Small Breeding project...Point me in the right direction

[HammieChronic]

Hi guys....

Thanks for any help you can provide. I am an OG refugee, but have always been very thankful for the great advice everyone offers. You'll never hear a bad word from me....

Here's my deal:

I love the strain Rene with all of the cannabis in my heart. It may be the greatest strain of all time, but NO ONE can get it in a pure version from what I know (atleast in seed form, but even a cutting wouldn't work)

So I bought highend from Legends Seeds..... Rene X Blueberry

Word is there are 3 phenos.... a majority blueberry, a nice cross and what appears to be a black leafed, nearly pure pheno of Rene.....

and I would like to make seeds to alienate the Rene cross and try and stabilize it....

Kind of a lofty goal for a guy in a closet huh???

So what I would like to do is take my most "Rene" female and cross it with the most Rene male....

That should generate some seeds.....

But now what???? How do I stabilize this strain. All seeds should show Rene traits, but not all I realize.

So here are my questions:

1)Do I grow out the seeds, find the most chronic Rene Phenos and cross them back again. making f-4's....and continue on....and if I do, when does it become an IBL or a stable f-1 (How many generations of breeding?)

2) if yes to #1, how many generations should I do this for (obvious answer being "until all plants show Rene traits everytime")

3) Should I grow out all MY seeds, find a killer Rene Male and cross it back to my original female???

4) Would it be better to find a Rene F-3 female (my seeds) and pollinate using my original male pollen???

5) Is there a great way to determine male pheno without the flowers???

Thanks as always....I hope I get some help to stablize this strain that is truely the stuff of legends....

Also, I have read the breeding sticky's...but there in Greek and I don't speak it.....so sorry to claim ignorance

 

[fjällhöga]

heja hc
It would be a good way to start by increasing the original f1 beans , the more beans you sprout, the better the chance of finding what you want.
[I bought 5 packs of ssH for my haze breeding project]

1)grow out as many as you can, clone them,label the as normal.
Setup an extra room for flowering out the males as you identified your desired Phenotypes (use more than one male to insure genetic diversity).
For the females, selectfor the most Rene influenced girl.If choosen the parents, cross them for the f2.
Grow out 25 or more f2s,treat them as the f1....... keep all rene looking males with top vigor and easy maintainance.
Search a Rene influenced fem for keeping an eye what you have done with making f2s.
At this point you can compare ya f1 fem with the f2 !which one is better ?If the f2 is the winner you are definately on the right road and are up to make f3s.Keep all fems alive (f1,2,3) and all male pollen stored(f1,2,3) in case you fucked sth up and you have to start from the beginning or from an earlier generation.
Fj

 

[Bonzo]

Good info, how do you store your pollen?


bonz

 

[fjällhöga]

In glass vials stored in the fridge,so you can use it over years.
Fj
PSollen have to be bone dry before stored in the vials so no mold can settle in

 

[Guest]

take pollen from all the f1 boys and mix it together then pollinate 1 bud on all the f1 fems, grow out those f2 seeds and you will find the genetic equation behind rene, but really what you are looking for is the ones that have that rich blueberry pie aroma and strong buzz that rene is famous for.. so in the f2 gen my advice is to select all the males that have the most desirable aromas and mix them again and store the pollen until you can ascertain which f2 females are the keepers, take your time and I would recommend using as many females and males in each generation as possible, I think the rene was a cross of 2 fairly inbred lower vigor lines so in order to keep the vigor up through the generations you need to keep as many parents as possible in each generation, I think you will find in the f2 gen that it is already fairly stable and not too many phenos will show

 

[HammieChronic]

Thanks so much guys....

So basically (not to genralizem, but):

Find the best males and females that fit my criteria and breed them....

Grow those seeds out and cross them....and keep going until the seeds all show the traits I am looking for.....

Keep all generations incase something I wanted didn't move forward.....

Basically, the goal is to isolate the desirable pheno in any males and females used and continue to cross the best of each other until that pheno can be grown on a regular basis.

