PK 13/14 with coco? lil help

[smurfin'herb]

I read somewhere in this forum that coco has higher levels of p and k in it, and that coco specific nutes are specifically made with lower levels of p and k. If this is true, then why do some of you add pk 13/14 when theres supposedly already enough pre-existing pk in the coco? Also, im a little confused on some other things: Cal-mag is not to be used with hard water right? And what is the difference between liquid karma and botanicare sweet, are they to be used together or does the karma already have the elements that sweet does? probly stupid questions but ive only ever just used flora nova grow and bloom and nothin else, so any help with nutrient/ supplement advice is greatly appreciated!! thx

 

[Guest]

I have allways used it in low dosages either in week 3 at 2ml/gallon or 3wks prior to finish at 3-4ml/gallon in coco with the canna line. I have also used High P guano teas instead as there is a ton of K in the coco allready. It is the fact that the PK 13/14 is imediately available to the plant that makes it of great bennefit. Remember that strain type and a lot of other factors play in and you may see adverse effects in hard water. I have used and loved the LK before, bu not the Sweet. I personally like good old Blackstrap Mollasses.

Peace and safe growing to Ya!!

 

[smurfin'herb]

ya im definately going with canna coco nutes, i have never used them and i have hard water, since u have experience with them perhaps you could tell me what other products work well with that line.

 

[Guest]

Smurf -

I would recommend just starting with Coco A&B, Rhizotonic, Canazym, and Canna's coco for sure. Drain to waste 10-20% run off each day @1 watering perday, no recirculation. Start at 1/2 to 3/4 dose following their feeding chart. You can throw in some LK or Floralicious Plus or BioBoost if you want. I ran the basics for 3 years on o.k. tap with no meter without any trouble at all. NO AERATION with the Canna coco nutes. That is what their Plant biologist told me on the phone when I had some fall out/precipitates in the res. Just maintain 66-74DegF res and get some drippers on a timer running once perday to 10-20% run off (maybe twice when larger). Assuming you have the environment dialed you will be amazed! They have great stuff. I am just playing/saving with the CNS-17 now as I have a feel for my set-up.

Best Wishes

 

[smurfin'herb]

unfortunaltely i cant get cannas coco but instead i can get b'cuzz coco and that stuffs pretty good. i never had a problem with it. do you know how it compares against cannas coco?

 

[Guest]

That is good coco as well. I have tried about every grade of coco out there cheap to expensive and most have been fine.

 

[Ghost]

Azeotrope,

You can't go wrong with Canna Coco A & B, Cannazym, Rhizotonic, and PK 13/14.

I use RO water, so I also add 5ml of Advanced Nutrients Sensical. It is "like" Cal-Mag, with 2 seperate formulas- 1 for grow & 1 for flower.

Although by no means necessary, I like to use AN Bud Blood, Big Bud, and Overdrive. While getting use to the Canna line it is probably best to start with the basics and add supplements as you progress.

Enjoy growing on coco with Canna!

 

[aeric]

Yep start with the basics.

LK and sweet are completely different products, equally useful. In the organic hydro section there is alot of good info on them. AN Carboload or molasses serve a similar purpose to Sweet. LK is indispensable IMO for many reasons and imparts an organic sensibility to chem grown but you can live without it. Great for clones also, they don't yellow at the end of rooting when using it.

Though coco needs less P and K the requirements go up enough mid flower that a booster like PK is still helpful, mainly it increases yield over not using, but again isn't totally needed. A+B, Rhizo, and pH adjuster are all you really need.

The use of calmag depends on your tap water, knowing whether or not you need it depends on experience, or better yet a chemical analysis of your water, which most can't afford.

 

[smurfin'herb]

dont cities post the water report and specs every year in all places? I just got mine in a local city pamphlet. I was also thinking on going with hygrozyme over cannazym since i already have a bottle, does anyone know how they compare. Also, has anyone read bigtokes basic water chemistry? Im trying to understand how this all works but ive already taken two pages of notes and im on my third time reading it and im still havin trouble, being that i have never owned anything for h2o except ph strips(which blow). I dunno how to find or create a good buffer point so that my ph will stay stabilized when i add acidic compounds. I have no idea what the water is like here yet but im guessin its hard (i always try to put myself in the worst positin when guessing things on/for a grow, just so im never dissapointed). So if your not to bubble canna nutes with water, then how do you keep the nutrients and water to stay evenly mixed in the resevoir? I feel like posting my smoke...

