Purple haze and Alcapulco Gold? WTF?

[bonecarver_OG]

hehe

the borat in swimsuit kills all fights lol - lucky u didnt put a pic of the naked wrestling scene ROFL - sick humor.



peace all

 

[Guest]

that is a spectacular bud lm, frosty beyond the best ive ever seen. gonna have to get after the BeerBud of 20'Thais makin.

do you still have that plant? really nice shot

CBF

Hello CBF,

It is a pic taken by 20'Thai himself, I never had this plant in my room. But I can ask the creator if there are still seeds around

About the Beer bud sativa, she seems an interesting hybrid, smelling beer and providing a mellow high. I have some seeds of it but no time to work them

Priority is given here for his original Old Mother sativa a.k.a. Mullumbinby madness. This will be the next reproduction to share. I don't know much of the pedigree of this old school strain but he said it was one of the hybrids to grow with the OT1 Haze so I think I should give it a try lolol She is said to be more manageable than the OT1 Haze indoor, because it finishes around 90 days with a decent productivity. It should produce a strong SE Asian high leaning to Colombian high at the end. Hermies have to be worked out but I have 60 seeds, for a founder population, that will be enough to do it.

 

[Dalaihempy]

Priority is given here for his original Old Mother sativa a.k.a. Mullumbinby madness. This will be the next reproduction to share. I don't know much of the pedigree of this old school strain but he said it was one of the hybrids to grow with the OT1 Haze so I think I should give it a try lolol She is said to be more manageable than the OT1 Haze indoor, because it finishes around 90 days with a decent productivity. It should produce a strong SE Asian high leaning to Colombian high at the end. Hermies have to be worked out but I have 60 seeds, for a founder population, that will be enough to do it.

Hi LM not trying to start a argument but if it is mullumbinby Mans sativa he called mullumbinby madness if so sorry to say this but is not the real deal he even stated had stated that if you guys want to know some real info relating to this australian line i can point you in the right direction.

I scored it only once here and new a few guys that lived up there new a few of the growers growing in over 20 years ago now but i also met one of the breeders of the original MMadness .

Fact is you only need to drive to byron bay wich mullumbinby is a ashire of Byron bay and every man and his dog claims to be growing it fact is thay dont.

If you want to know wat the real deal MM grows and smokes like crack some Nevile haze F1s closest thing you will find unless you get it from the breeders .

 

[Guest]

Hi LM not trying to start a argument but if it is mullumbinby Mans sativa he called mullumbinby madness if so sorry to say this but is not the real deal he even stated had stated that if you guys want to know some real info relating to this australian line i can point you in the right direction.

I scored it only once here and new a few guys that lived up there new a few of the growers growing in over 20 years ago now but i also met one of the breeders of the original MMadness .

Fact is you only need to drive to byron bay wich mullumbinby is a ashire of Byron bay and every man and his dog claims to be growing it fact is thay dont.

If you want to know wat the real deal MM grows and smokes like crack some Nevile haze F1s closest thing you will find unless you get it from the breeders .

Hello DalaiHempy,

well here is all I know about the Old Mother sativa seeds I have

- Original pure Mullumbinby Madness aka OldMotherSativa

These are now plagued with hermi rpoblems and need someone who is capable of breeding it out of them. Believe it or not, these are the very LAST batch of the true Mullums left anywhere that I am aware of. The original 'keeper' of this strain KOG from Kyogle NSW has long discontinued using and selling them because he was unable to rid them of their hermi traits.

I do not know of any other PURE IBL sativa that is as indoor friendly as the real Mullum. It’s has the ability of a near ZERO stretch factor in flowering. In fact, most of the newAge Indica hybrids will stretch more than a Mullum in preflower and flower. The trick to eliminating nearly all its stretch is to crop the mainstem once during veg and have it branch out heavily before 12/12’ing. It is then that we experience a few inches of stretching even in a 4-5foot tall vegged plant. So the old age fear of the plant outgrowing your room is non-existent with OMS/Mullum.

