one quick fan question...

[blackdoctormd]

Ive been on the lookout for a cheap fan to exhaust my planned grow in a growlab gl40 with 150w hps. i was looking for one that could handle this filter: http://www.horticulturesource.com/c...5759/?osCsid=60e944ecabe3bd0cabb255ea2b2a3a53

and i came upon this:
http://www.amazon.com/Inline-Mixed-...3?s=home-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1314271568&sr=1-3

my question is: will this fan be enough to adequately exhaust my tent? will i have odor or temp issues? what about volume? im looking for the most stealthy and affordable set up i can find and if any one can make any suggestions theyd be appreciated.


thanks

bdmd

edit: can i get away with this lower cfm version? http://www.amazon.com/TD-Mixvent-TD...1?s=home-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1314271568&sr=1-1

edit 2: what about a 4" sunleaves windtunnel? or panasonic whisperline? too big? any feedback appreciated.

 

[FreezerBoy]

I have the S&P and it's a great little fan but, it simply does NOT suck like a Vortex style centrifugal. Whatever you feel your needs are, go at least one model up.

 

[qupee]

That fan should be ok. I have a few of the S&P's. They suck alright and are quieter than a centrifugal. It won't be whisper quiet, though. That lower cfm TD100 might be iffy, a TD100x I'd say ok though. Sucks to buy a fan too small and be stuck buying another right away - of course, doing that and ending up with extra equipment is how I went from one 400w cab and 200w cfl veg to 4 tents with 2800w and several veg areas totalling over 1kw in a little over a year.

As for the filter, you won't often see that type of filter being used for odor control - and maybe there's a reason (idk, never tried one). Phresh filter has some good sizes and prices, and I've had good experience with their filters (better than Can Filters).

 

[blackdoctormd]

okay thanks for the input. so would a 4x8 phresh filter rated at 150 cfm be enough for my 1'4" x 1'4" x 3'11" tent? what would be a better fan? the sp 100x the 4" sunleaves windtunnel or the 4" panasonic whisperline?

thanks a lot

edit: keep in mind im looking for the absolute quietest/odor free fan/filter combo for my gl40 tent which will be run inside a closet

 

[qupee]

I'd probably go with the 4x12 phresh filter. Better to go a little bigger.

The sunleaves windtunnel will be loud. the panasonic whisperline I really doubt will move enough air. My vote is for the S&P. It would be nice if someone who has used both a TD-100 and a TD-100x could chime in, my smallest is the TD-125.

If you want quiet, I'd suggest keeping the fan and filter inside the tent, so your ventillation flows filter->fan->hood->out. Although, typing that, I realize you probably don't have a ventillated hood or cooltube. If that's true (that you don't), I'll back my recommendation off and say TD-100 (lower cfm) is ok for you. Whisperline might even possibly be an option.. but, idk, it might not either.

 

[whatsupdoc]

I can tell you from experience (an expensive lesson learned) that the filter you linked WILL NOT work. I have one - it now sits in storage because it didn't work worth a damn and almost got me busted.

I have a Phat filter now, and I highly recommend it. Pay the price. Your freedom is worth it!

 

[blackdoctormd]

ok guys thanks for the info on the scrubber will def look into it.

my tent is gonna be inside a big closetmaid closet.
i will be running a 150w hps vertically and bare bulbed. im gonna have a pc fan on the bulb and a fan underneath the canopy when in flower. im planning to go filter-> fan -> out much like this:http://www.420magazine.com/gallery/data/500/rsz_img_0226.jpghttp://www.420magazine.com/gallery/data/500/rsz_img_0225.jpg. however im not sure the 12" filter will fit with the fan in my tent. do you think 8 inch is okay?

also should i get a fan speed controller even for a 4 in fan? and ive heard good things about this fan: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0033BONO2/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&m=A1CIF30KJ11RZA

can anyone shed some light on how loud it will be inside the tent and the closetmaid? and should i add vents to my closetmaid so that air circulates better?

thanks a lot everyone youve been a big help

bdmd

 

[qupee]

I think the ValuLine will be louder than you want. It's a centrifugal, and any 4" centrifugal will be roughly the same level of noise. Don't bother with a speed controller for an S&P fan. They have a high and low speed connection, and if the low's enough air movement it'll be pretty quiet. None of my S&P's like a standard speed controller very much - they work better with a centrifugal.

