PPM or PH monitoring.. whats more important?

[GrowerGoneWild]

Hey folks.. got a question for you.. If you were to pick constant monitoring of PPM or PH what would you watch? You can only choose one, (yes I'm aware of combi meters that do both)

I have some ideas running around in my head about this stuff thinking that PH may be more important to monitor vs. PPM, but I can see PPM important to monitor for water added back to the res.

Anywho.. just wondering if anybody has any ideas on the subject. I have so many thoughts about this but they seem not to make sense..

FYI: I do have a PPM/PH pen but I wanted to improve my growcab by adding constant nute monitoring.

 

[Bush Grower]

If I could only monitor one, it would be PH.

With PH you can tell whether you need more or less nutes and also keep the nutes in the right ph range for the best uptake.

Ph goes up= you need more nutes
ph goes down= you need less nutes

 

[littlebud]

ph is everything...it tells you what you need to know...i only use ph meeters i droped the tds a few years back

 

[00420]

ph by far.......

ppm you can be within 50-100 if not more ph you better not be off or your plants wont uptake the nute's, ppm can be controlled by how much you add per gallon. ph is all over the place depinding where your water is from to the nute's you use. my tap where i live now is 7.4 my old house it was 6.9....

 

[Igignokt]

I ph the water before I feed. I understand how PH going up means it needs more and PH going down means needs less food, but how do you soil growers check when you're growing in pots such as 3 gallons? Do you water the shit out of them and find out?

 

[FreezerBoy]

I love my BlueLab EC Truncheon but, now that I have it, I wonder if I couldn't have done without. If I'd take pH over EC (which I do) then ppms don't stand a prayer.

 

[mikecar312]

how long have you been using the truncheon? i was thinking about buying one.

 

[FreezerBoy]

Since about February. I ran E&F for years, blissfully unaware of EC and was adjusting pH with vinegar of all things. Thank goodness it's a weed that can survive damn near anything.

They run $135-$150 in the stores. I've seen them in the $105-$110 range on the web.

 

[Wonderon]

Forgive me as I'm still trying to understand all this myself. I don't get how just the PH tells you all you need to know. Say you begin with tap that is 7.4, obviously it needs to be dropped to 5.5-6. Then what, how do you know how much nutes to add? I can't seem to figure a way out of spending the $110 for a bluelabs or $35 for a china knock off, kinda figure I need one or the other and that the bluelabs should last longer. For me it seems I need to be able to EC and Ph test. I was just gonna use aquarium ph strips along with an ec meter.

 

[Movintarget]

Correct me if I'm wrong, I understand that the PH spectrim, at different levels IE..5.6 allows nuts to be absorbed by the plant. If your PH is to high or to low then the plant will not utilize all the nutes...So if you can't control your PH it doesn't matter about the PPM is cause your plant will be dead...

 

[Guest]

I personally am of the opinion that neither need constant monitoring. You can easily keep ph in check with strips or liquid test kits. If you get a meter and the probe requires frequent changing, you'll end up spending more in the long run, although it is convenient. Also, ph testers are common and you don't need to go to a specialty store to find them.

E.C. meters are only really necessary when recirculating or when you've just started a nute schedule and you need to know what's up. After a while using the same nutes/water, you'll probably rarely even see the meter, let alone use it.

If you aren't recirculating, same could be said about ph; X ml/gallon nutes, X drops of ph+/-, and you're straight.

If I had to choose one, it would be an E.C. meter.

 

[GrowerGoneWild]

Forgive me as I'm still trying to understand all this myself. I don't get how just the PH tells you all you need to know. Say you begin with tap that is 7.4, obviously it needs to be dropped to 5.5-6. Then what, how do you know how much nutes to add? I can't seem to figure a way out of spending the $110 for a bluelabs or $35 for a china knock off, kinda figure I need one or the other and that the bluelabs should last longer. For me it seems I need to be able to EC and Ph test. I was just gonna use aquarium ph strips along with an ec meter.

No problem I've been growing for awhile and I get confused a bit.

If you start out with decent tap water, and you add nutes (I'm a GH person myself). To your desired PPM level it should go to the 5 PH that you are looking for.

Here's the tricky parts.

-At lower PPM' 600~ Ph tends to drift. Somtimes PH down is needed.

-The quality of your water has everything to do with your initial PH, for example RO water with nutes tends to have a lower PH than if you mixed
with your tap water.

 

[GrowerGoneWild]

If I had to choose one, it would be an E.C. meter.

