Small,yellow and lightly brown spots on fan leaves

[smellmyfinger]

Hey all.....I have a girl that was started from seed,and is probably 3 weeks(or so)into bloom and I've noticed over the past 3-4 days that the plant has a good number of tiny yellow,with a hint of brown in 'em,spots all over the majority of the fan leaves.
She is either a Bubblegum or Gypsy's Kiss(BubblegumxSumango)I do believe,started from bean in home-mixed soil(Basic organic potting w/Blood Meal,Bone Meal,Happy Frog Bat Guano and Bio-Tone Starter Plus{w/Mycorrhizae}-it's worked well for me so far with my other plants/strains),kept under 24hrs of floro then switched to 12/12 of MH for 1 1/2 weeks then 12/12HPS up to present.
I feed her with Fox Farm nutes,Alaskan Fish Fertilizer and Hygrozyme every other watering,pH checked and adjusted each time.I also flush every 2 weeks or so.
After I noticed the spotting i flushed the soil thouroughly last night,then once more tonight followed by a LIGHT feeding of Tiger Bloom,Super Bloom and Hygrozyme.
All my other plants,7 more in soil and 10 in hydro are coming along quite nicely.I've had zero pest problems as well as no mold or diseases either.The affected girl is quite healthy otherwise,flowering nicely and accumulating the initial light frosting of trichromes.The leaves themselves have a nice healthy dark green color to them as well.
I've had no luck pinpointing what the problem is,does anyone have any ideas?

 

[20kw dreams]

With no pics it's hard to tell, although...as much as I hate to say it because I get pissed that people call everything this problem...it sounds like an Mg def. Especially since it's only one strain out of many, and the description sounds like an Mg deficiency.

.4ml/gal of epsom salts gives you 10ppm Mg. Foliar the deficient plants with 1ml/gal epsom salts, then also add another 1ml to the feed water. This definately won't hurt, but if it doesn't stop then it's not an Mg deficiency.

Epsom salts can be purchased at any grocery or drug store.

 

[HeadyPete]

Definitely not mag def. Don't bother with the epsom salts and remember, they are salts, so too much and you can risk doing more harm. Mag def shows fading of the green in the leaves on the upper part of the plant, while retaining dark green veins (no spotting). If it fades evenly (and from the bottom) it is N def, but the green veins are the for sure sign of mag def.

Mag def:

Sounds like it could be K, P or even cal def, but unless we see photos, can't tell.

Cal def:

It is also possible that this particular girl wants more than her siblings.

What are your ph readings of fert solution and runoff? If you don't know, please test and let us know. It is very important.

 

[smellmyfinger]

it definitely looks more like the 2nd picture except the spots are smaller,much more yellow and all very circular in their shape rather than blotchy. There is also no discoloration on the rest of the leaf,including the area directly surronding.
sorry no pic-cams broke.
pH of my H2O(tap)was 7-7.5 which I adjusted to 5.5. I did not check the pH of nutrient solution but it was relatively weak and water was adjusted prior.
Today it looks the same,no progression and zero indications of it spreading to my other girls.

 

[HeadyPete]

Sounds like early minor cal def.

You need to measure the ph of your runoff to get a better idea of soil ph. This should read 6.5 and you need to adjust your fert solution every time to get it there. If your runoff is 6.0, raise the ph of the fert to 7.0 to even out at 6.5. I suspect your ph is low, locking out calcium. Fish fert is way acidic.

Here is a chart:

If your ph is good then you are not giving enough cal and need to add CalMag or liquid bone meal or something with calcium.

If your ph is out then you need to fix this and there is probably enough calcium in your tap water to feed them. If there is not, use CalMag or something. PH still needs to be correct at all times. Every time it isn't, you hurt the plant, and nutrients become unavailable to the plant.

 

[20kw dreams]

Except that he is not in soil, he is in a soilless mix. and the data you are citinig is often misunderstood. Soils mean SOILS, and the soilless aspect of the chart, which you did not show, was done in peat. I believe it is originally

Mg deficiency is characterized by Interveinal chlorosis. IME Mg def does not show up like in that pic, but between the veins first, from interveinial yellowing to necrosis. I get it alot too, and fix it every time with a dash of epsom salts. A small dose of epsom salts is not going to hurt whatsoever. If I were to recommend 1tsp, which I often see recommended, then perhaps.

Does it look like this?

This is a sure fire Mg def from my own gallery. Cure was epsom salts, foliar and feed 1/4tsp/gal

 

[MynameStitch]

Hey 20K, not saying you are wrong; but that is the first ever mag def I have seen like that before........

 

[smellmyfinger]

no it doesn't look like that.....shit I wish I had a cam....they are round,almost perfectly so,very yellow-only a hint of brown but scattered throughout the leaves. Very spot-like. Remainder of leaf is a perfect shade of green otherwise.Plant production hasn't been affected...

