sick seedlings

[bongasaurus]

What STRAIN are you growing? - bagseed
What was the establishing technique? -seed
What is the age of your plants? - pics are from about 16 days from breaking the soil
What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? - veg. 24hr light
What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc) - nothin yet
What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot) - little seedling cups
What substrate/medium are you using? (percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?) - promix with added perlite and a touch of sheep manure
What Nutrient's are you using?How much of each? How Often? *Knowing the brand is very helpful* - i gave then a very light dose of plant prod 20 -20-20 yesterday
What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used? - unknown
What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"? - unknown
What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen?
How often are you watering? - almost every day
When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding? - see above
What size bulb are you using? - 3 42w cfls
What is the distance to the canopy? - about an inch or 3
What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity) - unknown
What is the canopy temperature? - 68 - 75
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range)
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.) - 44 cfm computer fan exhaust
Is the fan blowing directly at plants? - there was one inside for circulation. i took it out because it seemed to be drying out my seedlings way too quick
Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist? - no
Is your water HARD or SOFT? - soft. tap water
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched? - nope
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when? - no
Are plant's infected with pest's? - not that i know of

thread - http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?p=1389557#post1389557

answereed all those to the best of my abitily. so these little guys arent looking so great. their leaves are all curling downward and now starting to yellow a bit with the occasional brown spot. at first i thought it was underwatering. then i thought they might need some nutes. neither have seemed to help at all. just looking for alittle input here. thanks

 

[MynameStitch]

Dude; this is pretty simple; stop watering them so much; they do not need watered everyday; they are badly overwatered..... they are also too young for food; how much food did you use on them with how much water?

Also, rule of thumb; one pot per plant; one will ALWAYS end up taking over the other and the other that does not grow as fast gets the shit end of the deal.

I would also recommend using cups for plants that size untill they get about 3 sets of leaves........

This will help with the over watering; just make sure they have holes in the bottom of the cups though.

You also need to get some pH test strips; because your soil mixture is considered soiless and your pH needs to be 5.5 to 6.3......

Either get a digital pH pen or pool test strips or something from an pet store.
Do NOT buy a soil pH tester, please do not! Those are the biggest waste of money in the world!

But ya; put the fans back in there and let them dry out; since the pot is much bigger; when you water... water where the stem area in so the water goes to the roots and not in an area where there is no roots; when you water in the area where there is no roots it can hold moisture longer and cause the area where roots are at to stay a bit to moist for there root system.

Adding lots of perlite helps a ton with drainage and helping it to drain too; how much perlite did you add?

But ya; they are just over watered right now; you should never water your plants everyday; if you have to cause they dry out so quickly; then it's root bound and time to transplant; but that is just a tip to help ya out in the future.

Dry them babies out; also I would water them with a little bit of water; never let the soil get to where you get drainage out of the bottom; not right now; when they get much bigger and have a better root system; then you can water them when you get drainage.... but right now there root system is only about 3 in long and possibly small root hairs... right now its just the main tap root.

So watering where the stem is with about 2 to 3 oz of water will do you good for a few days.

Forgot to mention too; that when you have plants in that size of pot they grow slower; cannabis likes to grow in a pot and gets it's bust of growth when they root about 75% of the pot... this does help a lot with yield and faster growth. working up to the right pot size is more recommended rather than just putting them in a pot to root for a while......


When they do get big enough; and it's time to water where the drainage comes out the bottom; you need to learn when and when not to water by lifting the pot before and after watering so you know the weight of the pot.

10K has a great thread about learning when to water and lifting the pot.

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=47761

Post by 10K

"Lift the pot"
The "lift the pot" method is a widely practiced, and very accurate method of knowing when to water your container plants.

The best way imho, to know when soil grown potted plants need more watering is by checking how heavy the pots feel. This method is very simple to learn once you get the feel for how light a ready for watering pot of soil feels.

Get an equal size pot and fill it with your soil. The medium should be about as moist as a new bag of potting soil (not dry). Use this planter as a learning tool to get a rough idea of how much the pots should weigh before watering again. The pots with your plants will feel only just slightly heavier when the soil is ready for more water. Pick up one of your planted pots, if its noticably heavy, do not water it until it feels "light". Next time you water a planter, pick it up and feel how much heavier it feels compared to the sample pot of soil.

It only takes a few times picking up the pots until this skill is like a "second nature" to you. You wont even need the sample pot after you get accustomed to the lifting method.

Sure your plants are always putting on more weight as they grow larger, but once you're proficient at lifting the pots, you'll also know how to compensate for the weight of the plants with ease.

I dont know how to better explain this method of knowing when to water, but believe me, anyone who learns this method, will always know when its time to water.

10k

ps... Sticking your finger into your soil is horrible dryness test and should NOT be practiced. There is no way your finger can tell just how moist or wet the soil is deeper down in the planter where the majority of the roots may be suffering from overwatering. Not to mention stressing the plants from you jamming your digit into the medium every day. Arrrgh...Stop doing that !

 

[Blackvelvet]

Sittin in slop. Yeah, don't water everyday.

I would try about 1/2 teaspoon 20-20-20 with every watering.

Water should pour out the bottom quite a bit when you do water.

Adjust the fert water ph after adding the 20-20-20 to about 5.8 to 6

.

 

[MynameStitch]

Black, seriously dude; stop spitting out BS alright!!!

Do not listen to him; he has never even grown a ****ing cannabis plant and thinks he knows all about it, because he went to school for horticulture.

Those babies do not even need fed at that age; now normally you can feed them after 2 weeks of age if they have 3 to 4 sets of leaves; but yours has been overwatered and slow growth and stunted; you do not want to add nutrients to the equation and screw stuff even more.

