Overwatered?

[Bramski]

Ok here we go again, humble pie time. Looking for some ideas to help turn this around. Long story short I suck at growing from seed. Im using an NFT system where the Rockwool cubes are sitting on a spreader mat. I think I seem to have overwatered these babies badly. I have 104 seedlings in rockwool sitting on trays with spreader mat.

They're about 12 days from seed and they developed leaf curl about 5 days ago and I flushed them thinking it was Overfert, they havent grown much at all since then and the yellowing's got worse. I started to doubt that it was overwatering as I was peeking at the roots and they looked nice and white so I though they were needing a dose of Nitrogen but in hindsight I can see that has just added to the problem as the yellowing was due to the lack of o2.

They havent had any water for 48 hours now and some of them seem to be picking up a little and I've had a peek under the rockwool and the roots are still white on most of them a few have damaged roots are starting to kick out white ones again.

So what's my next move? Just leave them drying out until they're almost dry, then water very lightly with some nutes and H2o2 when the seem dry again? or have I totally misdiagnosed this and they need a feed... Catch 22...

Im struggling to get back in let alone stay in the game, help an old dog out lol

 

[Moppel]

in my opinion she needs N. foliar feed them with N a couple of times.

 

[Guest]

nah,too much water,no enough roots to carry the water up.Stick it in a pot with clay pebbles for 5-7 days,get the roots growing again.Not seen you about for a while bramski...good luck

 

[dre86]

I would start feeding when the cotyledons turn yellow. These plants look overwatered. I don't know anything about hydro but isn't it time yet to transplant them (to bigger cubes?)?

 

[Moppel]

that leave on the first pic, the one which is colored yellow with those brown spots. thats a sign of N def.

 

[Guest]

5-7days from seed,there should be no n def,its overwatering

 

[sproutco]

Check your roots for any signs of root rot starting. Like root ends turning brown or black. Roots should be completely white unless your ferts stain them.

 

[Bramski]

Thanks for the feedback pees. It's not an N def, and if it is it's been induced by overwatering rather than from lack of nutes, that Im sure of as they've had ferts. There is a bit of rot starting Sproutco but it seems to be halting since Iv'e stopped putting water through the system.

I've been foliar feeding them Rhizotonic today to try and relieve the stress and get the root system going and I have H2o2 but I want to let them dry out a bit more before I put a H2o2 solution through the system.

What about nutes once they've dried out? what strength we looking at, I gave them 180 ppm? 350ppm? Im using advanced hydroponics of holland nutes.

 

[Guest]

Bramski,the best/fastest way to get your roots going again,put the plant in a pot with clay pebbles(or similar medium)a couple of days hand watering with plain water only(gets the roots searching bigtime)an you,ll be fine.

 

[Bramski]

That's not ideal Big J as All of the plants are on a spreader mat and the roots have grown into it, it would mean ripping the plants out of the spreader and creating even more stress.

I'll let them dry out a bit more and keep on foliar feeding the Rhizotonic and see how they go from there. I have 2 coco trays that I have setup, one already has 30 seedlings in there and they're doing MUCH better than the ones I put into the NFT trays and they're younger than the NFT seedlings, so I'll stick my new seedlings into the into the coco from now on this NFT has me pissed off. It's been good to me in the past but I've always worked from clone, these seedlings have me on the ropes, they're so fickle

 

[Diego]

start over, it can take longer to fix that than is necissarry. yeah and overwatered or maybe room is too cool to start off seedlings. THat have to be pretty cold though.

 

[Bramski]

start over,

I wish I had that luxury mate but If I don't get this room up to speed soon I'm pretty much up shit creek. If it was only a few seedlings I would start over but I have 100+ sitting in these trays so I'll try and turn them round.

I've done it before in this same setup, that's why I'm pissed off for letting it happen again. The plus side though is I managed to turn that grow around.


Before




After






If I can do it again this time then I'll be a happy man, otherwise I'll be hungry and homeless

 

[MynameStitch]

your plants are very hungry, not to mention that last picture looks like you got some root issues going from it sitting in saturated rockwool

Growing in rock wool cubes like hat is not a good route to take when growing cannabis, you have to have about every resource avaiable, not to mention they have to get all there food from the water and nutrients you provide, its not like soil where they are taking it in slowly.