Even in the ground outdoors with everything they need as far as water and feed are concerned, they will rarely exceed a height of 10foot tall. I have had a couple of freaks over the last 2 decades that went 12foot uncropped, but that is a rare event for OMS. Their awesomeness is in their branching; it branches like MAD. Hence Mullumbinby MADness - the name itself.

Most will tell you it has 2 phenos, but I know it has 3, and the third is rarer than any other pheno of any other strain that I have ever come across. Of the hundreds of Mullums I have seen and grown myself, and of the thousands that KOG has grown over 25years to full inground maturity, and of the many many other OMS’s that other people ‘I and KOG’ know who have grown it all over central and northern Ozz in the last 30years, it has only appeared 3 times. The last time being over 15 years ago. It is the SUPER rare all Purple pheno of the Mullum, and it is purple almost from day1. If anyone can get one of these pheno’s, I would advise they firstly mother it for future breeding as it has it own aroma that differs to the other phenos and is more potent than the other phenos. Then they should immediately go out an buy a lottery ticket that has huge dividends, ‘cause chances are they’ll win it too if they were lucky enough to find the true purple pheno of Old Mother.

Pheno No1.
Large stature heavy branching and hi yielding

Pheno No2.
SOG pheno. Collimated growth pattern with very little side branching and height. Potency is identical to the 1st pheno.

Pheno No3.
All purple, and it is not a dark purple. It is a violet-y to medium purple (MARONE) that makes the plant look spectacular with slivers of lime green coming in ‘here and there’. It has NEVER been found in a SOG pheno plant, only with the large heavy branching stature has it ever appeared. This pheno in full bloom is basically a showpiece of a sativa. The stone does it no injustice either. Very cerebral with a spectacular initial soaring that can take you upwards for over an hour before settling into another 2-3 hours of focused bliss.

As to the level of potency compared to other sativas? It has been said by many who have tried ‘it’, and Shanti’s Neville’s Haze, including MullumMadman himself at OG years ago, that they are on par in potency with the exception that OMS’s stone is more focused. IOW, of a higher caliber/quality… less narcotic less debilitating but just as zoomy/soaring without any edge on the nerves…smooth as silk.

It is without a doubt, one of the better sativas this world has had, but it is time to stabilize her back to her original glory or she will be lost forever if left alone.

She is ‘the’ original White strain. She produces lush white resin-ed lambsbread long running buds that are not too thick, but there are a lot of them. You know when she is ready, because when you look at her, you know that you can throw away your manicure/pruning scissors. ALL primary and secondary fan leafs fall off naturally just before she’s ready to take. Leaving one with just plain bud laden branches that with other sativas would take a long time to trim to that level because of the remaining secondary fan leafs that are just about everywhere on an in the buds.

When handling the colas and ripping the buds off them, your hands will fill with the blackest stickiest finger putty you’re ever likely to come across. Heavenly charas.

Flowering times range from 100-110days outdoors to 90days indoors.

She’s as strong a stone as FET’s 303, but of a completely opposite aspect…clear and focused instead of sedative and narcotic. It is in a way, the opposing sister to the 303 stone. IOW, genetically similar, but characteristically opposite.

I know 20'Thai for some time now, and fully trusts him. He proved in many many ways how much he was a great grower, a long time experienced smoker and first of all, a true minded man.

Whatever the name of the strain, its supposed legendary pedigree, I'm sure of one thing: if he sent it to me saying that, I have to grow it because it will be great stuff for me

 

[Dalaihempy]

Hiya LM well i have heard of the strain called OldMotherSativa from what i rember had a south american back ground but was something special from wat i was told the guy i chated to him about her was growing her out doors in greenhouses he was from og may be the same guy ? just cant rember his handle now.


