I got my soil tests back. I have 12 spots and tested 3 of them. Each spot is about 2 yards. I had spectrum test three spots #one,two and three. Number one the plant did not do well at all last year and spots two and three performed very well on average with the other 9 spots. The soil test shows that spot # one isn't much different from the others so I think I either had a sick plant I planted their or I did have some ants in that spot and another spot. I am looking into nematodes as it sounds like the ants were farming insects in the soil and may of hurt my root system? I also had logan lab do a test in spot # two so I can cross reference with last years logan test. I am having a hard time reading spectrums test as it is new two me but I am slowly working through it. It looks like i'm low in cu and n maybe b and zn. My Mg looks pretty high again. I did apply gypsum a couple times last year but it's still high. I also attached the water test from my well. My well does test positive for coliform. Was debating of running my water for the garden through a uv light? What do you guys think. I always appreciate any and all input. Sorry I haven't contributed much I'm still in the learning phase of balancing soil and minerals but I have been growing successfully for many years and will contribute more tips and things I have learned over the years more often.
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Slownickel lounge, pull up a chair. CEC interpretation
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I guess you may have to ask the goose but learning would apparently explain such a transformation. You must have been reading since I raised the subject. I don't think you can learn that one by pissing on the electric fence.
brown_thumb
Active member
Boys... stop your bickering or papa is gonna pull this car over and whip both your asses. 
I guess you may have to ask the goose but learning would apparently explain such a transformation. You must have been reading since I raised the subject. I don't think you can learn that one by pissing on the electric fence.
Transformation? You're lost, sorry.
New reading? Yep, been reading some amazing research on Fe/Mn ratios from France. Nothing about soil microbiology.
Did that Elaine stuff for years, did oodles of microbial testing in my farms. No results. Sorry. Between my cover crops, worm castings, compost and nutritional balancing, the place is cranking.
Thanks for checking in though!
leadsled
Member
No, not implying to use more.
Just use a foliar until the source of problem is fixed (Na+K>10).
Would not suggest to apply more Mn to the soil without considering the history of Mn amendments and max application rates.
slownickel, You growing some cannabis plants????
Or just limes? Where are the photos???
Just the enormous contrast between your two statements. You didn't notice?
I have nothing to do with Elaine Ingham nor her teachings. I am fully accepting of the full gambit of mineralization, the use of organic matter and microbial/plant organic acid and with predation nutrient mineralization (cycling). [briefly put]
Lead,
Doing paper work. The laws are happening. Hard to play guerrilla here. So just a couple of plants on the balcony til we're legal.
In soils that are made of Fe, I have never seen a problem applying Mn to the soil. There are a couple of growers that use 350 lbs to the acre yearly of MnSO4, like clock work. Going on 5 years now. Their crops are some of the best in the world (not cannabis).
With that said, Greenhands, Hazy and others will surely chip in regarding the constant application of metals to the soil, most especially Mn, frequently to the soil. Reasonable applications up front to the soil often help. I don't believe in full corrective dosages for most metals. Not necessary.
Not a real big fan of foliar metals either, they are not mobile and can cause real weird flavor profiles. My position is if you have a deficiency, you missed the boat. Research has proven many times over that foliar applications often do not change yields. The reason is that there is so little of the nutrient in a foliar application versus the real amounts that the crop needs to close to maximizing genetic potential.
Research has shown foliar and soil applications done together are the optimum method of application of metals. Foliar metals does very little other than paint a pretty picture.
Applying Mg foliar for example, fantastic. Super mobile.
For the time being, I am sticking with my limes...
Here on this forum I am just trying to help others by getting them to do trials so that they can learn based on using a bit of science. I do the same on several forums, mostly non cannabis though. Just paying it forward guy! Learning lots too!
Thanks for chipping in!
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Sorry, didn't notice.
What soil analysis do you recommend for measuring phosphorus in an alkaline vs acid soil?
Are you measuring ORPS at different soil depths? I did that many years ago. Excellent indicator of aerobic microbiology and really seemed to correlate pretty darned well with root mass.
Me personally, I am not one of those mineralization folks and I am organic! I can't afford that idea even in perennials, and so far, haven't seen it work out for most folk.
In annuals, as we have seen from all the dolomite, seashells, crabcakes and other woowoo baloney testimony on these pages, substantiated by soil analysis by growers running teas, inoculates, woo and moo, and still, no matter how much biology you applied, there was no where near enough Ca. How do we know? Because everyone saw response.
Saw your scholarly article on exudates and was impressed by your editing process on the Logical Gardener forum. That going to be part of a new book? You really went to town with all those references and all.
