Snype's RDWC Construction Tutorial For 250 Watts - 7,600 Watts!

[DapperDon]

I have made a 4-6 site 18 gallon pot UC clone off of your specs with only difference is that I have made my containers out of carbon fiber that will accept the standard 5 gallon lid pots and 3 in pvc lines. I haven't pulled the trigger on lighting yet as I am still on the fence about the new Sun Systems ACDE or to use standard MH and HPS for veg and flower. I would really like to see how your veg A and B systems are broken down and what you would do differently were you to build a new system today.

 

[Catatafish]

Yes listen to snype on the ratio of M to B. My latest crop is much much much....much better using that ratio.

Although i only run 6/12 right now which i think is mainly due to my heat issues and wierd transpiration rates etc... The summer heat in the south is no fucking joke. You northerners dont know how good you got it!

The only thing i can add is make sure to have your temps right or get a mini. Or else be prepared to play with the ppms and lower amount of nutes. I find the plants in the rdwc will burn quicker than my ones in coco. Unless there is some other variable im not catching but im 99% sure its the heat. Snype may have a better clue than me though.

This by no means takes anything away from the system......it FUCKING ROCKS!!! Grows monsters with the quickness. I love the ease of maintenance too. No root rot in my heat following snypes bleach recommends. Just posted some pics in the FL thread and OGR's WFA thread although some are blurry. Ill try to get some more with containers this weekend to give the full scope.

Man we must have listed the washer place 5-6 times already, LOL!

 

[mjkelly93]

I run 3 systems with 24 buckets in each system. I ordered my washers from reliant rubber company and none of my washers leak. You just need to put some elbow grease into them and they will all tighten up.

I havent been keeping up with the thread but i just wanted to add that if you go above the 12 bucket system, it appears you need to throttle back the pump recirculating the water or the end buckets will end up really low while the first buckets will be full. All i did was turn one of the stopcocks a little more than halfway closed and they all leveled off nice.

Has anyone tried putting 9 buckets, rather than 6, under each 1000W HPS or 1200W LED?

 

[Snype]

I have made a 4-6 site 18 gallon pot UC clone off of your specs with only difference is that I have made my containers out of carbon fiber that will accept the standard 5 gallon lid pots and 3 in pvc lines. I haven't pulled the trigger on lighting yet as I am still on the fence about the new Sun Systems ACDE or to use standard MH and HPS for veg and flower. I would really like to see how your veg A and B systems are broken down and what you would do differently were you to build a new system today.

I can vision what you are saying. Maybe your running around 5,000 watts on the 4 site and more on the 6 site. So you are looking to grow monsters. This tutorial was originally dedicated to the grower that wanted to maximize his light and time to get similar the same yields that you would be getting growing bigger plants. The difference is that you would be vegging much longer but I know you are aware of that. I'm simply stating this for the record. It sounds like a great system. My only concern would be the amount of air that you would be adding in there with all that space. If I was to personally run that system, I would run an Alita AL-60 for every 2 (18 Gallon Containers) and I would place 6 air stones in each container spread out. Let us know how it works out for you. I like the idea of a system like that. I was working on one that holds 16.5 gallons. I would have to design some sort of lid for it.

I would still use my Veg-A technique for the first week to 10 days. If you did things like I do them, you would have the root growth that you would need in this time from to hit the RDWC systems with less stress added from going right to RDWC from rooted clone. The amount of space on the white tray and lid that I show here is not bad but they also sell the same lid and you could cut the holes where ever you wanted them. I enjoy using hanging net pots in E&F for this early Veg process. I really wouldn't change anything about it so far because I feel that it is perfect. You are not trying to grow the plants in VEG-A, only the roots but the plants will still grow in the process. This process helps the plant have a better buffer against problems when going to RDWC.

Yes listen to snype on the ratio of M to B. My latest crop is much much much....much better using that ratio.

Although i only run 6/12 right now which i think is mainly due to my heat issues and wierd transpiration rates etc... The summer heat in the south is no fucking joke. You northerners dont know how good you got it!