Im an ozzie saw mm only come threw dribs n drabs only scored a bag once i belive the last time real mm was offerd as in comerical was around 85 but was not main stream you needed to know the right people basicly as it never lasted.


The MM was only ever grown out doors i dont think mm has any OldMotherSativa in its make up but can ask wen i next get a chance tho.

As for MM being in the white lines no i rember that question being asket to shanti may of been MMan infact.


MM and the old mauie sativa and black african are posibly the most potent plants i ever tryed in the old days only opimated thia comeing 4th .

 

[dubi]

OG bub,

i think we have different opinions about what is a good person and a support for your self and what's a thief and liar. You should check a little bit the past of Queijo/HHF and know why we are reacting in that way. When some one stole you, lies you and manipulates you for months, then we can not react with a smile. We have shown enough respect answering educatly to the nule zamalito's growing experience with thais and to the lame HHF attacks. I edited my past messages explainning Queijo's past and my opinion about zamalito's breeding experience. I have nothing to hide and i have no problem to post it, but for respect to charlie and others i quit it. I can post it again if Queijo/HHF persists with his insults and refused to edit his first post.

People saying thai genes are lost must grow a few thai plants at home or contact old tokers to know what they are talking about. Try to 'teach' us about how should look a genuine landrace phenotype saying wrong statements and histories not based in personal growing experience is like air and smoke for me. Words and fantasies can not be grown and preserved in seed form, what it counts for me are PLANTS and RESPECT. And i think we have posted TONS of info, pics about our breeding programmes in a respecful way.

little_man,

thank you very much for share your experiences with old thais.

Oldtimer had 3 hazes lines, he distributed seeds between many many growers around the world in the 90s. Noone reproduced them, 2 hazes lines were lost. One was reproduced by pacific, then by wolfman and then by us in the past 2-3 years.

Bros Grimms purple haze was indeed a haze line from Oldtimer, he commented me how Soul received some haze seeds but he was initally more interested in cross them and not in preserve them in pure form. Dont know what could happen with them or if it's the same line we have preserved lately.

20 thai is a good friend. He was very generous to share some of his last thai 79 seeds, reproduced only 1 or 2 times since the time of the thai sticks. I put them yesterday to germinate along with other tropical sativas (koh chang thai x haze, pure zamal etc ...)

20 thai also commented me about the hermie problems with Mullum/OMS line. Maybe next year will try to reproduce her using non hermie parents. Good luck!

 

[dubi]

elevator man- columbian sativas are a bit different than mexicans in my opinion. the closest thing to old-school acapulco gold that i can think of is that old highland oaxacan gold ibl. :wink:

edit: and how can you rip on REAL preservationists when you have strain named 'congo' and 'panama' that arent landraces from those regions? thats not helping to preserve the genepool if you ask me.

High & Lonesome,

Our commercial strains are stabilized hybrids bred by our own using landrace genetics from native zones. Firstly, landrace seeds are grown here, analyzed and preserved in pure form, then we experiment with outcrosses and the best hybrids results are the point of start of our commercial hybrid strains.

We have preserved many many strains from Colombia, Mexico, Panama, Thailand, China, Angola, Nepal, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Uzbekistan ... so it's clear that we have done REAL preservation work.

Once your IBL or pure lines are crossed you can not return to original uniformity to breed new hybrids, that's why is so important to preserve first the lines in pure form before cross them and i can tell you be are aware of this.

If you have preserved something by yourself or you have personal experience about preservation then share it, but to doubt about other's like us who have been posting landrace pics for YEARS without add nothing from your part (about growing and preservation) is not a good thing.

We have developed our own hybrids without copi other's work or use the typical afghani, skunk or nl plants.

Our panama hybrid is a combination of 3 different panama/columbian varieties. Original columbian/panama varities need 16 to 20 weeks to flower. Our hybrid is still 100 % sativa but finishes in late october (10-11 weeks flowering time) from seed and can be grown even at 40ºN, still showing the old red pistil trait. We have improved a lot resin content, adaptability to indoor growing, yield, potency, reduced hermie rates etc ... compared to original panama/columbian sativas.