Of all the people out there this is a vote for the PPM/EC meter. (BTW I've seen your grow it seems like you know your stuff)

Anywho, for the most part I've noticed that medium to heavy feeding in either DWC or aeroponic. PH for the most part stays stable. (GH Flora Nova).

Why I'm picking constant monitoring is that in late flower my PPM's are all over the place (the ladies like to drink when they get old) so i'm guessing that a PPM monitor will help me with my water addback.

PH is very important, but I dont think it needs to be monitored as much as PPM's. The nutrient should have enough buffers in it to stay PH stable.

I dont know.. just some thoughts going through my head.

 

[gramsci.antonio]

If I could only monitor one, it would be PH.

With PH you can tell whether you need more or less nutes and also keep the nutes in the right ph range for the best uptake.

Ph goes up= you need more nutes
ph goes down= you need less nutes

can anyone confirm this please?


Quite an amazing discovery...

 

[Tokabowl]

I have only monitored pH so far and all has gone well (soil grows using Canna nutes).
It would of course be more interesting and accurate to monitor both pH and EC/PPM, but pH is imho the most important.

Forgive me as I'm still trying to understand all this myself. I don't get how just the PH tells you all you need to know. Say you begin with tap that is 7.4, obviously it needs to be dropped to 5.5-6. Then what, how do you know how much nutes to add?

You can monitor the pH of your tap water to get an idea, but even if it is at 7.4 from the tap, you need to add your nutes first then test the pH and adjust to 5.5 (or whatever your target pH is). If you adjust the pH first, then add nutes, it is most likely you will need to readjust it again, which means more acid in the tank, and in the long run will be costlier for both the plants and yourself.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I understand that the PH spectrim, at different levels IE..5.6 allows nuts to be absorbed by the plant. If your PH is to high or to low then the plant will not utilize all the nutes...So if you can't control your PH it doesn't matter about the PPM is cause your plant will be dead...

That's correct, if the pH varies too much on either side of the scale it will cause certain nute lockouts and therefore cause a range of nute defs.
Here is a chart that can come in handy:

 

[DrLongbottom]

If only One can be chosen it is Ph .....without a ph meter there is no way of knowing the ph of water. As far as ppm thats something your adding...so if a ppm meter is unavailable to you just feed with a very light mix to start....a good grower will be able to see the plants needs and slowly up the nutes required to find the happy medium (the whole time having happy ph) DLB

 

[GrowerGoneWild]

If only One can be chosen it is Ph .....without a ph meter there is no way of knowing the ph of water. As far as ppm thats something your adding...so if a ppm meter is unavailable to you just feed with a very light mix to start....a good grower will be able to see the plants needs and slowly up the nutes required to find the happy medium (the whole time having happy ph) DLB

Well, you could start with RO water, that would set your PH at 7.

I gotta agree with you on seeing what plants need.. I've done grows with no PH/PPM pen at all (left the damm thing in my car) it did require alot more attention on my part.

 

[FreezerBoy]

I don't get how just the PH tells you all you need to know. Say you begin with tap that is 7.4, obviously it needs to be dropped to 5.5-6. Then what, how do you know how much nutes to add?

Easy. The nute solutions listed on your bottle are not designed for healthy growth, they exist to suck your wallet dry. Cut the recommendation by 50% (if not 75%) and go from there. Lucas says "0-8-16." My plant says "Bullshit, 0-3-6 is WAY too strong." Listen to your plants.

can anyone confirm this please?
(Ph goes up= you need more nutes
ph goes down= you need less nutes)

Quite an amazing discovery...

EC and pH move in opposite directions. If the solution is too strong, plants drink more water than nutes forcing EC up while pH drops. Too weak, plants drink more food than water and EC drops while pH rises.

I slightly overfeed with barely alkaline water. Over 2 weeks EC climbs while pH drops from 6.0 - 5.6. 4 gallons of unadjusted tap water brings me back to my starting levels.

 

[gramsci.antonio]

You can monitor the pH of your tap water to get an idea, but even if it is at 7.4 from the tap, you need to add your nutes first then test the pH and adjust to 5.5 (or whatever your target pH is). If you adjust the pH first, then add nutes, it is most likely you will need to readjust it again, which means more acid in the tank, and in the long run will be costlier for both the plants and yourself.

Sorry man, i gotta disagree on this one.

If you add your GH nutrients in a water with a ph outside of 5.5-6.5 you're going to break down the chelate, losing most of the advantages of mineral nutrients.