The only thing i can add is make sure to have your temps right or get a mini. Or else be prepared to play with the ppms and lower amount of nutes. I find the plants in the rdwc will burn quicker than my ones in coco. Unless there is some other variable im not catching but im 99% sure its the heat. Snype may have a better clue than me though.

This by no means takes anything away from the system......it FUCKING ROCKS!!! Grows monsters with the quickness. I love the ease of maintenance too. No root rot in my heat following snypes bleach recommends. Just posted some pics in the FL thread and OGR's WFA thread although some are blurry. Ill try to get some more with containers this weekend to give the full scope.

Man we must have listed the washer place 5-6 times already, LOL!

That sucks about the heat. I run my Air conditioning at 66F and the plant tops max out at 79 right now. I'd rather see them at 75 in the canopy. That produces a better product for me personally.

That ratio works perfect for me. I hope others try it as well and keep their pH in line.

Your burning could be from multiple variables including lights being too close, too hot at canopy, an imbalance in the system and plants can't eat, pH out of line for too long, too much food and other factors.

I'm glad that the system is working for you. It sounds like you went all out and bought the right air pump. I see others not using the right amount of air and having problems. I contribute you to not having root issues from the air pump and chlorine treatments. That's great that it's working out for you. When I hear feedback, it makes me know if I'm on the right track with other peoples' conditions.

As to the washer comment? LMFAO! That was to be expected. I had to deal with stores and it's hard to find the right owner who is on a similar page about how things work.

I run 3 systems with 24 buckets in each system. I ordered my washers from reliant rubber company and none of my washers leak. You just need to put some elbow grease into them and they will all tighten up.

I havent been keeping up with the thread but i just wanted to add that if you go above the 12 bucket system, it appears you need to throttle back the pump recirculating the water or the end buckets will end up really low while the first buckets will be full. All i did was turn one of the stopcocks a little more than halfway closed and they all leveled off nice.

Has anyone tried putting 9 buckets, rather than 6, under each 1000W HPS or 1200W LED?

Wow 24 buckets to a system? Glad it's working for you but I wouldn't personally do it unless it was 3 rows and 2 pumps and bigger buckets and pipes. Glad you are running RDWC. 3 rows of 3 in for a 9 bucket system would be nice for smaller untapped plants.

 

[Catatafish]

You could be right about too close to light doing it....the side that is doing is close 2' maybe a little less and thats where the hotter temps are. It appears one of the new seed plants im running in one system is somewhat OG-ish, stretchy lanky bitch, they turned into a nice wide bush though after topping.

Yes i did buy the good air pump too as i knew my water temps would be high due to my location and no in room ac other than the central air.

 

[mjkelly93]

Wow 24 buckets to a system? Glad it's working for you but I wouldn't personally do it unless it was 3 rows and 2 pumps and bigger buckets and pipes. Glad you are running RDWC. 3 rows of 3 in for a 9 bucket system would be nice for smaller untapped plants.

Yeah 24 works fine but you actually need less pumping. The pump actually removes water too fast from the far side for the water to catch up to it. So you end up with buckets on the far end of the 24 with really low water levels, like 15% of the bucket and the front buckets are full. So i decided to throttle back how fast the water reaches the pump and sure enough the water levels all leveled off nice and we back in business. Yes it recirculates slower but i think that should be OK. They seem to be doing great. Im not familiar with other methods but i feel as if the plants are growing fast.

Id like to second buying a big air pump. I feel as if this is the reason why i have no root rot like so many other people in other threads. Im running 24 buckets off an ecoplus commercial air pump 7 and it works great. The problem is that its loud. Not like crazy loud but loud enough that if you need stealth, dont go with those pumps. My water temp fluctuates between 80-90 degrees and i have never had a problem. I see alot of people on other sites crying about keeping water temperature below 70 using chillers and all this shit and i have to say thats a bunch of bullshit. I run that water near 90 almost constantly and have never had a problem with any of the plants.

Im thinking about doing a system with 45 buckets in it. Five lights in a row with 9 buckets under each light. Its still kinda up in the air. Since i started topping, they bush out so much that i might not have room to even cram them in there.

The question remains though, would it be better to have 45 plants compared to 30 if you didnt top and did a quick veg. Or perhaps you did top and they are just really crowded. What do you think snype?