You should know that the pure lines we used to develop the Panama hybrid are still alive and preserved. It's up to you if you dont like our Panama or Congo hybrid, but refuse the botanial value and improvemnt of our Panama hybrid based in prejuices and not in personal growing experience is not the way to judge.

 

[Guest]

I wish we are all clever on this and stop turning thread any more into personal which is not worth at all at the end.

Peace all, hhf

 

[Farmer John]

What kind of populations do you guys use in this preservation project? From what I have read and talked with people it takes a huge population to preserve the variation that would show in nature, otherwise its more like narrowing down things like hermaphroditic traits and so, its more like inbreeding when you throw away plants that just arent any good, by preserving genetics you must keep all the variation in there right? nayhoo, the guy I got the "Acapulco Gold" in Guerrero was kinda amused by the fact that people still call their weed funny names, for them its just marijuana that they have been growing for decades, this was in Zihuatanejo and the guy I got the seeds from just said that they tend to collect always only the seeds from the best plants and that there is and has always been a lot of variation in the plants but because of their experience they know what to look for, and that nice golden color you get on your buds if you leave a jar in sunlight for some time, if you dont then its green like any plant that produces chlorophyll, of course they will turn "golden" or better brown if you let them cure for a long time, but hell, mexican way seems to be to throw whole plants in sand and let them sit there for a few days or so...anyhoo, he and his family have been growing what people call Acapulco Gold for decades and he still called it just marijuana. So thats a good example of how real preservation would work, 1000s of plants and open pollination, some are grown and separated for sin semilla production and others are con semilla and those seeds they grow, do their selection their way and it still seems to work quite well, theres a lot of variation in there which leaves a lot of choice for people who want to grow it, the way I think it is that inbreeding/using small populations to preserve genetics isnt very easy and only leads to a point where there isnt any variation and that sounds bad to me, I like variation. ah, rantranrant but hell, if someone from that region tells me this and goes and collects only the best seeds for me then I am quite happy, no matter how much freaks or shit pops from them but I know that most of the genes are there and not worked away by selecting only a few mothers and fathers...do I make any sense?

 

[la mano negra]

Hola
please,
stop this stupit war


PEACE



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vGBExhxpF4&mode=related&search=

 

[Farmer John]

^^
Damn right LMN, too much bullshit over a silly plant haha. I love all you guys and the work you do but why cant we all just get along? At least you guys do some real breeding and not the bedroom pollenchucking that some reputable "breeders" do, preservation or not, its a great thing you guys keep alive these things the best way you can, much love...

 

[Guest]

Hola
please,
stop this stupit war

ningún hermano del problema.

paz, hf

no matter how much freaks or shit pops from them but I know that most of the genes are there and not worked away by selecting only a few mothers and fathers...do I make any sense?

Does to me,

Peace, hhf

 

[Dalaihempy]

dubi
One was reproduced by pacific, then by wolfman and then by us in the past 2-3 years.



dubi Pacific had no hand in the breeding of OT1 sativa line all pacific did was pass them on to wolfman instead of makeing seed as was sed to ot1.

I know this for a fact becouse i as a few others at CW were watching this unravel in shantis forum and i rember the spanish guys getting them ,they were first to get them after ot1 first got seed back then pacific got some as pacific was calling wolfman a thief od considering pacific gave them to him .

 

[charlie garcia]

would all of you ever stop this fight pls?
I got the seeds, I would have preferred thay have had no name written but were just plants
peace all

 

[Farmer John]

"Acapulco Gold" selected seeds on the left just for the kicks, kashmir landrace on the right side, peace all and lets not fight, I love you guys. :smile:

They look beautiful, nice red/brown color.

