Some dry sift questions

[Great outdoors]

So it's been a good 20 years since I made some dry sift hash. Decided it was time to get into some hash again so I bought myself a small dry sift tumbler on ebay. Works great and with the lack of labor suddenly involved I can see I will be making a fair bit of it. It has a 150 micron screen and I have been impressed with the quality. I have plenty of weed stock with this years outdoor. Probably will run 2 to 3 pounds through.
The tumbler came with a miny steel cylinder press. Works great for pressing the small chunks I have made so far, can maybe press a couple grams at a time.
For pressing larger amounts what do you put the sift between? Parchment paper would be my first thought between a couple sheets of steel. I have a shop hydraulic press.
Also what about curing? I am using well cured bud but does leaving the hash out in the open air for a certain time improve the cure? Or best to wrap immediately?
A few different strains I made today.

 

[moose eater]

I'd understood number 100 to number 120 screen was best. But those aren't micron ratings, to the best of my knowledge.

My tumbler is a custom-built one-off unit, but I've threatened in the past to post a pic or 2 of it. Who knows? Maybe in your thread?

Anyway, for something a bit larger than a tiny pea-shooter press, I went to a machinist and had him fit some thicker-walled square-tube steel to a thicker solid piece with flat top and bottom that would fit into the top of the square tube, and a thin piece of solid flat steel that fit neatly into the bottom of the square tube's hollow in the center.

The trichomes are placed into a turkey/food roasting bag that's been cut to allow it to fit (with some added slack) inside the square tube steel form, with the flat plate steel underneath it, and the thicker solid steel on top of the turkey bag.

The turkey roasting bag is fitted to the amount of trichomes, and taped up loosely with Scotch tape.

The square tube steel form, the flat steel plate in the bottom of the form, and the thicker top piece are heated in the oven on a toaster oven tray to about 170 deg. Fahrenheit.

I then place the toaster oven tray in my 4"ship-metal press frame, under a 8-ton to 12-ton press, and pile 3 to 4 larger (3/8" to 1/2" center diameter) fender washers on top of the thicker top plate in the press, so that if the two plates end up, after being pressed, with the hash in between the plates, being thinner than the form, the washers give the hydraulic jack's base something to push on/against in compacting the hash, other than the side walls of the hash form.

I went the expensive route with the custom build at a union tin shop, and gathered my own porous stainless steel mesh to use in the job, as well as my own Dayton 25 to 30 rpm gear-reduction-drive 110 volt AC motor, light switch for the motor, custom built switch housing for the switch, epoxy paint in the wooden box that houses the collection tray, the custom mount for the tumbler wheel, inset bushing-mounted bearing in the front sliding 'door' of the tumbler box, etc., etc., and more. Only really inexpensive aspect of the project was the initial purchase of turkey roasting bags.

Get the unscented variety, and leave enough slack so that when you press the glands, the pressure isn't as apt to blow your bags out, because the clean up of hot pressed glands into steel nooks and crannies is a pain in the ass.

Good luck.

Edit:

Years ago here at ICMag, there was some amount of writing about the Pakistanis and aging the glands in nicely tanned goat skins.

Haven't tried that. You might want to write to mriko, though his posting is minimal these days, and he's wrestling some of life's many fairly serious challenges at the moment.

I try to leave my sugar trim in a state that it's not bone dry, and so I can leave it in its storage bags (gallon zip-lock freezer bags) so I can tumble it in its box, with sheetrock over the top to address any drafts from the room it's in.

Ideally cured for a bit, then tumbled, then labeled, wrapped in cellophane food wrap, and placed in the hash jar for later use.

If tumbling on a table or flat work area, I'd choose a day that's close to 30 f. or so in the work room, with no drafts in the room, and preferably relatively LOW humidity.

The hash, once in wrapping, in the hash jar, will change pliability and the presence of oil on the surface over time (more often than not).

 

[Great outdoors]

Great info, thanks. A little hard to picture it all though so if you want to throw any pictures in have at her
Like I said I have been impressed with the quality. I have been using no heat and minimal screwing pressure to press my hash. Almost could do the press just with the strength of my fingers. The hash is soft and moldable, similar more so to old Afghani rather than Moroccan. It is quite oily and you break little balls to roll a spliff rather than heating the hash and it fluffing up. Even the blonder stuff is quite soft, softer than the freshest maroc I have seen in my day.
When I made dry sift in the past my screen was not as fine and I would always have to add some oil to make it a decent press.