 

[aeric]

Yes I would think all water treatment facilities have to do that, I don't know that the public report is thorough enough though. (wow alot of "ough" there lol, let's try: "thoro enuff tho") Much of the things we're concerned with like iron, copper and lime are deposited on the pipes as well and are not neccesarily the same as what even your neighbor would get which the water dept. won't put in your report, but, good thinking on that point smurfin.

I don't know from experience if what azeotrope says is true but it makes sense. I always bubble the tap water for at least a few hours, normally a day to evaporate chlorine and then mix with a pump, there is a hose coming out of the pump which sits near the top of the water but not above the surface, where it would splash and further aerate after nutes were added, so that sort of thing may help you. By the way if you don't let fresh tap sit or aerate before using the chlorine will kill beneficial bacteria in your coco, the trichoderma are part of why coco works so well in the first place, of course this goes for any beneficial bacteria you may wish to add down the line. If your facility happens to use chloramine then you're screwed, it can't be bubbled out.

I don't have a pH meter either, just use the GH pH testing kit, it's alittle tedious but better than constantly cleaning and calibrating a meter IMO.

Many say hygrozyme is as good or better than cannazyme.

 

[aeric]

the bigtoke thread is a 'sticky' at the top of the hydro forum.

 

[OsWiZzLe]

isnt the new PK 13/14 changed to 10/11 ? thats what the dude at the hydro shop told me yesterday

 

[Guest]

NO AERATION with the Canna coco nutes. That is what their Plant biologist told me on the phone when I had some fall out/precipitates in the res. Just maintain 66-74DegF res and get some drippers on a timer running once perday to 10-20% run off (maybe twice when larger.)

I'm curious about this; I haven't seen this information on the Canna Web site?

I hand feed, and always aerate the mix, (usually an hour or two before the feeding.)
I always set the PH between 5.7 and 5.9 and the last of a few days reservoir was still below 5.95 tonight. (from that I deduce aeration doesn't overly affect the PH.)

I've only ever grown in Coco but I've found over the last couple of years Canna are constantly altering their recommendations.

Keeping on the subject of the PK I always add it in reduced quantities at the sign of the first flowers. ( I've read to many horror stories of folk following Cannas' instructions, and burning their plants.)

Maybe it don't burn tomato's but, a sudden influx, don't seem to do the ladies too much good.

Well that's my tuppence worth good luck with your grow.

gringle

 

[smurfin'herb]

If your facility happens to use chloramine then you're screwed, it can't be bubbled out.

How do i check for chloramine? And did you learn this first hand? if so, how did you find out that chloramine is what it was?

Thanks for all the info to everyone else in here also. I appreciate it!

 

[aeric]

Alot of interesting results when using the search button....
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=60800&highlight=chloramine
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=60242&highlight=chloramine

 

[Guest]

Hi again:
just passing observations (and being wasted.) I can't help wondering; if Canna Co, have problems, with their new product; Canna Bio Boost??

(after three days on normal food.) {plus aeration} it smells like sour milk.

just passing comments from an inquiring mind....spaced???

good luck with your grow

gringle

 

[Guest]

Good advice Azeotrope. Smurfdude, Canna nutes can't be beaten, in my opinion. Just do as Az said and feed at reduced rates from what the label says. I fed A+B at 6mL/gal almost my entire grow (almost 4 months, lol) once the plants were well on there way during veg. I used just about 1.25 liter for the whole grow.

And I also switched to B'cuzz due to the availability issue. I's ok to use right out of the bag just as is Canna Coco Coir.

HESI nutes are premo and they offer a coco line also. I plan on giving them a try in the future cause nobody around here stocks Canna, hehe. If I encounter a problem, I'll be right back to Canna though.

Gringle makes a good point. Add PK 13/14 at a severely reduced rate! I also cut back on the Canna "B" to about half when I started adding the PK. Added the PK at 1-2mL/gal. Started at 1mL and eased up to 2mL after I was sure the plants weren't going to explode on me, hehe.

Peace