Let them recover from the over watering before feeding them ime.

1/2 teaspoon would burn the hell out of them with the way they are right now; 20-20-20 is very strong; let alone your first feeding is supossed to be around 1/4 of a teaspoon with a gallon of water; you use 1/2 teaspoon every time you water you got a whole another set of problems; then you will have to flush your plants to rid of the excess nutrients and then you are back to your overwatering ordeal; so do not listen to Black Velvet's bullshit; for all we know he is in cahoots with the government or some piggy who is trying to **** up everyones grow.

 

[Blackvelvet]

1/2 teaspoon 20-20-20 would be about 120 ppm nitrogen. That's not alot.

You know I could be nasty but I won't.

 

[MynameStitch]

You know, we were through this for a long time with you "sprouting" out stuff that was not true and I even backed it up with proof to proove you were wrong,but yet you still "sprout" off junk out of your yap; which could very well be the same yap you eat donuts everyday of the week with. You know what.... I hate cops badly and for someone who has never grown a cannabis plant in there life, but yet thinks they know there stuff...... sounds just like a pig..... especially when we have one on these boards giving out BS information with every post! You got banned before, because you pulled BS like this........

1/2 teaspoon could or could not be 120 ppms; it all depends with how much water you add with it; less water the ppms are up; so that is not accurate at all given the fact there is no amount of water in the equation.

I could be nasty too; but I won't, I am being nice.

 

[whatsthatsmell]

Listen to Stitch, back off the watering, what i have found to be a good trick in finding out whether or not i should water my soil plants....take a finger and somewhere between the plant main stem and the side of the pot (i normally try and find the halfway mark then go closer to the pot edge) and bury your finger up to your second knuckle, if the soil is dry then you need to water, if its moist, you dont have to water.....just remember to fill that hole back in when your done.....

Also, feeding shouldnt start until one of the following has been met...
1) Plant from seed is 30 days old
2) Plant has reached the 4 - 5 internode mark

 

[Core]

Don't listen to BV..aka sproutco ....he's full of it!!

 

[Smoke68]

I've heard the Sproutco stories!
Water with STRAIGHT H20 (ph'ed of course). New leaves will start to emerge and the old leaves will start to rejuvenate (not 100% but they can still photosynthesize).
Soil (not all but some brands), when it is mixed and shipped out in the bags, it already has a nutrient value. Most soils do not require any sort of fertilizers until around week 2-3, sometimes even 4. I believe you have basically nute burned your plants... Nothing major, they have faced stunting and when the problem is fixed they will be back to new again. I also noticed that you had no clue of your PH... That is a huge thing to know!!! Pick up a ten dollar test kit, it will be beneficial to your plants and therefore beneficial to you.
With soil, it is necessary that you flush the soil of salts/nutrient buildup to prevent lockout. But does anybody find it helps to use Clearex to aid flushing?

 

[bongasaurus]

thanks for the responses guys...

but im fairly sure these plants arent overwatered. i think they maybe have been underwatered in the early stages? maybe those pics were takeen right after i did water. the pots are small, they started in peat pods then got transplanted into those which only hold probably about a cup of soil, maybe a little more. each in there own cup, except for the one lil mutant in there with another plant. when i said i watered almost every day, its probably more like every other day, my bad. i do lift them to check. ill get a pic tongiht to show how fast they dry up compared from yestedday. when i did give them food, it was about 1ml to 2 litres of water. they say 6mls to 5 litres is normal. i fed it to all the houseplants at well over full strenght by accident and they seemed to show no ill effects. (but thats besides the point). i think i may just be worring too much but you guys seem to think somethings wrong...

i meant to upload new pics of the plants last night but it wasnt working, ill try again now. still not working. ill try again later

 

[MynameStitch]

Your watering everyday; tyour plants are showing signs of overwatering..... the droopiness of them...... your plants do not need water everyday dude.. back off on the watering....

 

[bongasaurus]

how about every other day? the soil comes away from the edge of the pot...

i guess ill let them really dry out.

heres those pics anyway

 

[MynameStitch]

If they look like they do now; you are watering too much; did you read the link I posted about learning when and when not to water?

You want to lift the pot when it is dry and lift it after you watered them; the smaller ones you do not want to water the entire medium you want to water in the area where the roots are......

do not let them dry out completely to where they will show underwatered; you just want to keep there roots moist; where you are keeping them satrated. Give all my posts a re-read in this thread; mainly the one I posted after you made the thread; it tells you all about it.

Do not water every other day either; if you need to do that then your plants are rootbound; but they are not in this situation.

You need to let your plants recover before giving them any more water; if the soil is dry and the pots are light; just give them a small dose of water; do not let water run out of the bottom of the pots until they are fully recovered.

Please give my first post a good read; I explained everything to you in there and what you need to do.

 

[bongasaurus]

i have, and honestly, i still think they were underwatered than over watered. thanks for all the help


hows this for a ph tester?

http://cgi.ebay.ca/PH-TEMPERATURE-D...yZ117435QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

[MynameStitch]

Well it's up to you; but I do not see how you can underwater your plants when you water everyday and let run off come out the bottom

But it's your plants I am just here to give advice on the matter

Take what you want too; but good luck with which every route you choose.


Also another tip; the perlite only gets the way it is in that picture when it stays wet all the time......

 

[bongasaurus]

so is that an alright ph pen?

well as i seid up there it is usually every other day. ive been taking your advice about not letting the water run though, only giving them a liittle drink.

thanks again for the advice