Sick Sativa

[zhugeliang]

Hey Ladies and Gents,

I need some help with my poor Sativa. She is a few more weeks from coming down but has not hit her peak growth period yet. She was doing fine up until 2 weeks ago and now she is getting these rust spots that started at the top of the plant and is progressively moving down the plant on the fan leaves. I have an Indica that was started around the same time and is following the same nutrient routine and is fine but my Sativa seems to be suffering.

PH is kept between 5.6 - 6.1 and is checked on everyday. I thought it might have something to do with the plant growing up too close to the light and being heat stressed but these symptoms have me believing it might be something else. She is being grown under a 400w HPS light in a Hydro bucket system.

Any insight will be greatly appreciated.

 

[MynameStitch]

Need more information..... how far away is the light to the plant and did you move it up at all?

Can you please fill out more questions so we can get a more accurate info about your grow?

HYDROPONICS:

What STRAIN are you growing?
What was the establishing technique? (Were the seed or clone?)
What is the age of your plants?
What PHASE are the plants in? (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in?
What Technique are you using?
What substrate/medium are you using?(Hydroton, RockWool etc.)
What is the Water temperature?
What Nutrient's are you using? How much of each if using multiple?
What is the TDS/EC/PPM you are using?
What is the pH of the "Tank"?
Are you sure your calibration is correct on your equiptment?
When was your last watering?
When was your last feeding change? (ie. grow-bloom-micro-additional)
What size bulb are you using?
What is the distance to the canopy?
What is your RH Factor?
What is the canopy temperature?
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include flucutaion range)
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.)
Is the fan blowing directly at plants?
Is your water HARD or SOFT?
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned off of or pinched
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so, What and When?
Are plant's infected with pest's

 

[zhugeliang]

Hey Stitch,

I don't have all the exact minute details but I will provide you with what I have the best I can. This is only my 4th grow so I don't have all the necessary measuring tools yet.

HYDROPONICS:

What STRAIN are you growing? Sativa from a mixed indoor from BCBudDepot

What was the establishing technique? (Were the seed or clone?) Seed

What is the age of your plants? About 6 weeks of flower, after 2 weeks of
Veg from seed.

What PHASE are the plants in? (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? Flower

What Technique are you using? Natural Jungle

What substrate/medium are you using?(Hydroton, RockWool etc.) Hydroton, Rockwool for the seed.

What is the Water temperature? Room Temp? Not sure on this one.

What Nutrient's are you using? How much of each if using multiple? Fox Farm Tiger Bloom and Big Bloom. One Tables spoon per gallon for Big Bloom and 2 Teaspoons per gallon of the Tiger Bloom

What is the TDS/EC/PPM you are using? I don't have these meters but according to the feeding schedule that I got on the chart for the nutrients, I should be somewhere in the right range. I can't say for sure though.

What is the pH of the "Tank"? Always 5.8 - 6.1 I let it float from bottom range to top range before I adjust the ph to allow full nutrient range absorption.

Are you sure your calibration is correct on your equiptment? Yep, just calibrated my PH meter and everything seems normal.

When was your last watering? I change the water completely every week but add a gallon of fresh water plus nutrients every other day.

When was your last feeding change? (ie. grow-bloom-micro-additional) Nutrients were switched over to flower supplements about 5 -6 weeks ago.

What size bulb are you using? 400w HPS

What is the distance to the canopy? This sativa grew like a beanstalk so the light is about 2 inches from the top cola which is suffering the most. I have sufficient cooling though so it does not feel overheated on top of the cola. At least I think so. I would move the light up more but there is no more room in the cab.

What is your RH Factor? I can't say. =(

What is the canopy temperature? Somewhere between 78 - 81

What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include flucutaion range) I haven't really checked on this.

What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.) I have regular fans set up in there. 2 dual exhaust fans at top and a fan on the bottom bringing in air. Then another over the canopy to keep the air circulated properly.

Is the fan blowing directly at plants? The fan on the bottom is blowing straight up, the fan on the canopy is blowing at and over the top cola and the exhaust fans are above the light.

Is your water HARD or SOFT? The water is naturally hard, I need to adjust it down everytime even after low ph nutes are added.

Has plant been recently pruned, cloned off of or pinched? Negative

Have any pest chemicals been used? If so, What and When? Negative

Are plant's infected with pest's? Not as far as I can tell, I have an indica right next to it that is doing wonderfully.

Thanks for any help you can provide Stitch!

 

[10k]

I'll leave the nute advice to stitch here, but it's pretty obvious that you're running the light way too close to that sativa plant and in the process starving the indicas in the room for decent lighting.

Sativas can be a real pita to grow indoors. Especially ones that are forced into flowering at such an immature age of only two weeks from sprouted seed.

If you wish to grow sats indoors, the best approach is from newly rooted adult (dna age wise) clones. This helps alot in controlling their heights indoors. However, as with all sativa grows indoors, you can expect to be doing alot of tieing down along with alot of string & banjos holding up the branches as they put on weight in flowering.

Your sat from seed, under a 400 in a grow along with indicas is a recipe for troubles as the indicas will be suffering for lighting as you're raising the light for your tall and lanky "beanstalk" sativa. You'll become a string tieing expert real soon thats for sure.