2 more quick questions:

1) Can someone briefly describe the cubing method for breeding? I've heard about it but never read about it

2) C-Ray suggested mixing all Male pollen togeather? I assume that this will possibly increase hybrid vigor, as the female plant is then generating several different genetic combinations...or is there another reason, besides having 3-4 fathers for diversity within a specific pheno

 

[Bonzo]

how long does it take to become bone dry, and how do you achieve the drying prosess?

yhanks for all the info and im liking this thread.



bonz

 

[HammieChronic]

Is the pollen similar to kief....I mean, just leave it for a day or two, then razor blade it to a film cannister and save for a rainy day???

 

[Guest]

maybe you might wanna get a your hands on a Rene cutting as well to backcross too.

 

[fjällhöga]

mök pollen wont get you high ....

 

[HammieChronic]

Well yeah, I realize pollen won't get you high....lol thinking about that....

I meant the process of procuring pollen is similar to taking Kief from a plant....

Get it all spread out on glass, let it dry for a day or two, scrape it up and store it in an airtight container....

Yes/no????

 

[HammieChronic]

I'd love a cutting...perfect reason to start a perpetual grow....but from what i know, Rene clones are held by Hells Angels in BC.... (hersey maybe)

I am not a Hells angel...
I wouldn't consider trying to bring back to the states.

If anyone in the US has one, I'd love to talk though

 

[Guest]

the reason for using many parents is because in the process of inbreeding you will have genetic information (alleles) spread out between many plants, a reduction of 1 plant for instance may result in the loss of a specific allele that is responsible for a specific trait, this is even more important in small scale breeding

I like to collect pollen on a big piece of waxpaper, then tilt the wapaper slightly to let the pollen sacs and miscellaneous debris fall off leaving only the pollen behind, at this point you can let it airdry for 1 day then fold the waxpaper and put in a small envelope, label the envelope and put into a jar with a little rice and into the fridge, or you can take the fresh pollen and get some gel-caps and put a little into each gel cap then into a jar with some rice and into the freezer...in the fridge pollen should last 6-12 months, in the freezer up to 2 years or more...if you go the freezer route you can pull out a gel cap as needed but let it defrost at room temp for an hour before using, I prefer the freezer route since the pollen lasts longer

the rene clone is low yielder and is lower in vigor, I know some folks who have it but none of them are HA as far as I know, I think you will get good results working with the highend seeds since the BB will add some yield and vigor to it

 

[Bonzo]

So 2 years is pretty much max pollen lifespan?


bonz

 

[Guest]

that's what I figure based on my experiences

 

[Guest]

C-Ray

C-Ray

C-ray,why do you mix the male gizm all together.Don't you think that you should go for that male that just stands above the rest for the trait desired?

 

[kanebosem]

i made some highend f2 seeds and im very happy with them.
crossed a male into my best female highend.
there are many phenos some resemble the mom and some resemble blueberry while others are heavy yielding indica looking plants.
rumur has it that rene has some himalian genetics so im also looking out for a lanky sativa but didnt find her yet....
the plan is to sprout about 100 of these seeds in the next months to find an even more special mom.
so far the plants are very good but not as good as the original mom i found.
but im sure that if i try many seeds i will find something as good.
good luck with your project, and here are some pics of highend f2

 

[Guest]

C-ray,why do you mix the male gizm all together.Don't you think that you should go for that male that just stands above the rest for the trait desired?

in the f1 generation it is hard to see all the genes, some are masked by others, that is why in the f1 generation I recommend using many parents...so you get a whole lot of genes and gene combinations to choose from in the f2 gen...this applies really if you are starting with a solid f1 with minimal phenotypes, if you have an f1 with lots of phenotypes then you will want to use fewer parents, also if you find many many phenotypes in the f2 generation it will show the truth that perhaps that f1 was not really an f1 after all

 

[Guest]

i made some highend f2 seeds and im very happy with them.
crossed a male into my best female highend.
there are many phenos some resemble the mom and some resemble blueberry while others are heavy yielding indica looking plants.
rumur has it that rene has some himalian genetics so im also looking out for a lanky sativa but didnt find her yet....
the plan is to sprout about 100 of these seeds in the next months to find an even more special mom.
so far the plants are very good but not as good as the original mom i found.
but im sure that if i try many seeds i will find something as good.
good luck with your project, and here are some pics of highend f2

good show bro, what can you tell us about the aromas of the various phenos?

 

[Bonzo]

Howdy kanebosem, What are the purple ones in the second pic.

bonz

sorry, i didnt read the part about the blueberry.