Revival of the Ultimate Sativa Thread

[ThaiBliss]

It was a ZamalXMeao Thai from ACE.

Thanks Randy. I'm working on that one. Not exactly, but as close as I can get by using Zamaldelica. I'm hitting the Meao Thai from all angles. If "it" is there, I'm going to find it. Unfortunately, I can only test 1-3 at a time in my limited space. But, Purple Haze x Meao Thai x SAGE is curing, I still have a few more Golden Tigers seeds to try, and the Zamaldelica is in the flowering room. I've got one more version with Meao Thai to pop seed from after I try after Zamaldelica.

I'm probably just super picky.

Here is a pic of Zamaldelica:

Long Live Sativas,

ThaiBliss

 

[Dr. Purpur]

That looks real good Randy!


Here is the volunteer. Its still hanging, and I just snapped a branch and did a quick trim. Sorry for the poor trim job. This is a NH21 x MM (E) x ?... Probably Oaxacan.

Again.... Sorry for the poor trim job

This weed tastes great and is really strong

 

[Hank Hemp]

Looks fine to me but then I'm not holding.

 

[BlOoDShAnTi I]

Overgrow...,

May I ask where you got that J. Lambsbread? It looks very good. Much more sativa like than the one I grew. Very Thai looking. Have you grown it before? If so, please give us a smoke report on that.

Jamaican was one of the all time greats back in the 70s. The stuff I was getting was extreme sativa looking. I'm thrilled to see something like the ones in your pictures. Looks nice and healthy too. Good job.

Thanks much,

ThaiBliss

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=274926

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=217540

 

[Dr. Purpur]

Id pass a branch through the screen to each of You guys , If I could. Youd have to trim it yourself of course....

 

[idiit]

Hi,

Does anyone knows the exact genetics of Mullumbimbi madness?

Greetings

there was an interesting exchange between nevil and kangativa on ^ this subject:

Originally Posted by Nevil View Post
I've been looking at Kanga's photo's of giant sativa's, maybe drooling is the word I'm looking for. Now anyone who understands the laws of metaphysics and manifestation knows that nature abhors a vacuum. The universe rearranged itself to accommodate my perception of it and magically filled the void in my life and soon I was holding a half oz of Bud with no name. (Thanks mate)
I cut the vacuum sealed pack, nostrils flaring with anticipation. I inhaled. Pine, with fruity undertones. My mind scrambled to make sense of this intoxicating aroma. Synapses fired off in my brain, feverishly looking for connections to try and place the ancestry and type. Was it the Oaxacan I've been looking for? I went in again. I filled my lungs with the perfume, come on, what does it remind you of. BC (haze) an unsure voice answered. So it's not oaxacan, I demanded of the little voice. I don't think so, was the reply, don't you remember, the oaxacan had a more sugary sweetness about it. There is no point in arguing with the nose. Feeling as if I'd been let down, it was time to bring in the big guns.
I rolled a joint. I took a toke. Juicy Fruit Thai, no doubt about it. But where does the pine come in. It took me at least half an hour to finish the joint. Must talk to Kanga. I gave him a call. OK I said what is it, hoping to end the confusion. It's er, kind of mixed, he said. So you don't know, I asked, somewhat rudely I expect considering my frame of mind.(no offence intended). In the future I'll have it more sorted, he promised. I thanked him profusely and went back to work.
Thinking about how Nostradamus threw his quatrains up in the air and then published them in the order they fell to the ground, I started cracking open buds to see if I could sort them. Which one's got the pine? I made two piles, imagining that they were different. Hours go by while I try to finish the two joints, one from each pile. I analyse what I'm feeling. There is a presence to the high in the way that Haze has, but different. I get that ringing in my ears, that I associate with bud that has flourished under intense sun. I get a sense of maturity, that I imagine is the result of the plant being able to reach maximum size. So what about BC, I ask one of my schizoid selves.

I get back to the piles smelling each bud. It's all the same! Pine overtone, Juicy Fruit Thai undertone. The effect is primarily Thai, but better than I've seen in 20+ years. What about the Pine? I don't know, I can't really connect it to the Thais that I've come across. Maybe it's a hybrid. But it has been inbred to Juicy Fruit Thai.

So what about the BC I remind myself. It's inbred to Juicy Fruit Thai the nose informs me. Oh yeah, the realisation dawns on me after 25 years. The brain can be a bit slow, but the nose knows.
N.

The Juicy fruit Thai is possibly the MM and the hint of pine possibly the Mex.....anyway as Nevil said I will have it all sorted.