Under those circumstances, I'd be bending (to the point of nearly breaking) that tall girl over sideways and bringing out the string to hang that sideways stalk horizontally. You'll have to keep tieing it down and this will cause the side branches of the sideways main stalk to grow vertically, hopefully at a pace similar to your indicas in the room. Thus allowing the light height to be better for the indicas in this mismatched grow situation.

hth

 

[MynameStitch]

10K gave some excellent advice about your 2nd situation... the other situation you have going is this:

Fox Farm Tiger Bloom and Big Bloom. One Tables spoon per gallon for Big Bloom and 2 Teaspoons per gallon of the Tiger Bloom

What is the TDS/EC/PPM you are using? I don't have these meters but according to the feeding schedule that I got on the chart for the nutrients, I should be somewhere in the right range. I can't say for sure though.

I can gurantee you , you are using to much bloom. Tiger bloom and big bloom you are doubling up on it with the amounts you are using; and since you are going by there charts they are burned; FF has a rich feeding schedule and is not right and to strong for cannabis; also growing without proper TDS ph pen in hydro is asking for trouble; you would have to really understand your plants to know what they want or do not need anymore of.

How do you know your water is hard since you do not have a TDS meter? did you ph test your tap water?

WHat I would do is had 1 tsp of bloom and 1 tsp of FF bloom per gallon
The tops are the worst,because they are getting bleached from the light.

The rest of the plant has to much phosphorus; flush out your system and put fresh nutrients in there. I would most defiantly recommend getting a TDS pen and Ph pen if you do not already have a ph pen; are you using strips right now?

When was the last time you cleaned your system out?
For a healthy hydro system flushing the system out ( not the plants) is recommended every 2 weeks and putting in fresh nutrients.


You get rid of left over salts in the nutrients that the plant did not need.

 

[zhugeliang]

Thanks for the replies guys, I was beginning to think my thread would be drowned. Yeah, for the indica I have raised her bucket up to about 8 inches under the Sativa with magazines and 2 bricks so that the light wouldn't be a problem for the indica. It is receiving just as much light as the sativa at this point, just without the bleach from being too close to the light.

I have a PH meter but I don't have one to measure PPM. I should've clarified that earlier. So I can tell how hard the water is but I can't tell the PPM. I bought this one meter from the hydro store before I knew that there were combination meters for about the same price. Lame.

I flush out the buckets once a week and add new nutrients. I'll start flushing them once every 2 weeks now by your suggestion.

So.... 1 tablespoon is too much of the Big Bloom plant food eh? I guess I can give it a shot. I've just been following that feeding schedule for the past 4 grows and things seemed to turn out right but I can give it a go. Can't hurt to try something new. So 1 teaspoon of each eh? That would definitely save the bank on restocking nutrients. 1 teaspoon of each per gallon. Got it! Just out of curiosity though, where did you learn about Fox Farm nutes being on such a strong feeding schedule. I ran plenty google searches and came up with nothing about these nutes being used for plants. Not questioning your wisdom, just wondering if there is somewhere I can get more information.

Thanks guys, the lights are already out for the day so first thing in the morning I am going to flush them out and start on this lighter feeding schedule. Hopefully everything works out.

 

[MynameStitch]

Did you grow out different strains your past grows?
I use fox farm nutrients I use Big bloom and I have used tiger bloom a few grows and I know it's strong.

Because fox farm is made for other plants; cannabis is not like other plants; it's pretty much considered a weed lol
It burns much easier than common plants like tomato, cabbage and other stuff.......
Those dosages were not made for cannabis; products like canna, advanced nutrients a one or 2 others have charts that are made for cannabis.

Another reason why I said to cut down on the nutrients; you don't have a tds meter so start out low and increase them; let them recover. You will notice quickly if it's low or not with hydro grows.

I am also telling by the way the color of the plant is and the leaves in the background....
they need a delicate balance and most of the time when there is to much it can cause issues with the other nutrients being absorbed.

 

[zhugeliang]

Sounds like it makes sense to me. Another question though. How will I know if I am not using enough? Like right now by looking at the leaf discoloration you can see that it is burning but how will I tell if it is not getting enough and how long will I have to correct it before everything goes down the drain?

I need to get a ppm meter but those things are pretty expensive and I spent a small fortune setting up the cab. =P Maybe I can afford one for Christmas. Haha!

 

[MynameStitch]

If it's not getting enough you will know; the plant gets lighter and looses vigor.
Right now you are making your plants suffer with over feeding rather than over feeding; because when you overfeed you have to end up flushing the soil out real good and it causes nutrients to run out of the soil; so your are muich better of starting back out small and let them recover; you do not need massive amount of nutrients to grow good stuff.

Check out my gallery for my plants; the sick ones you see are not mine though; except for one that says sick bogglegum; that was caused by bad water and lots of sodium.
The rest is for sick plants guide and the ones you see with bud shots and plants are mine.

 

[zhugeliang]

Thanks Stitch, Day 1 of new nute solution and I am not seeing any changes. Granted I am sure it will take some time if it wasn't already too late but as of now I am not seeing any changes. Hopefully something will give and the magic will start happening because as of now, other stems are getting that yellow leafy color.

Yesterday I just went ahead and chopped the top cola off as t hat was the only part that should have been affected by being too close to the light. So now the tops are about 8 - 10 inches from the light and glass shield.

I'll let you know if anything changes.

 

[MynameStitch]

Damaged stuff won't recover but your plant will start to get more vigor and seem happier when it starts to recover......

Yes, please do that I would like an update