Wish I had that kind of time....
to chime in on the greenhouse film. From what I remember back when I was researching it. Most of the greenhouse film has a uv blocker in it to help with the life of the film and heat. It was also once thought that blocking uv also helped suppress pest insects such as white flys, thrips ect.. not sure how true that is. Seems about the same from what I observed. A lot of the films block or a absorbs rays under 360-390nm. From what i've read uv-a uv-b and uv-c light spectrum are very beneficial for terpens. I have experimented with all types of Gh film and the difference isn't much but when you're going for gold everything counts. I live in a mild climate
led05
Chasing The Present
Your right on all above... to elaborate a bit.... Many insects use UV to navigate (bees are a prime example, you ever notice how clumsy they are inside a GH..?) - reptiles see in UV as well as many people know more commonly...
I wish I lived in a mild climate, the wife and family keep me here, for now ;0
I fkin hate thrips btw, they love peppers it seems more than anything else - I'm not also sure how effective but there is some effect - it's not a wives tale, good science behind it --- I mean, think of a bug zapper
Well mineralization has more than one meaning (confusing at times). Johnny mineralized his garden with gypsum then the acids released by fungi mineralized that into a form taken up by archaea which were consumed by flagellates mineralizing them into an ion sucked up by the root
I do not run tests for microbes. I use direct microscopy for microbial counts/assays.
I had a lab years back using Mehlich 2. It was crap...a huge waste of my hard earned money. When I was farming which I have quit now (as I told you; sold farm) I evolved from intricate measurements and lots spent on lab testing to a eureka moment to use living soil. My inputs are a long story but were mostly acquired locally. I was very satisfied with the produce, as were my customers, who only thought there was some improvement.
During this period I also experimented with hydroponics in homemade highly oxygenated systems. We pumped the soluble nutrients mixed at very high levels. The floral clusters from that were 4-5 inches in diameter, the likes I've not seen photos of often. However, the quality was suspect and disease pressure was overwhelming.
No book. I've never written one.
Thank you for your note. Don't forget to say 'I think' sometimes
led05
Chasing The Present
Well mineralization has more than one meaning (confusing at times). Johnny mineralized his garden with gypsum then the acids released by fungi mineralized that into a form taken up by archaea which were consumed by flagellates mineralizing them into an ion sucked up by the root
I do not run tests for microbes. I use direct microscopy for microbial counts/assays.
I had a lab years back using Mehlich 2. It was crap...a huge waste of my hard earned money. When I was farming which I have quit now (as I told you; sold farm) I evolved from intricate measurements and lots spent on lab testing to a eureka moment to use living soil. My inputs are a long story but were mostly acquired locally. I was very satisfied with the produce, as were my customers, who only thought there was some improvement.
During this period I also experimented with hydroponics in homemade highly oxygenated systems. We pumped the soluble nutrients mixed at very high levels. The floral clusters from that were 4-5 inches in diameter, the likes I've not seen photos of often. However, the quality was suspect and disease pressure was overwhelming.
No book. I've never written one.
Thank you for your note. Don't forget to say 'I think' sometimes
Obsessing over any one piece of the puzzle leads to failure...
Microbial life, soil health, water quality, weather, sun, temp, humidity etc etc etc - then all the elements out there interacting with each other, not to mention a living thing ---- FAR too much to try and have anything perfect, or even close.... Not to mention, perfect is an unknown....
Anyone who has farmed for a profit in a open / competitive global market gets this...
So you do what you can. This involves driving the process and being proactive / preemptive not reactionary...
You spray foliar as part of your process, you prep the soil as part of your process, you fertilize as part of your process, not because a soil test or tissue test told you to, by the time they are back, analyzed and acted upon it's too late, onto next season.... Soil Test and Plant test help you Prepare, understand what you're working with, how you have done, a report card if you will...
GreenHands showed some of the nicest decent scale pictures of healthy plants I've seen in here yet.... I don't know him/her anymore than I do you, but I'd be willing to bet, and I'm a betting man that he/she doesn't obsess over anything in particular and just has a good solid process down, that they stick with and it works for THEM where they are, that is farming, I imagine you know this already too...
The running joke.... I have herpes, just throw some GYPSUM on it.... But Mike is actually right, all joking aside...
Gypsum is like a life vest, and a motor, and fkin CHEAP !!.... It doesn't solve everything but it helps, a lot...
Microbe, some expertise dropped in here with actual testing and nohow would be a great add to an already great thread. I hope you can drop some of your knowledge and quit measuring diks with Slow, I seem to fall into these traps too often as well....
Cockiness, what a virtue and a hindrance
.....
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Obsessing over any one piece of the puzzle leads to failure...
Microbial life, soil health, water quality, weather, sun, temp, humidity etc etc etc - then all the elements out there interacting with each other, not to mention a living thing ---- FAR too much to try and have anything perfect, or even close.... Not to mention, perfect is an unknown....
Anyone who has farmed for a profit in a open / competitive global market gets this...
So you do what you can. This involves driving the process and being proactive / preemptive not reactionary...