 

[moose eater]

I'll see what I can do on the picture issue. Things here are pretty low energy, and slow to move any more. Still contending with my health issues, and today my wife went in for some investigative medical stuff for a couple nodules on her thyroid gland in her throat, so Murphy seems to be tag-teaming us now, where serious or potentially serious health stuff is involved. Seems to have taken the wind from my sails a bit.

Anyway, yes, years ago, before I put in a well and went from delivered treated artesian water, to the hard water I now get from my own ground, and back before the organic amendments I'm prone to using went toward the more marginal end of quality, I got black-ish hash that was easily pressed by hand, would melt when flame was put to it, etc.

The glands back then that did better with heat, tended to be from the later tumbling.

I've been playing with my soilless mixes since then, and have also acquired another RO/DI system that I still need to hook up (that's been collecting dust on its shipping box since 11 months ago or so), which I'll likely use to mix my 350+-total hardness well water with RO/DI H2O, and hopefully come out with a total hardness of between 150 and 180. That ought to get me a bit closer to the resin quality that I had back then, though this last crop was pretty darned good (*Still need to run an analysis on it as well; both Mehlich III and H2O extraction).

At the moment, and for many years now, I tend to tumble the whole lot of sugar trim for about 40-50 minutes. Back in the old days I would tumble for about 25 minutes, separate those glands for pressing, then tumble the remining 15-25 minutes for the lesser grade of glands that were more apt to require heat in the process.

Can't guarantee when I'll get 'er done, but I have close to 150-200 grams of sugar trim to tumble still, and am still struggling to get my clones done that are -way- overdue, but I'll try to remind myself to get some pics of the tumbler, the box that contains it, the hash form's pieces, the small toaster oven baking tray I use under the forms in the press, the ship metal press, the no-stick 11"x17" baking sheet that I have located in the bottom of the collection area of the box beneath the tumbler wheel, and one of the heavier jacks that I use.

 

[dirty-joe]

I think the 150 micron is a good size for outdoor weed. I mean if the weed is good to smoke, and you throw away 90-95 %, the resultant hash does not need further refining. I love hash BTW.
I had one particular plant last year, I further separated through a 137 micron screen in an outdoor shed at about minus 5 C, and the hash is almost rosin, it's so sticky. And I don't like that, I'm going to mix back in the the stuff that was up to 150 (or 160) which is also perfectly good "malleable" black hash. Someday I'm not so busy, HA.
Picture.

As far as pressing, like in the picture I do about 5 to 10 gram batches (not too thick) wrapped in parchment, and just press with your Hands, finger, and thumbs more accurately for a couple of minutes.

This year I'm thinking, I have a little 10 gallon barrel, I'm going to 1 pound batches of ice water hash. Filtering with vegetable strainer to get out the chunks, then 160 micron bag, then 45 micron bag, keeping all that (45 to 160) together, and the stuff under 45 let gravity settle and keep separate. I kind of hate the "hash snobs, I don't need 10 grades of hash, and as I mentioned if the weed is fit to smoke, then ALL of the hash is too.

Here's another piece from last year, a different plant, I also believe it is 137 micron (110 mesh silk screen), but may be a little bigger, it's still sticky enough to leave your finger prints in it easily. Did I mention I love hash ?

 

[Gelato33grower]

2 to 3 pounds for that lil bit of kief is that good or bad? Looks great though.the only kief ive ever smoked was grinder kief lol. Nice pics.thanks for posting.

 

[Great outdoors]

2 to 3 pounds for that lil bit of kief is that good or bad? Looks great though.the only kief ive ever smoked was grinder kief lol. Nice pics.thanks for posting.

I am getting a 5 - 10% return depending on strain. Those pieces are just from a couple oz's or so that I tumbled to test yesterday.
My questions are before I go about tumbling 2 to 3lbs.

 

[Great outdoors]

I think the 150 micron is a good size for outdoor weed. I mean if the weed is good to smoke, and you throw away 90-95 %, the resultant hash does not need further refining. I love hash BTW.
I had one particular plant last year, I further separated through a 137 micron screen in an outdoor shed at about minus 5 C, and the hash is almost rosin, it's so sticky. And I don't like that, I'm going to mix back in the the stuff that was up to 150 (or 160) which is also perfectly good "malleable" black hash. Someday I'm not so busy, HA.
Picture.

As far as pressing, like in the picture I do about 5 to 10 gram batches (not too thick) wrapped in parchment, and just press with your Hands, finger, and thumbs more accurately for a couple of minutes.

This year I'm thinking, I have a little 10 gallon barrel, I'm going to 1 pound batches of ice water hash. Filtering with vegetable strainer to get out the chunks, then 160 micron bag, then 45 micron bag, keeping all that (45 to 160) together, and the stuff under 45 let gravity settle and keep separate. I kind of hate the "hash snobs, I don't need 10 grades of hash, and as I mentioned if the weed is fit to smoke, then ALL of the hash is too.