I would add a mixture of water and h202 to help provide more air to the roots, and if any root rot is starting it will help kill it off if its not to bad.

Your plants are starving for food, nitrogen and phoshprus looks like right now

What nutrients are you using and how much and how often?

and are you checking ph?

 

[sproutco]

Seedlings should be around 50-150 PPM
Unrooted clones to be around 100-350 PPM
small plants to be around 400-800 PPM
large plants to be around 900-1800 PPM
Last week of flowering use plain water.

You should be using about 100 ppm nitrogen and no more as part of your complete grow formula. You can figure out your ppms of each element your using by obtaining the net weight of the bottle, total ml, ml used, and % element like 5% calcium. Enter these numbers into the calculator at the bottom of the page. http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/profiles.htm This is a much better way of adjusting and feeding nutrients to your seedlings. Also, there is suggested rates for seedlings listed on the same page. If you list your nutrient ppms, we can take a look and see if anything needs adjusting like adding epsom salts for example.

 

[Guest]

Stitch has good info, I have had problems similar in rockwool, sometimes it works like magic, and sometimes oversaturated rockwool really inhibits root growth causing deficiencies and lockout due to high PH and too wet.. Check the worst ones, I bet the roots are yellowish cream color and very small..

 

[Bramski]

Ok here's what I have in the nute/additive dept..

Rhizotonic.
H2o2 (Plenty of)
Dutch Formula (very similar to GH Flora) http://www.advancedhydro.com/pages/view.asp?nid=21&ecid=&ecookie=&lang=1)
PH up and down and a decent meter, PH has always been within acceptable range.

I haven't fed them anything for about 50 hours, not even water, as I've been trying to let them dry out as I thought I was overwatering. When I did feed them prior to that I gave them about 240ppm measured using one of the NZ truncheons. They were being fed via a recirculating pump system at 1 min every hour to try and prevent Overwatering.

I've been trying to lift some of the cubes up to see how the roots are looking, the majority of cubes wont lift as the roots are gripping to the spreader mat and they are still white on most of the ones I've managed to peek at.


So whudya think troops, give them a feed and an H2o2 dose or what?


Thats a good nute profile site Sprout, cheers mate.

 

[CaptJamesTKirk]

over 100 seedlings in a tray - what ya going to do with the males?

Just hada ask - now back to read the rest,,, - - overwatered - won't get better till the ballance the roots to the tops.

I'm rootin for ya! sick plants SUCK!!!!

question - are the roots still wet when the pump comes on for the next watering????
there is the problem

Son - I don't do hydro, yet - but I've been studyin sum - my vote is a tad heavy on the nutes - possibly due to the sickly health; but overwatering is the first priority. From what I've learned - it's improtant the roots get dry between waterings. the trick is not too dry so as to cause stress, but to wet is lethal. In soil - I try my best to water a couple hours befor the plant will begin to droop . for hydro,,, I'm thinking (ouch ouch) the roots will be harmed befor the green starts to droop - that's what I'm thinking,, anyway - I'd be trying to get to a few minutes ever 4 or 5 hours. I also think it is a ballance thing, presently the ballance of off, so you will be a busy nurse for a while -

I wouldn't be using any nutes till the leaves perk back up - watering needs to be reduced - I'd watch the root zone and water prior to the tiny tips getting too dry and not again till they are like that again - you shoud see some improvment in 2 or 3 cycles if your on track good luck

 

[Bramski]

over 100 seedlings in a tray - what ya going to do with the males?

Chop them, then run an enzyme to break down the roots left in the system.



I flushed the plants with a plain PH water with a H2o2 solution then started a feeding schedule of 300ppm nutes whilst foliar feeding Rhizotonic. This brought them round and kicked them into growth and I could see the new growth was looking healthier as each day passed.

I've bumped the nuted up to just over 400ppm now and I'll see how they take to that. I'll keep on foliar feeding the Rhizo and topping up the tank with H2o2. New root growth is thick and white thanks to the H2o2 and the Rhizo. They're still not 100% but they are getting there.





I've started some new female seedlings that I'll put in coco just as a safety precaution as I need to get a crop in soon as well as some clone stock.








I'll try not to kill these ones, thanks folks