 

[mjkelly93]

I have another question kinda off the subject. Snype do you do any lollipopping of the plants or removal of excess branches and leaves? If so, how do you choose what to chop and when to start removal?

Ive been reading alot about lollipopping lately but id like to hear your opinion on the subject. The last go around ended up with a lot of whispy flowers from underdeveloped and hidden branches. Id like to forego that this time around and let those nutrients and light refocus its energy on the dominant branches/colas.

 

[Snype]

The question remains though, would it be better to have 45 plants compared to 30 if you didnt top and did a quick veg. Or perhaps you did top and they are just really crowded. What do you think snype?

I can't even comprehend that many plants in 1 system. The way that you grow the plants is going to depend on the strain that you are growing. I would assume that you wouldn't top them and do a quicker VEG if they were really close.

I have another question kinda off the subject. Snype do you do any lollipopping of the plants or removal of excess branches and leaves? If so, how do you choose what to chop and when to start removal?

Ive been reading alot about lollipopping lately but id like to hear your opinion on the subject. The last go around ended up with a lot of whispy flowers from underdeveloped and hidden branches. Id like to forego that this time around and let those nutrients and light refocus its energy on the dominant branches/colas.

This is all going to depend on how much light that you are using. With 1,000 watt lighting and plants to around 40", I do prune all the bottom branches at about 12 days into flower. I might do some more of those middle branches at 3 weeks of flowering.

At day 25 of Flower, I start to defoliate my leaves at the top of the canopy to let in light to everything that I can. I do this in stages until the end of harvest. It is very important to defoliate those leaves and let all that light penetrate your canopy or else you will end up with crazy larf.

 

[DapperDon]

My only concern would be the amount of air that you would be adding in there with all that space. If I was to personally run that system, I would run an Alita AL-60 for every 2 (18 Gallon Containers) and I would place 6 air stones in each container spread out. Let us know how it works out for you. I like the idea of a system like that. I was working on one that holds 16.5 gallons. I would have to design some sort of lid for it.

I chose to form my own container with the carbon fiber so that there would be minimal flex in the container once it was filled with water. That is something that I feel is the main cause for uni-seals and bulkheads to fail. Plus I get the added benefit of being able to use 5 gallon lid/net pots. I decided to go with the solid walled net pots because of something I picked up from a Heath Robinson thread where he states that the main cause of cord roots is from using net pots with perforated side walls.
I have also decided to go with a Danner Pondmaster Ap-100 to push the 9" diffuser disc at the Epicenter as well as one 12" Alita sintered stone in each container. The Ap-100 has a higher performance rating than the Alita-60 which was needed.

http://www.alita.com/literature/AlitaLinearPumpCatalog.pdf

http://www.dannermfg.com/Store/Products/Danner/PID-04580.aspx

My Epicenter also has a 25' stainless steel wort chiller as well as a manifold for the pump return that contains my Tri-Meter probes. To push the system I have a Danner mag 1250 pump on a rheostat with an aeration propeller added complete with a pressure gauge. Behind that is a venturi injector with a bypass so that the water coming out of the manifold isn't a full blown geyser. The system has a dedicated 55 gallon R/O top off rez for the UC as well as a central 55 gallon rez that I have a 1/4hp chiller hooked up to that the wort chillers branch out from to cool the Veg and Bloom systems. I have 8" & 6" Vortex S-Line fans with Phresh filters. The last thing I am sitting on the fence about is the lights. I was planning on a singe 1000w per 4 sites and going to 2 if I decided to connect the other half of the system and expand it. I made extra containers and bought the extra gear just in case I accidentally become good at this. I am still on the fence about the light systems but I am leaning on the Solis Tek 1000 as I have 2 ballasts from them running Solis Tek bulbs in an 8" Raptor hood or the Sun Systems ACDE. But I just wanted to start out small as this is all for me and my girls own personal fun. I have Z E R O intention of making any new "friends" or making any money with this at all. The entire reason behind this was that all my connections are either out of the game or live in other states now and I do not want the exposure every time I run out. So after deciding to eliminate all the middlemen and grow my own, I stumble onto your tutorials and have been lurking for the best part of a couple years taking notes and reading everything I can get my hands on. I still have to build my Veg A and B systems as your tutorials for that don't have as much detail about them compared to this. But I have zero ego into any of this and when I can see complete n00bs grow some fantastic flowers because of your instructions, I have no problem paying extreme close attention. It is always those hard headed fuckers that cannot seem to follow instructions after they ask you for help who always have a failed/destroyed grow. Some people have to ice skate uphill I guess. So thanks for everything you are doing to help the community and those of us not to goddamned hip and cool anymore to learn how to do this.