Here's another piece from last year, a different plant, I also believe it is 137 micron (110 mesh silk screen), but may be a little bigger, it's still sticky enough to leave your finger prints in it easily. Did I mention I love hash ?

Ahhh I recognize that quarter
Yeah I have been getting a 5-10% return and there is no green flavor so I think the mesh is a good size. The tumbler came with a choice of 180 or 150 micron. Glad I went 150.
I have never been a fan of bubble hash really. My favorite hash is good old school Moroccan, I lived in Europe for a few years back in the day. Not the strongest but that beautiful spicy taste is the best. So that is what I would like to work toward. I know strain is going to be quite influential on flavor, but I was wondering if some air curing would improve the flavor. We know for sure that the hash made in Morocco would see a lot of air before market.

 

[dirty-joe]

Yeah I have been getting a 5-10% return

Yeah me too. Last year average was 7.25 % for the dry sift. I did save some (not all) of the "spent" weed, and did a rough QWISO and got 22 grams of oil. Like the extra sticky hash I'm not fond of oil either, too messy, need too much gear to smoke it, although those small pen vaporizers are pretty cool once you get the cart filled.

I do prefer the dry sift, but don't mind bubble hash. So this year when it gets cold enough I'll do a quick (a minute or two per Oz.) dry sift, and keep a coarser grade (in case some batches turn out too sticky). Then instead of oil, from the spent weed, I'll make bubble. I'm gonna do 800 grams, and if I get 10% (80 grams) or better in total, I'll be quite happy.

I hear you on the Moroccan import. I miss the imported weed, sure our green grown is good, but I feel even though there are a thousand different names (strains), it all seems rather similar. I miss the "exotic" flavors of Colombian, Hawaiian etc.

As far as the taste of that Moroccan hash, probably many factors, the "air", yeah they probably let it air from harvest till winter, before beating it. The climate, and what ever size holes are in their cloth ?

 

[tobedetermined]

yeah they probably let it air from harvest till winter, before beating it

Aging is a lot of the answer. While I don't sift - I blame my long haired cat - I do bubble. And I have found - for my taste - that the best hash I make is always from bud and trim that is a year or two old. Sure, I know the potency will be down but the taste, smell and effects more than make up for it.

 

[Great outdoors]

Aging is a lot of the answer. While I don't sift - I blame my long haired cat - I do bubble. And I have found - for my taste - that the best hash I make is always from bud and trim that is a year or two old. Sure, I know the potency will be down but the taste, smell and effects more than make up for it.

This was my thought. In the days of import hash it was always a good year old at least. Probably left out in open air until it was packed to ship. The taste I don't care for from domestic hash is always that fresh greener taste.
Like yourself potency is not the be all for me, it's all about flavor.

 

[dirty-joe]

Aging is a lot of the answer. While I don't sift - I blame my long haired cat - I do bubble. And I have found - for my taste - that the best hash I make is always from bud and trim that is a year or two old. Sure, I know the potency will be down but the taste, smell and effects more than make up for it.

I think there is a couple of good / interesting points in there.
Aging is one. Again the "snobs" have been preaching that the weed must be thrown away after it's a year old...HA.
And the Air is two. Again it's been said so many times that the weed "MUST" be kept in bottles, or it's NO GOOD, and heaven forbid if the sun should ever shine on it for 2 seconds. That would ruin it for sure....idiots say something, and parrots repeat, until it's "common knowledge".
I guess that's why all (or by far the most) the weed today is the same generic "green" stuff. And the weed of yesteryear had some character, gold, and brown, and flavor.

I had threatened to leave some drying this year in the sun/partial shade for a couple of days, but in the end I didn't. Not only as an experiment, and to change the color some, but it's just not that east to dry "naturally" here on the east coast (@45N) it is almost always VERY humid here 80-90% many, many days at that time of year. Friend, and neighbour lost over half of his this year to mold AFTER harvest.

OK, I guess I should clarify, I'm not arguing that degradation does happen, it's just not as quite as big a concern as the guy wanting to sell you another bag makes it out to be.

 

[gaiusmarius]

I think the 150 micron is a good size for outdoor weed. I mean if the weed is good to smoke, and you throw away 90-95 %, the resultant hash does not need further refining. I love hash BTW.
I had one particular plant last year, I further separated through a 137 micron screen in an outdoor shed at about minus 5 C, and the hash is almost rosin, it's so sticky. And I don't like that, I'm going to mix back in the the stuff that was up to 150 (or 160) which is also perfectly good "malleable" black hash. Someday I'm not so busy, HA.
Picture.