 

[HeadyPete]

Sorry 20K, it's not mag def, neither is that picture you posted. Fading green with dark green veins. If the veins are fading too, it's not mag def. Soil, soiless, it is early calcium def and I'll bet it's because the ph is too low.

Here are many charts for soil, soiless, hydro and they all show cal lockout under 6 ph.

http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/nutrientavailability.htm

Anyway, I'm not commenting further till I get some facts from smellmyfinger.

Not a great pic, but one showing mag def nevertheless - notice the dark green veins in the faded leaf?:

 

[smellmyfinger]

I'm gonna try to get a buddy over w/his cam.........will return then w/pH of nute solution as well

 

[whatsthatsmell]

perfectly circle damage on the leaf?? Sounds like a thripe or pest problem sucking shit out of the leaf... are there silvery specs on there also? Have you looked under them to see if you have mites? Could be a micro nute def, but really would need pics to know for sure.....

 

[20kw dreams]

Sorry 20K, it's not mag def, neither is that picture you posted. Fading green with dark green veins. If the veins are fading too, it's not mag def. Soil, soiless, it is early calcium def and I'll bet it's because the ph is too low.

Here are many charts for soil, soiless, hydro and they all show cal lockout under 6 ph.

http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/nutrientavailability.htm

Anyway, I'm not commenting further till I get some facts from smellmyfinger.

Not a great pic, but one showing mag def nevertheless - notice the dark green veins in the faded leaf?:

I wouldn't say I knew the source of a problem, unless I KNEW the source of the problem. The DEFINITION of deficiency is the deficiency being cured by the deficient element. No other changes, nothing. I think the picture may be decieving, as the veins don't come out as yellow as they were. Either that, or perhaps I had alread fixed the problem and the chlorotic patches had died off, while the remaining leaf area had retained it's luster.

I thought it was at least something to show smellmyfinger.

I have never seen an Mg deficiency which the entire leaf went chlorotic in anywhere near the time it took for the interveinal region to become necrotic. Those pictures you showed of the Mg def are clearly a combination N and Mg, with possibly a K def. In other words, the plant was obviously being underfed.

I think all too often there is more then one problem, with the exception of a flat out Mg def or N def.

I would go back and look at those charts you and others so frequently present as support. Clearly Ca s available in soilless mixes below 6.0. Besides that fact, those charts are not MJ specific at all. I don't know if you've seen charts which show the different uptake rates of different Genus with different pH levels, but the range is insanely broad, with somoe plants taking up nutrients only around 4.0, others prefer 8's. I am not trying to argue that MJ is so extreme, but I have not been able to find the primary source of that data, which is so often preached as truth. I would offer it even depends on cultivar, or at least regional origin.

That last pic especially The colorful one for Marijuana! LMAO! In what medium?

Anyways, sorry, I just enjoy a good argument

Smellmyfinger - Do this for me, and I highly doubt anyone will argue this technique. It's called a "pour-thru". Water your plants well with your standard ph'ed fertilizer solution if you are ferting every watering, or with whatever water you use if you water between fert. Now, let them drain for about 30-60min or so, you don't need to be exact with the time. Now, pour another 1/4 cup of nutrient solution into the pots, and catch some of the runoff after the first bit has drained.Measure your pH and EC from this runoff. Your EC should be around 2.5 to 4.5 using this method. It seems high, but it's the method which you are using to determine EC that gives us our limits, not he reading itself. pH...well I think can be anywhere from 5.5 to 6.5 and have grown as such and done wonderfully...but obviously there is some dipute.

You may in fact get deficiency signs at an acceptable ph if you are deficient. Perhaps the high ph values some people suggest are more a matter of them having to be within a range which promotes uptake of a deficient mineral? Just a thought.

Alright, I'm done

Peace

 

[MynameStitch]

Hey 20K, normally a magnesium deficiency is one of the easiest to diagnosis; because the leaves veins remain green while the rest of the leaves yellow nearly 95% of the time this is what it looks like.

Nitrogen and Magnesium is the 2 most common nutrient issues weather it's from lockout or not feeding enough of the 2 elements.

The picture petey showed was the difference in showing what a MAG issue looks like to a nitrogen issue; the leaf on the left is mag, the one on the right is nitrogen.

Not arguing with you, just giving you my 2 cents on the matter

BTW, that sucks balls your crop got ripped by the county mounty's; they got nothing else better to do than go play " Find the marijuana plants"

Rather than hide and go seek; it's find and go rip!

 

[Kr@kEn]

Check for spider mites and webs.

If it isn't spider mites then it's probably overfert of micro lockout due to high soil PH.