 

[Snype]

I chose to form my own container with the carbon fiber so that there would be minimal flex in the container once it was filled with water. That is something that I feel is the main cause for uni-seals and bulkheads to fail. Plus I get the added benefit of being able to use 5 gallon lid/net pots. I decided to go with the solid walled net pots because of something I picked up from a Heath Robinson thread where he states that the main cause of cord roots is from using net pots with perforated side walls.
I have also decided to go with a Danner Pondmaster Ap-100 to push the 9" diffuser disc at the Epicenter as well as one 12" Alita sintered stone in each container. The Ap-100 has a higher performance rating than the Alita-60 which was needed.

http://www.alita.com/literature/AlitaLinearPumpCatalog.pdf

http://www.dannermfg.com/Store/Products/Danner/PID-04580.aspx

My Epicenter also has a 25' stainless steel wort chiller as well as a manifold for the pump return that contains my Tri-Meter probes. To push the system I have a Danner mag 1250 pump on a rheostat with an aeration propeller added complete with a pressure gauge. Behind that is a venturi injector with a bypass so that the water coming out of the manifold isn't a full blown geyser. The system has a dedicated 55 gallon R/O top off rez for the UC as well as a central 55 gallon rez that I have a 1/4hp chiller hooked up to that the wort chillers branch out from to cool the Veg and Bloom systems. I have 8" & 6" Vortex S-Line fans with Phresh filters. The last thing I am sitting on the fence about is the lights. I was planning on a singe 1000w per 4 sites and going to 2 if I decided to connect the other half of the system and expand it. I made extra containers and bought the extra gear just in case I accidentally become good at this. I am still on the fence about the light systems but I am leaning on the Solis Tek 1000 as I have 2 ballasts from them running Solis Tek bulbs in an 8" Raptor hood or the Sun Systems ACDE. But I just wanted to start out small as this is all for me and my girls own personal fun. I have Z E R O intention of making any new "friends" or making any money with this at all. The entire reason behind this was that all my connections are either out of the game or live in other states now and I do not want the exposure every time I run out. So after deciding to eliminate all the middlemen and grow my own, I stumble onto your tutorials and have been lurking for the best part of a couple years taking notes and reading everything I can get my hands on. I still have to build my Veg A and B systems as your tutorials for that don't have as much detail about them compared to this. But I have zero ego into any of this and when I can see complete n00bs grow some fantastic flowers because of your instructions, I have no problem paying extreme close attention. It is always those hard headed fuckers that cannot seem to follow instructions after they ask you for help who always have a failed/destroyed grow. Some people have to ice skate uphill I guess. So thanks for everything you are doing to help the community and those of us not to goddamned hip and cool anymore to learn how to do this.

Sounds pretty nice! You sound like you know what you are doing. Yours is a completely different animal than this but sounds amazing. I'd love to see some pictures sometime if it's not too much to ask. I've been trying to build a bigger system for bigger plants but there's always a piece that needs to be built that I can't figure out. Hope you pull some monsters in there.

As far as the VEG-A. There's not much to explain. It's a 2x4' Bontanicare White E&F tray that they sell a lid with holes on it. You just let the pots hang and flood the REZ at the right times with T5 lighting. What works in my conditions is flooding the REZ every 6 hours for the first 3 or 4 days, the 5 day I flood every 3 hours, the 6th day I flood every 2 hours and the 7th day I flood every hour. Your roots will tell you when to up the cycle. I will go into more details about this within the next 30 days with pictures.