^^kangativa

http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/12-outdoor/3376-motivation-time-14.html

 

[stihgnobevoli]

Id pass a branch through the screen to each of You guys , If I could. Youd have to trim it yourself of course....

trim? i just roll the leaves up in there too. depending on just how sativa i just roll a whole branch up in a blunt and smoke it.

 

[OLDproLg]

Here ya go friends,my Limonana haze close ups!!!!

Here ya go friends,my Limonana haze close ups!!!!

Hello again folks....

Just snapped some good shots of the resins!!!!!
Have a good day,its 85 degreese here today....

 

[OvergrowDaWorld]

I thought blunts were to mask the taste from inner-city brick weed.
I always try and get my boyz to stop the blunts but they love em'. Thats all they'de be smokin on, if I wasnt hangin with em'.
I smoke for the taste as much as the effect. Taste is even more important than effect for me personally.
Not saying anything against anothers personal style, and how they roll....2eho.... but I couldnt put a pure landrace sativa in a blunt.
To me... thats sacrilege. LOL!
I get on all my boyz cases about it all the time. Its pretty funny. I have a good time bustin their ballz about it.

Thanks for putting up the links BloodShantiI. I appreciate that. Your a good man.

 

[burningfire]

I was going through an old memory card and found some pics I hadn't uploaded... This isn't the most sativa plant I've grown but this is by far the prettiest 'sativa' lady I've grown.

Since I basically stopped smoking.. and don't plan on starting again for the next couple of years, I hope my seeds stay viable until then.

She was as tasty as she was pretty and the buzz was decent too, connoisseur stuff for sure.

a pic I had uploaded back when I first showed it off.. but I just love the structure

 

[Gert Lush]

Just snapped some good shots of the resins!!!!!
Have a good day,its 85 degreese here today....

Can't beat sativas grown in nature, in the environment they want!
So jealous...
Enjoy, OldPro!

 

[OLDproLg]

Hey GL!!!

Dont ever forget,im a generous man,ya see som'm ya like
JUST ASK!!

But ya man,i am lucky to be in a state that can grow ALL YEAR LONG!!!
Non-stop baby for 36 years now.................................................
Glad ya like!
Lg

 

[Raho]

there was an interesting exchange between nevil and kangativa on ^ this subject:

Originally Posted by Nevil View Post
I've been looking at Kanga's photo's of giant sativa's, maybe drooling is the word I'm looking for. Now anyone who understands the laws of metaphysics and manifestation knows that nature abhors a vacuum. The universe rearranged itself to accommodate my perception of it and magically filled the void in my life and soon I was holding a half oz of Bud with no name. (Thanks mate)
I cut the vacuum sealed pack, nostrils flaring with anticipation. I inhaled. Pine, with fruity undertones. My mind scrambled to make sense of this intoxicating aroma. Synapses fired off in my brain, feverishly looking for connections to try and place the ancestry and type. Was it the Oaxacan I've been looking for? I went in again. I filled my lungs with the perfume, come on, what does it remind you of. BC (haze) an unsure voice answered. So it's not oaxacan, I demanded of the little voice. I don't think so, was the reply, don't you remember, the oaxacan had a more sugary sweetness about it. There is no point in arguing with the nose. Feeling as if I'd been let down, it was time to bring in the big guns.
I rolled a joint. I took a toke. Juicy Fruit Thai, no doubt about it.

http://www.mrnice.nl/forum/12-outdoor/3376-motivation-time-14.html

Hi idiit
The way you have presented those quotes makes it look like Kanga's Mullum (which he had several lines of) was "juicy fruit thai" which is a thai/afghan seed line made by others then worked and sold by Sensi Seeds as "Fruity Juice Thai."
Nev actually meant that it reminded him of that (possibly from similar thai origins), not that it was descended directly from his old seeds.

If you read a bit further, you see Bushweed (an authority on Kanga's work) respond and clarify that the bag that Nev received from Kanga was actually a mixed bag of buds, including oaxacan, ww, and other mullum HYBRIDS.

One of those mixed bags is a treat, despite the chagrin at not knowing the exact strains. This is one of Kangativa's many charms.

We all know taste & smell is subjective, but my two scents worth - there is a commonality of smell to Kanga's gear (maybe it's in the soil & the shit he digs in), but the taste tends to distinguish the lines to a degree, and the effect differentiates them further. In my experience the MM is a darker green with flame orange hairs and may be the sweet pine to which you refer, the MMWW is lighter green and very sparsely haired but with an almost mauve/beige hue to the calyxes and candy /hashy sweet (a chunky lime green bud), the Mendo Skunk Haze is also chunky and similarly light green but with light orange hairs and sweet citrus/onion taste, the pure Oaxacan is a sweet lemon (&this year has yellow leaves, & some issues with to much water and caterpillars so not up to usual potency), the Oaxacan x NLHaze is sweet lemon pine, browner looking and similar strength to the Skunk Haze. There is another 15 or so unidentified strains ranging from nice& mild to superlative. They can look like anything from NLhaze to Malawi Gold. Some of these strains look like the ones identified, but have a different effect. There is also the MM x SkunkHaze that I have yet to encounter, but in my experience anything with MM in it is simply superior dope.

