store . On the package it says the ph value is 5,7 which seems to be to low when you regard the fact that due to fertilization the soil ph shrinks
even more.
What is meant by "rootbound"? Is it when you take the plant out of the pot
and the roots are very dense at the sides like they had not enough space? Sorry english is not my mothertongue. If yes then yes.


Guys, I am a little confused what to do.
epsom salt against mg def ? I thougt without a proper ph value there is no use to to give more nutrients.

 

[Guest]

FLUSH>>FLUSH FLUSH>>>flush with correctly ph-ed WATER<<<

no nutriants till you see em turn around...

watch over watering after flush>>have to let em dry out good too before getting baack to normal feeding.

when you transplanted into new SOIL>>>sounds like it was charged with>>>PLENTY of food>>>and you were used to feeding with every watering>>you are OVER FEEDING>>>
locking em up>>so they wont intake anything<<<
YOUR soil will feed>>those plants for a long time>>>couple weeks at least<<shouldnt need any nutes>>>

over flushing em now should help>>>will lessen the length..of how long the soil will feed em though>>>

you'll see em turn around<<<and then ask for more food

if you have back ups ready>>id re[place them<<<as this can take a toll on final weight>>>

week or 2 to to get em fully rollin again.

just my 2cts

everytime i had a problem>>>a superflush<<<to RE-condition the soil>>>and basicly re-start them>>>did the trick for me.>>>>just takes a couple weeks

 

[B.C.]

hmm...

hmm...

I'm not sure why yer soil would say it had a PH of 5.7 on the package, unless it was for acid loving plants? Anyway, the plants -did- thrive and get big in it untill 2 weeks ago, so it must have fed them, right?...... Yes, that is what I meant by rootbound. I think you need to transplant alil bit sooner than what you have been. They're out growin ya man! lol..... These plants grew with great vigor before they became rootbound. I think they will bounce back with the fresh soil, it might be a good idea to give them a light dose of nutes to help them along though. It's gonna take a few more days ( because they were jus transplanted ) to see the effects though, so be patient. The parts that have turned yellow will probly not turn green again, so watch the new growth. BC

 

[Martin1285]

Thanks for you help guys. i will inform you how it is going.

I attached a photo of the soil package for the acid lovers .

I checked the gardening store and its saying 5,7 on nearly every soil.

Weird germans........

 

[B.C.]

I'm not sure what that number is? but it's not the PH. That is a comma , between the 5 and the 7, not a decimal point . If this soil was for acid loveing plants it would say so on the front of the package. For Acid Loving Plants, like rhodadendrens, azaleas, and blueberries, etc. Somthin like that anyway.

Yer plants started out very nice in that soil, so I don't think it will take long to get them back on track in it either.

If you don't mind me asking, and for the sake of learning, what size pots were they in before you transplanted?........ Btw, I'm not sure if you know, but the general rule of thumb with container soil growing is, a gallon ( 4 liters? ) of soil, per foot ( 30 cm? ) of plant. Doing this will always give the plants a buffer zone of soil that is usually very forgiving to deficiencies, PH lookout, etc. .....easy carefree growing.

later, BC

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I'm not sure what that number is? but it's not the PH. That is a comma , between the 5 and the 7, not a decimal point . If this soil was for acid loveing plants it would say so on the front of the package. For Acid Loving Plants, like rhodadendrens, azaleas, and blueberries, etc. Somthin like that anyway....

The label is German. In Germany, they use a comma instead of a decimal. In English translation, it reads five point seven.

IMHO, most commercial potting soils are too hot for mj. I never plant a seed or set a clone w/o testing the runoff. Never once had the correct pH straight from the bag without paying 10 times what it's worth.

 

[Blue Dot]

All part of the "cooking" process when you mix yer own soil, you let it set for a min of 2 weeks so the lime can break down and give up ion cations of calcium and mag to the pete, making the PH raise. It's been awhile, so please correct me if I'm wrong....

pH is based solely on the relative concentration of hydrogen ions (causing acidic low pH) to OH ions causing basic high pH.

Lime works to reduce the relative number of H+ ions in the soil(less) by neutralizing the H+ ions into H20 (water) using it's carbonates (CaCO3 for just lime) and (MgCO3 for dolomite lime).

Cations are just simply positively charged ions so any positively charged ions like Ca++, Mg++, will not change pH because it's not the cations that increase pH it's the carbonates.

Interestingly, this is why adding CaSO4 (gypsum) to your soil does not increase the pH because although gypsum contains plenty of Ca++ it lacks the carbonates which are what affects pH.

 

[B.C.]

DB, thanks for the translation. lol I never would have guessed! J/K.... Why is there a decimal point in the next number then? Why wouldn't it state on the bag for acid loving plants? I think that would be important if ya didn't wanna kill yer plants?.... If it really is 5.7 how did these plants get so big? 5.7 in soil would be locking nutes out from the get go, would it not?

I still think they were severly root bound and starving. Those are some good sized plants to have been in a pot that was smaller than what there in now. It's an everyday thing keeping up plants when the roots are packed in so tight. Slack off just a lil and they will show deficiencies, I've seen it happen many times before. Here on the board and in my own grow.

Btw, I haven't PHed my bag soil grows for years. I cut it down with perlite and I have no problems at all with burning when popping seeds or rooting clones in it? It's been really care free actually?

BD, thanks for the lesson it's been some time since I've read up on it, and then to retain it?!? fahget about it. lol.... I've forgotten more stuff than I know anymore... Gettin old I spose, the pain meds I take doesn't help anything either. Sometimes I feel like I'm mentally crippled! lol BC