 

[DapperDon]

Ha! This system has its "roots" from everything you have taught me. I just protracted it. I will admit that being an engineer as well as a custom fabricator makes it a lot easier to overcome the hurdles of making parts that you need and can't find rather than shoehorning something together for a purpose that it was not intended for and settling on sub par performance. You should give Google Sketch a go. I think it would be a great asset to your tutorials as well as your data/record keeping. Having that baseline to have as a go-to is really valuable when designs and experiments alter from the original. As for your Veg systems, I plan on adapting that for myself as well. I am going to spend some time this week on building what I would call a transitional breakaway net pot. I don't like the idea of stacking smaller net pots inside of bigger ones so my idea is to have a net pot that will dismantle away from the medium (hydroton) and root mass so that the plant can be transplanted into a larger pot without the stacking. Also, what are your thoughts on top feeding during veg?

 

[Snype]

Ha! This system has its "roots" from everything you have taught me. I just protracted it. I will admit that being an engineer as well as a custom fabricator makes it a lot easier to overcome the hurdles of making parts that you need and can't find rather than shoehorning something together for a purpose that it was not intended for and settling on sub par performance. You should give Google Sketch a go. I think it would be a great asset to your tutorials as well as your data/record keeping. Having that baseline to have as a go-to is really valuable when designs and experiments alter from the original. As for your Veg systems, I plan on adapting that for myself as well. I am going to spend some time this week on building what I would call a transitional breakaway net pot. I don't like the idea of stacking smaller net pots inside of bigger ones so my idea is to have a net pot that will dismantle away from the medium (hydroton) and root mass so that the plant can be transplanted into a larger pot without the stacking. Also, what are your thoughts on top feeding during veg?

Sounds great! Glad that I could help! Top feeding during Veg is fine. There are many techniques that can be used so there's no right and wrong was as long as it works well for you.

 

[sweetleaf69]

Thanks for all your hard work putting together all this info. Was pondering your rdwc system and it seems
Like it is now a ten bucket with a control bucket. 2 1000 watt tomato cages to a net. What is the footprint
of the that net. And base system. They just uped our legal limit to 12 so 10 will leave me able to keep a couple mom's. Also u still offer your washer's somewhere.

 

[Snype]

Thanks for all your hard work putting together all this info. Was pondering your rdwc system and it seems
Like it is now a ten bucket with a control bucket. 2 1000 watt tomato cages to a net. What is the footprint
of the that net. And base system. They just uped our legal limit to 12 so 10 will leave me able to keep a couple mom's. Also u still offer your washer's somewhere.

Yeah the system is now 10 buckets. The SCROG in the pictures are 8' x 3.5' with 6" squares but you could size it how you like. If I only had 2,000 watts, I would have made the SCROG 4' x 8' and if I had Gavita style DE bulbs then I would consider widening the system and adding a little length to each pipe to use a 5'x10' foot print. The foot print of the buckets themselves are around 9' with the controller but you can size the system for your specific needs. All reflectors will have a different foot print so it's good to do a reflector test to build your system to the things that you are using. So these are rough dimensions.

You can order the washers here below but you should place your order before they run out. I have to get more manufactured which will take time so anyone considering building a system in the next couple of months should order the washers ASAP.

Northern Roots Grow Supply
207-875-2089

The catalog name is going to be RDWC Neoprene Washer

4 bucket systems = 20 Washers
6 bucket systems = 28 Washers
8 bucket systems = 36 Washers
10 bucket systems = 44 Washers
12 bucket systems = 52 Washers

1-49 washers will be $1.25 each plus shipping

50+ washers will be $1.00 each plus shipping

 

[sweetleaf69]

Thanks for the reply ya I was thinking 2 4×4 top net. Have you done any tests with side lighting. Was thinking about a couple 600 or a led eq. I do live in Vegas so I always battle with the ac. Don't usually run the flower room June, July, August.
I did a dwc once upon a time did have monster growth. If I understand your messages correctly no need 4 a cooler with use of bleach and more air. Along with nice current. Flush what last ten days or week. They probably flush fairly quickly. Because it appears u keep your nutes on the low side. Let the plant shine.
As far as the washers what 4 per and 10 extra 55 or so sound right.