I believe the MM is pure Thai or Thai dominant - probably early seventies Thai stick. Kanga has commented on similar gear that was found growing wild in the Hunter region 30 years ago, and probably Indian sativa. Neither here nor there.

In other words, if you somehow manage to get an old pack of Sensi Fruity Juice and grow them out, it would not be accurate to go around describing whatever came out as Mullum, or even remotely related.
The evolutionary path that resulted in Kanga's mullum lines did not pass through Sensi Seeds (or the juicy fruit thai line.)

If you go to Thailand and try to buy some herb (and recent travelers please correct me if this has changed) you do not have people describing the gear as "Highland", "Lowland", "Juicy Fruit" etc like people in the US might describe a generic skunk, haze or indica line.
All you will get if you are lucky is the name of the place that it came from.
Those names (juicy fruit, etc.) were applied to the offspring of plants grown in the US, Aus, NL, etc. from (usually) unknown places in Thailand, and nobody knew what they were going to be like until they were grown and smoked.
The names they applied to the lines that resulted were created by foreigners to describe something that they had created (usually hybrids) and have zero relevance to the work of producers back where the original line came from.

So, if Nev says a thai line smells or tastes like "juicy fruit thai" he doesn't mean it came from that commercialized, hybridized seedline, created and branded in the west.
He means it reminds him of the qualities he used to see in that line.
Even this is a reference that only a small percentage of people doing this stuff today can even truly recognize, because the lines are largely diluted or gone, and you kinda had to be there back then to get understand it. To have actually experienced it.

One thing is for sure, the reference would be unrecognizable by the people that might produce seeds in Thailand today. The labels never came from there to begin with. They were made up elsewhere.

So, to sum up:

• Nev was sniffing/smoking a bag of mixed hybrids, not pure mullum.
• He described it as smelling/tasting like something similar to an old line he used to sell.
• He did not say juicy fruit was a component in the genetic line of mullum.

When Kanga said this in response to Nev's post:

Kanga
The Juicy fruit Thai is possibly the MM and the hint of pine possibly the Mex.....anyway as Nevil said I will have it all sorted.

He was explaining where the smells/tastes Nev described came from in his gear (thai smell/taste comes from mullum, pine smell/taste from Mex) he was not saying that those commercial western strain names were part of the Mullum pedigree.

I hope this makes sense.

I see people try to do this all the time, presumably so they can buy a few packs or commercialized western seeds and recombine them into a semblance of a unique genetic mixture that has been lost to the ages or is famous but unavailable. It doesn't work that way for the most part unfortunately.
The guys making crosses back then (when heirloom herb came to our shores direct by the boat load from the land of origin and the seed that people worked with came from the bottom of their baggies, not in a pack from Amsterdam.)

Kanga had some unique lines preserved, and that is why Nev was so excited about using them to work with. Because the pedigree was more accurate than most lines available, and efforts had been made over the years to keep it pure.

I hope you find this helpful.

 

[idiit]

.The Juicy fruit Thai is possibly the MM and the hint of pine possibly the Mex.....anyway as Nevil said I will have it all sorted

^ kangativa

thanks raho!

the above quote was what i guess i misinterpreted.

talking about the origins of the original haze and mm is better left to those that know.

plenty here at ic mag have personal experience in these matters.

oh well,

i'm going to go now..........

idiit

 

[Raho]

^ kangativa

thanks raho!
the above quote was what i guess i misinterpreted.
talking about the origins of the original haze and mm is better left to those that know.
plenty here at ic mag have personal experience in these matters.
oh well,
i'm going to go now..........

idiit

Please don't go idiit
I have enjoyed your posts and never want my comments to have the effect to squelching conversation or debate.

I wish I had a time machine to go back and stop Nixon's War On Drugs before they began the wholesale destruction of these regional genetic treasures around the world.

There are still some amazing Thai (columbian/african/mexican/etc) strains out there, some of them even passing through the hands of people very familiar to readers of this thread on their way to resellers/breeders who refined and commercialized them for us in today's market.

