Solvent safety concerns

[TheGrandmaGrows]

Hi everyone!


tl;dr: Is canned butane good for extractions? is lab-grade ethanol good for extractions? Do different standards make a difference in how appropriate a given ethanol is for extraction?


In the past I've done most of my solvent-based extractions using canned butane or lab-grade ethanol.



The butane I always use either Colibri or the super 300 times purified Clipper. I've seen both used all over and are sold in most growshops where I leave.



The thing is, I remember hearing that even though they are very pure they still have some 'mystery oil' that we don't want in our lungs, and that only pure n,n-butane barrels should be used to make extractions, which I guess implies living in a place where you can legally order that and have a fucking lab to do the extractions properly (not my case unfortunately).



On the other hand, for a while I had access to grain alcohol, which is 94-96%, made to make liquors, and I feel definitely safe using it for extractions. However, I don't have access to that anymore. Instead, I have access to lab-grade ethanol, which is usually 99.8-99.9%, which I've heard can't be obtained through distillation, so it means probably some chemical process was used to bring it up there, which implies some benzene residues or other nasties might be left in the end product.


What's the consensus on this? Is canned butane good for extractions? is lab-grade ethanol good for extractions? Do different standards make a difference in how appropriate a given ethanol is for extraction? If so, I'm pretty sure mine is PhEur and USP, but would be interested in knowing all the different standards and their respective appropriateness for extractions.


If neither is appropriate, any tips for making dabable concentrates without spending hours polishing my dry sift/buying a fucking press for rosin? I'm considering limonene or isopropyl as alternatives, but would need to check availability and purity for those as well.


Thanks!

 

[Gray Wolf]

All lighter butane is not created equal and we redistill any LPG before using it for extraction, regardless of grade. Mystery oil is nasty tasting, but a GC analysis reveals it to be primarily longer chain hydrocarbons and not highly toxic at the low levels encountered.

Here is Skyhighlers tests of mystery oil levels vis a vis brands:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=275567&highlight=Mystery+oil

Depends on how the greater than 95% ethanol was manufactured. Higher that azeotropic purity levels can be obtained by vacuum distillation or by simply drying with things like Drierite.

If you subsequently remove the ethanol to within FDA residual solvent standards after extraction, any low level impurities involved in drying it, will be below levels of concern.

 

[TheGrandmaGrows]

Thanks @GrayWolf!


That's exactly the info I needed.



Do you have any idea as to manufacturing standards to get pure ethanol with USP/PhEur certification? Is there such a thing?


I'll also take the opportunity to thank you more generally, you have taught me so many things throughout the years, as well as inspired me to share knowledge whenever I feel it can be of use. Really, you are a great inspiration for me and I assume for many others as well.



Also, considering I've catched fire several times while growing mushrooms at home (having an alcohol burner and sterilizing surfaces with alcohol is a good recipe if you want to start small fires in your bathroom), I'm definitely the kind of person who could've blown up due to poor practices with BHO, and you are one of the main reasons I haven't, so I would say statistically you must have actually saved quite a few lives as well!!

 

[Gray Wolf]

Thanks @GrayWolf!


That's exactly the info I needed.



Do you have any idea as to manufacturing standards to get pure ethanol with USP/PhEur certification? Is there such a thing?


I'll also take the opportunity to thank you more generally, you have taught me so many things throughout the years, as well as inspired me to share knowledge whenever I feel it can be of use. Really, you are a great inspiration for me and I assume for many others as well.



Also, considering I've catched fire several times while growing mushrooms at home (having an alcohol burner and sterilizing surfaces with alcohol is a good recipe if you want to start small fires in your bathroom), I'm definitely the kind of person who could've blown up due to poor practices with BHO, and you are one of the main reasons I haven't, so I would say statistically you must have actually saved quite a few lives as well!!

Check: https://www.usp.org/sites/default/files/usp/document/harmonization/excipients/alcohol-m1238.pdf

Thanks for the good thoughts brother!

 

[troutman]

Do you have any idea as to manufacturing standards to get pure ethanol with USP/PhEur certification? Is there such a thing?

You need a still to get fairly pure ethanol (95%) and distill very slowly for best results.