U remind me of a guy back on of that did great dwc cab's. Also did great tutoring threw his blogs.
I am trying to step out of the shadows but not easy this goes against everything I had for my rules.
Now that I have my card and keep it legal I feel more freedom to document my grow.

Long live OG

Long live og

 

[Snype]

Thanks for the reply ya I was thinking 2 4×4 top net. Have you done any tests with side lighting. Was thinking about a couple 600 or a led eq. I do live in Vegas so I always battle with the ac. Don't usually run the flower room June, July, August.
I did a dwc once upon a time did have monster growth. If I understand your messages correctly no need 4 a cooler with use of bleach and more air. Along with nice current. Flush what last ten days or week. They probably flush fairly quickly. Because it appears u keep your nutes on the low side. Let the plant shine.
As far as the washers what 4 per and 10 extra 55 or so sound right.

U remind me of a guy back on of that did great dwc cab's. Also did great tutoring threw his blogs.
I am trying to step out of the shadows but not easy this goes against everything I had for my rules.
Now that I have my card and keep it legal I feel more freedom to document my grow.

Long live OG

Long live og

The side lighting works great but it's hard to get the extra gram/watt with it. It's all about using the light at the right time and then raising the light up or turning the light down. For example, at day 42 Flower I turn all the bulbs down to the 750 setting and at about day 56 I turn them all down to 600's. Same idea for the side lighting but you have to experiment depending on strain. Make sure that your AC can keep your room at around 75F. IF not get a bigger AC. For 2,000 watts in Vegas, you should be fine with 10,000 BTU. Flushing in these systems is pretty quick at about a week or less depending on strain. Your washer numbers are correct, I'd get some extra too.

 

[Snype]

Within the next few days I'm going to look over all my posts and clean up what I need to so that I know all the information is correct. Thousands of washers were sold so I assume some of you are using the systems. I hope that things are going well for you. I'd love to see what you guys are doing so I hope some pictures can come out of this. If anyone needs any questions answered, please feel free to post your questions. I know some of you have PM'd me about details of my VEG-A techniques and I'm going to give more details and pictures in the coming days. I'm still running my 10 Bucket systems with 100% success! There's really nothing to change about this systems as of now but I want to get the vertical systems tutorial here because some of you were interested in them. For those who don't want to build the systems, I'll be offering all of the pieces already built for you in the next 30 days. Stay tuned...

 

[maryjane481]

Hi Snype, love your work. I'm about to build a 4 plant system. My question, why do we need the filter? Is there anything in the system that can clog besides the filter.

 

[Catatafish]

Yes, it can clog the water pump if the other filter doesnt catch it.

Buy the filter. broken roots and such, possibly pieces of rock/hydroton and such i have found thus far.

 

[Snype]

where did you learn how to grow in dwc? how would you say this compares to ffof in taste and everything? ive always wanted to try dwc but i have no idea how to do it

I learned to grow RDWC and DWC from putting plants into buckets and logging data. My first experience with DWC was a mistake that I made in 2002 where I had a plant in a 5 Gallon Bucket on a top feed. When the roots hit the solution, the plants went crazy but I had many things to learn before I got it right. It took years for me to figure it out. My techniques will make it very simple as long as you follow them. I've given my techniques out to people in person who've never grown a plant and they got 7.5 pounds in 2 of my systems on their first crop with 4,000 watts. I think RDWC grows are the easiest form of hydroponics as long as you have the right system and pumps and nutrient profile. As far as the taste, my RDWC plants taste better than my FFOF plants and everyone else says the same thing. I understand hydro much more than soil and it's easier for me to get flavors out of RDWC crops because I'm able to look at data and numbers that my systems are telling me in regards to my nutrient solution. Come and join my RDWC Grow Along in the Hydro Section and I can help walk you through the process.

Hi Snype, love your work. I'm about to build a 4 plant system. My question, why do we need the filter? Is there anything in the system that can clog besides the filter.

The filter is there so that you don't get anything going through your pump. Sometimes you can get root matter or other things depending on what you put in the system. Things do end up building up in the filter. You basically are protecting your pump by using the filter.