Never give up the search my friend

As much as I wish I still had my seeds from the 70s and 80s, my goals are to find the plants that give me what I need today, regardless of the sometimes misleading names that are applied to them an their way to me.
For as much as we have lost, the treasures for be found for today's growers in many cases rival the good old days, and with our knowledge of cultivation and technology, can make flowers that sometimes even exceed them.

 

[idiit]

Please don't go idiit

ok, but only if you change your avatar (he's kinda skeery).



idiit

 

[Raho]

ok, but only if you change your avatar (he's kinda skeery).



idiit

OK, how's this?

And, Bushweed said:

the MM is a darker green with flame orange hairs

So here's some dried MMb x s5 (the calyxes are dark under the resin ;-)

 

[Dr. Purpur]

I think the Mullimbimby Madness goes back more then 30 years. It was most likely around 72-76. The seed was reportedly from the old Thai sticks. I think both Nevil and Kanga told me that.

Nevil thought his NH21 would produce the Holy Grail, in a cross to Mullim. I have that cross, and grew one female out. It is exceptional smoke. Very strong, Headrusher, and up energetic euphoric high. Real nice flavor

I had a bunch hanging in the garage last year and some were seeded and dropped seeds. I swept out the garage this last spring and they keep coming up. That last big plant was just a transplant from outside my garage door. They are all top quality plants. Heres one today, out there in the 20s.

 

[zachrockbadenof]

Please don't go idiit

For as much as we have lost, the treasures for be found for today's growers in many cases rival the good old days, and with our knowledge of cultivation and technology, can make flowers that sometimes even exceed them.

I'm not so sure I agree... while the mind is a bit fuzzy... the weed we were buying in the late 60's/early 70's imo (remember fuzzy mind) was way better then what we have been growing for the last 10+yrs... we grow by seeds, as we are not in the 'elite' group to get clones, but every thing is a hybrid and imo , trying to get the effects of a 150day sativa by combining it with a 50day indica does not work... at least in all the seeds we have bought...

maybe the body's chem has changed and today's shit is better... but me and numerous smoking friends yearn for a bag of old Mexican/Colombian/Jamaican... a bag that was filled with seeds and twigs..

maybe that's the secret... pollinate the plants, and get oz's of seeds... altho we had a plant or plants a few grows ago that herm'd
and got 8 ozs of seeds from ssh/sd kush/chemdog and jack herer... and that shit was no better...

maybe need to take a roadtrip into the jungles of se asia... on 2nd thought we'll just keep smoking the shitty weed we got...

 

[Raho]

Hi Zach.
I would have agreed with you 2 - 3 years ago (especially with regard to sativas) but I found a male plant (oBoy) that brought it all back and then some. I have crossed it with elite clones and special seed plants all over the world.
I have found the quality of effects in these hybrids to carry the magic of the late '70's (when I started smoking.)
The tastes are actually better because of the condition of the material compared to something that was pressed in bales and shipped in the wet hold of a freighter.

Check out the thread in my signature for details if you like.
I actually just put some new pics up there from this years outdoor run of crosses made with friends in Mendo.
The effects that make it so special are very much like SMCG to my head.

I have also been one of the lucky people who have run some of Kanga's hybrids, and in F1, it was easy for me to find that 25% that favored his giant Mullum.

The GN Thai stick sativa is supposed to be an excellent representation of the Thai's of old, according to Kanga and other aussie heads. Kanga did a test run of a few of the most promising current Thai offerings and selected the GN Thai stick sativa as the best of the bunch.
I have a pack of them, they are still for sale in places, but you don't see anyone running them.
Sometimes I think the yearning for the past eclipses the willingness to do what it takes to re-live it ;-)

I know they have a line down under they call Thai '78 that is supposed to be undiluted, and amazing. Haven't seen it for sale anywhere. That opportunity probably disappeared with the bust of our friend (for a while anyway.)

Pretty sure you have seen Red Ryder's thread about growing and herb down in Colombia today. There are pics of some samples he has found that look very much like throwbacks to "the day" and his description of effects leaves little doubt that the treasure exists and he will find it some day.

The JLB (Jamaican Lamb's Bread) thread here chronicles an old line, preserved and passed from person to person, that to my eye looks very much like the real thing.
I grew one small Jamaican plant in 83 from old seed. My pheno was not very potent (neither was the golden Oaxacan with giant calyxes that I grew that year), but the foxtailed structure and other traits of the plant that I grew was almost identical to the pics I am seeing of that line.

Edited to add Gert's efforts to revive his beloved pheno of 303 (Papua New Guinea, PNG Gold) and hybrids. Man we've got so many old lines coming back from the brink right now!

I'm not telling you that you are wrong, just suggesting you might not want to give up just yet ;-)