Slownickel lounge, pull up a chair. CEC interpretation

[led05]

So, PH of the soil is one answer, and the obvious one IMO.

You talking about the alternate source to get nutrients into the plant body? The phloem vs xylem? Speeds up the uptake of slower nutrients to catch up to nitrogen?

I needs to know man!

Foliar to me is as simple and critical as this..

You spray due to leaf analysis - you amend the soil based on soil analysis ---

We're growing plants, not soil....

Our soil and changing it has it's practical limitations, Foliar not so much and it's immediate

 

[caterpillar710]

Y'all on that cause and effect NPK grower mentality with this discussion and it's funny to watch

 

[led05]

Y'all on that cause and effect NPK grower mentality with this discussion and it's funny to watch

I agree, once you know what you have, working with the tests fall by the wayside and it's just part of your normal process.. i.e. not being reactionary -

This is kind of a given though, you were building it up a wee much, no?

 

[caterpillar710]

Still missing the point , now by miles.

 

[MrBungle]

The only other thing I can think of is feeding the plant without disturbing the beneficial bacterias and microbes

 

[led05]

Still missing the point , now by miles.

missing your game or what you think is "the point" - whatever, once again you're by no means the only one that knows what they are doing, even if you believe it so....

My point is always/ has been balance, understanding and being in control, not chasing your tail and not being reactionary to a dynamic growing thing...

whatever you mean by cause and effect or the shifting sands, enjoy your fun Cat....

The rest of us in here will continue to help each other, willingly, without being pompous

 

[caterpillar710]

The only other thing I can think of is feeding the plant without disturbing the beneficial bacterias and microbes

But foliar spray feeds microbes...?

 

[MrBungle]

But foliar spray feeds microbes...?

Does it? I thought thats what teas were for

 

[caterpillar710]

And that right there is exactly why I can keep going in circles saying ya missed the point and you all think like reductionist NPK growers ... if you know you know

 

[hobbyhorse]

Teas don't give me enough control. Every year i used em I ended up with disease.

 

[plantingplants]

...foliar helps catalyze the plants own functions that get soil biology moving which in turn feeds the plant? Vague description becausei dont know or understand those processes.

 

[caterpillar710]

...foliar helps catalyze the plants own functions that get soil biology moving which in turn feeds the plant? Vague description becausei dont know or understand those processes.

Finally got someone with more than two brain cell left huddling together....

Big up yourself ... PM me any time

 

[plantingplants]

Finally got someone with more than two brain cell left huddling together....

Big up yourself ... PM me any time

Fuck off. Don't have to be such a dick to people.

 

[caterpillar710]

Fuck off. Don't have to be such a dick to people.

you know you actually hit the nail on the head but like you said without the scientific mechanisms but who cares once you understand that key point you clearly get the rabbit hole gets deep.

Was trying to give ya some props for coming up with the real answer because every other one was some reductionist NPK mentality that is like 1+1=2 but with plants it doesn't work like that. The idea u can jus make tea and add biology to soil while somewhat true as express in this thread misunderstood as is tea making by most growers...on top of the lame ass obvious answers of well it's available but then is it really? For example K sulfate sucks for foliar ... but look up k acetate foliar availability and over what rH range it can actually move in to the sap because that's another key factor... Enjoy.

 

[reppin2c]

I used that K acetate last season and somehow used 1000 ppm P. And that's the only thing I can contribute it to, other then maybe some tainio.

 

[canna.ballistic]

Firstly, great thread ... read it once, going back through a second time making notes for future reference. Big thanks to everyone who has contributed their knowledge and experience in this thread, especially SlowNickel.

...foliar helps catalyze the plants own functions that get soil biology moving which in turn feeds the plant? Vague description because i dont know or understand those processes.

Could someone please explain the processes on how foliars catalyze the plants own functions to get the soil biology moving (or point us in the right direction to relevant reference material).

This is a really interesting concept which I haven't come across before. I always thought the foliars were just supplementary feeding for the plant itself when the soil was lacking, rather than as a catalyst for the soil biology ... if correct, it probably means we can improve how, what and when we foliar feed. This would nicely complement the information in this thread on optimising the soil quality to grow tasty, healthy plants.

 

[caterpillar710]

Leaf begins exudate cycle. Root exudates control biology....

 

[caterpillar710]

Dang, I left the table and the conversation continued. I had that answer in the bag, next time.

I agree with what Cat is saying. This is where Teaming with microbes fall short IMO. The soil by itself is only so much of the picture. What stimulates root exudes, and the chemistry involved trumps microbial activity imo. Or maybe they go hand in hand, but I have come to the stance chemistry first, biology later.

Thanks for sharing Cat.

Put your aces down first

 

[led05]

Firstly, great thread ... read it once, going back through a second time making notes for future reference. Big thanks to everyone who has contributed their knowledge and experience in this thread, especially SlowNickel.



Could someone please explain the processes on how foliars catalyze the plants own functions to get the soil biology moving (or point us in the right direction to relevant reference material).

This is a really interesting concept which I haven't come across before. I always thought the foliars were just supplementary feeding for the plant itself when the soil was lacking, rather than as a catalyst for the soil biology ... if correct, it probably means we can improve how, what and when we foliar feed. This would nicely complement the information in this thread on optimising the soil quality to grow tasty, healthy plants.

Foliar should be part of the fertilization / management "routine" vs. a reactionary event. It just needs to be done as it's the best way to get Micros to the plant and to stimulate the plants biological processes regardless of what's happening in the soil, it does drive / interact there though too.

Cat is normally right, just an arrogant ass who thinks he's the only one that gets it, what can you do... For many of us the answer you were looking for is as obvious as any other 10 it could have been.

People on this site are normally here for one of 3 reasons:

1) to share, learn and grow with like minded

2) to show off

3) a direct financial incentive and objective

Most I've found fall under #1, quite a few #2 and a handful #3 -- Cat somehow manages to pull off both #2 & #3

Quite a feat big boy

 

[caterpillar710]

I don't think I'm the only one of anything and I don't think I "get" anything more than any one else could but I like to read and experiment in the garden and actually create data sets instead of doing how most forum participants do and just copy what someone posts even though they may not know why they are doing that or even for their situation if it's good.

All the other answers aren't good ones... like I said ... what y'all think you're putting on as available probably isn't moving in to the sap the way you think...