You spray foliar as part of your process, you prep the soil as part of your process, you fertilize as part of your process, not because a soil test or tissue test told you to, by the time they are back, analyzed and acted upon it's too late, onto next season.... Soil Test and Plant test help you Prepare, understand what you're working with, how you have done, a report card if you will...
GreenHands showed some of the nicest decent scale pictures of healthy plants I've seen in here yet.... I don't know him/her anymore than I do you, but I'd be willing to bet, and I'm a betting man that he/she doesn't obsess over anything in particular and just has a good solid process down, that they stick with and it works for THEM where they are, that is farming, I imagine you know this already too...
The running joke.... I have herpes, just throw some GYPSUM on it.... But Mike is actually right, all joking aside...
Gypsum is like a life vest, and a motor, and fkin CHEAP !!.... It doesn't solve everything but it helps, a lot...
Microbe, some expertise dropped in here with actual testing and nohow would be a great add to an already great thread. I hope you can drop some of your knowledge and quit measuring diks with Slow, I seem to fall into these traps too often as well....
Cockiness, what a virtue and a hindrance
.....
I cannot disagree with what you stated and it is not that different from what I stated, although wordier. I am not doing any dick comparison, just encouraging critical thinking.
What does the farmer do, who has no access to gypsum or any commercial amendments? I've been there and pushed through with great success. I was fortunate to have a combination of loamy valley bottom (flooded) soil combined with an ancient rock slide creek which provided all the minerals necessary.
I believe the tests of value are tissue tests. The overlooked (sometimes) nutrients are sequestered.
What responsibility are we taking for testing for metals and potential toxins stored in tissues? Perhaps this is happening and I'm just unaware.
caterpillar710
Member
Hard to get that done on cannabis right now but moving forward it'll become easier
For sure most weed is full of nitrates .. flat out not that medicinal
For sure most weed is full of nitrates .. flat out not that medicinal
led05
Chasing The Present
I go heavy on nitrates for corn, and that is about it personally
caterpillar710
Member
Yea most weed is grown conventional and the 1,2 punch is cano3 and kno3 to make big fast growth but it isn't quality
led05
Chasing The Present
Where would a commercial farmer not have access to Gypsum, this thread doesn't really seem to be about the person with 2 plants in the basement, even then, where is there no Gypsum, seems you can get it near everywhere, kind of the point isn't it...?
But, if that's the case, you make due - that's also the point, you find a way with what you have, factoring in what I previously mentioned, within REASON. It sounds as if that's exactly what you did.
If a person lives on bedrock with 2 " of soil on it, perhaps they shouldn't be farming there, right, I'm not talking about some extra veggies for the fam? Or do you push on no matter the circumstance, doesn't seem very enviro friendly or best use of what's available - we can all find "places" that are the exception...For instance the place you describe you farmed in is exponentially more rare than say.... A person without access to Gypsum, no?
Personally I wouldn't ever choose a Bog to farm in for profit or large scale, sounds like you did? How did that work out? Seems to me the place you describes is more fairyland than reality - I'm not saying it isn't true or worked good for you, just very, very uncommon situation (bog with some dreamy mineral creek supplying it exactly what it needs, let me guess you never even had to water either
....) vs. not having avail to fertilizer products - I'm organic btw, at least by most countries definition or tolerances...
Slow, can you give a break down on your preferred micros? I found your ratio in grams a number of pages back, that appeared to be your irrigation mix that you do twice per week, yes? Do you use this same ratio for foliar or are you using a separate micro(s) product for that?
I am sending a sample from the indoor garden and a water sample in on Monday to spectrum. Will be sending an outdoor garden sample in once it isn't frozen solid...
I am sending a sample from the indoor garden and a water sample in on Monday to spectrum. Will be sending an outdoor garden sample in once it isn't frozen solid...
Where would a commercial farmer not have access to Gypsum, this thread doesn't really seem to be about the person with 2 plants in the basement, even then, where is there no Gypsum, seems you can get it near everywhere, kind of the point isn't it...?
But, if that's the case, you make due - that's also the point, you find a way with what you have, factoring in what I previously mentioned, within REASON. It sounds as if that's exactly what you did.
If a person lives on bedrock with 2 " of soil on it, perhaps they shouldn't be farming there, right, I'm not talking about some extra veggies for the fam? Or do you push on no matter the circumstance, doesn't seem very enviro friendly or best use of what's available - we can all find "places" that are the exception...For instance the place you describe you farmed in is exponentially more rare than say.... A person without access to Gypsum, no?
Personally I wouldn't ever choose a Bog to farm in for profit or large scale, sounds like you did? How did that work out? Seems to me the place you describes is more fairyland than reality - I'm not saying it isn't true or worked good for you, just very, very uncommon situation (bog with some dreamy mineral creek supplying it exactly what it needs, let me guess you never even had to water either
What??? Just one question prior to termination of this go no place discussion. Where do you get bog from?
If you do not know what river valley bottomland flooding is and its benefit to farming, then you do not know farming.
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