 

[Herbalistic]

^^^ Yeah, I think it is all been said and continuing this will only separate this wonderful community we all love so much. People have been informated what has happened and everybody can make their own conclusions if they want!

Oldtimer had 3 hazes lines, he distributed seeds between many many growers around the world in the 90s. Noone reproduced them, 2 hazes lines were lost. One was reproduced by pacific, then by wolfman and then by us in the past 2-3 years.

Bros Grimms purple haze was indeed a haze line from Oldtimer, he commented me how Soul received some haze seeds but he was initally more interested in cross them and not in preserve them in pure form. Dont know what could happen with them or if it's the same line we have preserved lately.

Damn, I didnt know there were 3 oldschool lines Shame we have only one of those left, well it´s better than none, ha?

We dont know if somebody will someday pop up from the bushes and introduce "new" oldschool line which offer huge genetic variation, till then we just have to get along what we got!

I like variation. ah, rantranrant but hell, if someone from that region tells me this and goes and collects only the best seeds for me then I am quite happy, no matter how much freaks or shit pops from them but I know that most of the genes are there and not worked away by selecting only a few mothers and fathers...do I make any sense?

It make´s sense FJ, I agree with you!! Quite big sized beans those Acapulco Gold´s!

Very interesting info about other oldschool lines have been posted, I hope to learn more from this thread so thanks for those who shared their information!!!

 

[Guest]

What kind of populations do you guys use in this preservation project? From what I have read and talked with people it takes a huge population to preserve the variation that would show in nature, otherwise its more like narrowing down things like hermaphroditic traits and so, its more like inbreeding when you throw away plants that just arent any good, by preserving genetics you must keep all the variation in there right?

.....


So thats a good example of how real preservation would work, 1000s of plants and open pollination, some are grown and separated for sin semilla production and others are con semilla and those seeds they grow, do their selection their way and it still seems to work quite well, theres a lot of variation in there which leaves a lot of choice for people who want to grow it, the way I think it is that inbreeding/using small populations to preserve genetics isnt very easy and only leads to a point where there isnt any variation and that sounds bad to me, I like variation. ah, rantranrant but hell, if someone from that region tells me this and goes and collects only the best seeds for me then I am quite happy, no matter how much freaks or shit pops from them but I know that most of the genes are there and not worked away by selecting only a few mothers and fathers...do I make any sense?

Unless you know how many traits you have to preserved, how many genes are involved, if they are linked together or not, no it doesn't make sense to me. It depends too much also of how many individuals you kept at the first grow and how much the strain was inbred before you put your hands on it.

See this link for mathematical details if you want to discuss it furtherly:
http://www.vibescollective.org/forum/index.php?topic=1308.0

Last results I obtained from my own mathematical model show that even if you work with 1000 individuals, maintaining for ten generations a population with one allele being at p = 0.1 for frequency is an hardy task which is already linked with chance. Conserving the whole diversity of a strain seem to be a task reserved to nature ;-)

 

[stretchpup]

I could only imagine the good you all would do for the community if differences can be put aside.

A lot of things go sour in relationships but most are salvageable with a little work from both parties.

Keep up the good work, and keep the information coming! Despite a little squabble here and there there is amazing information in this thread!

k+

 

[moe]

"Acapulco Gold" selected seeds on the left just for the kicks, kashmir landrace on the right side, peace all and lets not fight, I love you guys. :smile:

They look beautiful, nice red/brown color.

nice seed= nice plant ?

 

[Raco]

"and that nice golden color you get on your buds if you leave a jar in sunlight for some time, if you dont then its green like any plant that produces chlorophyll, of course they will turn "golden" or better brown if you let them cure for a long time"

Hola FJ
I grew this colombian in a terrace at 43ºN.Was grown the same way than the rest of the plants in the same grow.And dryed and cured the same way
Dr.Jay´s words.
"Damn raco,those look like yellow turds out of a racoon"