I got 98+% after using my laboratory glass still and some chemistry tricks starting with 40% Smirnoff vodka.

 

[TheGrandmaGrows]

@GrayWolf


Thanks for the pdf! So that's all amounts you can safely drink right? I'm assuming also safe in the dosages that may end up in a dab of QWET produced with that.


@troutman


Thanks! You told me in my thread that you were using your tub and a pump to keep it cool. Nice idea. I don't have a tub but I have some big containers... And what do you use for heating? The lab-style heaters I've seen are all in the same price-range as a rosin press, which is what makes me doubt. If I setup a still I want it to be able to produce BHO distillate as well so I guess I need something a bit precise in the temp control for that...

 

[troutman]

^^^ I was using my bathtub to keep the water cold for my pump. When the water warmed up I would pull the plug and let some out
until the water level was just above the pump and refilled with cold water again. I was using a laboratory heating mantle. They are sold
according to the size of the flask you plan to use. I used a 2,000 mL size.

I never played with butane so be very careful if you go there.

Rosin presses look more expensive than any heating mantle I have. Maybe, I'm not looking at the same ones you are.

 

[TheGrandmaGrows]

Yeah, I think I can just keep a big bucket full of cold water by refilling with ice or something. I guess 1 or 2 L is a good size.



Of course I don't plan on distilling butane with a lab still in my house, I would evap it outdoors and just distill the concentrate to fraction it into ecig-friendly material.


I'm looking into the personal use presses with like 300-400kg pressure that I think should work for pressing hash, and go for about 200€ around here. Similar to the price of a lab heater. I've also found an interesting still kit for 170€, which includes the heater, which is actually a pretty good deal I think!



The only problem is I think it's designed to make steam extractions from plants so it has a weird setup. The thing you heat contains only the solvent (water I guess), and then the steam goes through another flask in which you put whatever herb, and then through a steam path that ends up in a Graham condenser. I'm not sure this will work for distilling concentrates... Is there any reason for the condenser being vertical vs. oblique?

 

[troutman]

You must be looking at steam distillation setup. I don't have one of those.

 

[TheGrandmaGrows]

Yes, and I'm wondering whether by taking out the extra initial flask it can be adapted to perform distillations for ethanol reclaiming/concentrate fractioning

 

[Gray Wolf]

Yeah, I think I can just keep a big bucket full of cold water by refilling with ice or something. I guess 1 or 2 L is a good size.



Of course I don't plan on distilling butane with a lab still in my house, I would evap it outdoors and just distill the concentrate to fraction it into ecig-friendly material.


I'm looking into the personal use presses with like 300-400kg pressure that I think should work for pressing hash, and go for about 200€ around here. Similar to the price of a lab heater. I've also found an interesting still kit for 170€, which includes the heater, which is actually a pretty good deal I think!



The only problem is I think it's designed to make steam extractions from plants so it has a weird setup. The thing you heat contains only the solvent (water I guess), and then the steam goes through another flask in which you put whatever herb, and then through a steam path that ends up in a Graham condenser. I'm not sure this will work for distilling concentrates... Is there any reason for the condenser being vertical vs. oblique?

Mono and sesquiterpenes have been extracted using steam for a couple hundred years, but unfortunately not hot enough for diterpenes and above.

You should be able to operate it like a regular still by just leaving the material basket out.

A Graham condenser in a horizontal position will flood in the low spots and putt. Vertically will keep it drained.

 

[Lyfespan]

All lighter butane is not created equal and we redistill any LPG before using it for extraction, regardless of grade. Mystery oil is nasty tasting, but a GC analysis reveals it to be primarily longer chain hydrocarbons and not highly toxic at the low levels encountered.

Here is Skyhighlers tests of mystery oil levels vis a vis brands:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=275567&highlight=Mystery+oil

Depends on how the greater than 95% ethanol was manufactured. Higher that azeotropic purity levels can be obtained by vacuum distillation or by simply drying with things like Drierite.

If you subsequently remove the ethanol to within FDA residual solvent standards after extraction, any low level impurities involved in drying it, will be below levels of concern.

has anyone had contact with Sky?

 

[Gray Wolf]

Not I. Anyone?

 

[troutman]

Not I. Anyone?

I checked his Facebook a while back and it seems he's offline now.