As far as pressing, like in the picture I do about 5 to 10 gram batches (not too thick) wrapped in parchment, and just press with your Hands, finger, and thumbs more accurately for a couple of minutes.

This year I'm thinking, I have a little 10 gallon barrel, I'm going to 1 pound batches of ice water hash. Filtering with vegetable strainer to get out the chunks, then 160 micron bag, then 45 micron bag, keeping all that (45 to 160) together, and the stuff under 45 let gravity settle and keep separate. I kind of hate the "hash snobs, I don't need 10 grades of hash, and as I mentioned if the weed is fit to smoke, then ALL of the hash is too.

Here's another piece from last year, a different plant, I also believe it is 137 micron (110 mesh silk screen), but may be a little bigger, it's still sticky enough to leave your finger prints in it easily. Did I mention I love hash ?

damn man that looks like some sick old school afghani goodness.

 

[Rembetis]

Aging resin is always better, but most people don't have the patience. The Afghanis do everything in the winter. They harvest resin at the end of growing season and let it sit until next winter when they press it. It naturally decarbs before being pressed. There was some speculation that going thru their hot dry summers had a lot to do with that.
I cant say for sure but what I do know is that the hash of old that we got in the 70's was potent as hell and those plants are weak by modern strain standards. Many of those strains like the Lebanese come in at below 10% THC. Whatever is going on, their process works.

 

[Blackmoouth]

Hola, lo siento por no postear en inglés. Muy buen hilo; yo también he leído y escuchado a gente como French Cannoli hablar sobre la importancia de envejecer la resina en polvo y el que los maestros del hash en Afghanistan no fuman la resina 'verde' porque no es buena: debe envejecer al menos un año; algunos lo hacen en odres (estómagos de animales), supongo que para mantener una temperatura y humedad que permitan que se descarboxile y en ese proceso es donde pienso se produce ese cambio químico en cannabinoides y terpenos que modifican el producto final.

 

[tobedetermined]

If you want to do a deep dive on the subject, get really high and wade through the study that identified and named the terpene hashishene.

Marchini M, Charvoz MC, Dujourdy L, Baldovini N, Filippi JJ. Multidimensional analysis of cannabis volatile constituents: Identification of 5,5-dimethyl-1-vinylbicyclo[2.1.1]hexane as a volatile marker of hashish, the resin of Cannabis sativa L. The Journal of Chromatography A. 2014;1370:200-15.

Here is a link to a pdf of the study posted by Alchimia

 

[goingrey]

If you want to do a deep dive on the subject, get really high and wade through the study that identified and named the terpene hashishene.

Marchini M, Charvoz MC, Dujourdy L, Baldovini N, Filippi JJ. Multidimensional analysis of cannabis volatile constituents: Identification of 5,5-dimethyl-1-vinylbicyclo[2.1.1]hexane as a volatile marker of hashish, the resin of Cannabis sativa L. The Journal of Chromatography A. 2014;1370:200-15.

Here is a link to a pdf of the study posted by Alchimia

Interesting, they say it is created by beta-myrcene being exposed to UV light.

Should we be sun-drying our buds?

 

[tobedetermined]

Should we be sun-drying our buds?

That is the takeaway from that study. But, while they do sun dry in Morocco afaik Afghani, Nepalese etc are all stacked and dried inside. So they would get oxygen but they would only get filtered or artificial light and no sun light.

 

[Switcher56]

If you want to do a deep dive on the subject, get really high and wade through the study that identified and named the terpene hashishene.

Marchini M, Charvoz MC, Dujourdy L, Baldovini N, Filippi JJ. Multidimensional analysis of cannabis volatile constituents: Identification of 5,5-dimethyl-1-vinylbicyclo[2.1.1]hexane as a volatile marker of hashish, the resin of Cannabis sativa L. The Journal of Chromatography A. 2014;1370:200-15.

Here is a link to a pdf of the study posted by Alchimia

Thanks man Much appreciated...

 

[tobedetermined]

From Leafly - a manufacturer's blurb . . .

"“There’s this idea that hashishene is only found in hash, but in reality, it’s a degradation product of another terpene, myrcene, when it’s exposed to light causing photo-oxidation to occur. You find it in hash because the drying and pressing process creates the conditions for myrcene to break down into hashishene,” says McKenney. “But it’s not unique to hash. You can use myrcene from any plant, expose it to the proper conditions, and the result will be hashishene. And we’re starting to get a pretty good idea of how we can create those conditions in the lab, as well as what plants we might use as a source of myrcene.”"