I would say loudness, outside the tent will be louder than a PC, but quieter than a normal oscillating stand fan (and lower pitch, less noticeable). If you had another fan running in the same room it would drown out the noise well.

And if you can only fit the 8" filter, go with that. If you can fit the 12" that's better, but the 8" should work - might not last as long. But your airflow rate should be ok for that 8" long phresh filter.

 

[dansbuds]

Good fan ....wrong filter . try this one .... cheaper & a good scrubber .
http://www.bghydro.com/BGH/itemdesc.asp?ic=AOCCF0090&eq=&Tp=

good fan & filter combo ... have been using it for over a year in a cabinet a little bigger than your tent & the plus is ..... the filter is refillable .

oh yeah ..... a speed controller is a must have for temp control (full force is NOT a good thing ) i recomend this one .... its a little pricey but worth every penny .
http://www.google.com/products/cata...a=X&ei=dyBXTqiuJMjY0QGw7by0DA&ved=0CEUQ8wIwAA

 

[blackdoctormd]

Good fan ....wrong filter . try this one .... cheaper & a good scrubber .
http://www.bghydro.com/BGH/itemdesc.asp?ic=AOCCF0090&eq=&Tp=

good fan & filter combo ... have been using it for over a year in a cabinet a little bigger than your tent & the plus is ..... the filter is refillable .

way too big for my tent...(gl40)

I think the ValuLine will be louder than you want. It's a centrifugal, and any 4" centrifugal will be roughly the same level of noise. Don't bother with a speed controller for an S&P fan. They have a high and low speed connection, and if the low's enough air movement it'll be pretty quiet. None of my S&P's like a standard speed controller very much - they work better with a centrifugal.

I would say loudness, outside the tent will be louder than a PC, but quieter than a normal oscillating stand fan (and lower pitch, less noticeable). If you had another fan running in the same room it would drown out the noise well.

And if you can only fit the 8" filter, go with that. If you can fit the 12" that's better, but the 8" should work - might not last as long. But your airflow rate should be ok for that 8" long phresh filter.

okay so the s&p fan with the 8" filter should be okay? a pc isnt very loud and my tent WILL be in a closetmaid aswell so... should i get the TD-100 or TD-100x? final question i promise!!!


thanks again,

bdmd

 

[qupee]

I have a Can 9000. I'd rather have a small Phresh filter.


Go with the 100x, if you have the extra $. Take a look at the specs.




While the 100 may move a little more air (barely) under some resistance, the 100x operates at considerably lower rpm, and can ultimately move more air under low amounts of resistance. Lower rpm should mean less noise. The 100x also pushes more air than the 100 on high speed, but if you stay cool enough on low it'll be way quiet.

I have two GL60's (2'x2'x5'3") for drying and I pull from both tents with a 'Y' and push through the Can 9000 with a TD-125. I plan on replacing it soon with a 4"x12" phresh, as the Can no longer seems to catch all the smell (and neither does my Can 33 - but the Phresh 10"x24" is still kicking butt and half the weight or less).

 

[FreezerBoy]

should i get the TD-100 or TD-100x?

If you think the 100 will work, get the 100x. If you think the 100x will work, get the 125. These simply do NOT suck like a Vortex. Go at least one model up from your needs.

 

[nugghead]

Let's try some math. I calculate your tent to be about 7 cubic feet in size. Fans and filters are rated by cubic feet per minute. The filter you linked (apart from the neg reviews people are giving it on this thread) is a 516 cubic feet per minute filter. A flow rate 516 cfm will turn over the air in your tent (516 / 7) = 73 times per minute, or once per second. So that is way too much airflow. The amount of vacuum produced by a 500 cfm fan would probably collapse your tent.

You want to turn the air over (exchange it fully) in your tent around once every 2-5 minutes. For that, you'd need a fan that blows only 1-3 cfm. Unfortunately a tiny fan like that won't pull air through an odor filter and won't overcome duct resistance. I feel like a fan and filter both rated for 50-85 cubic feet per minute would be about right. Mind your filter isn't totally mismatched to your fan; a too strong fan will destroy your filter long before its time, a too weak fan won't effectively pull or push through the filter.

Fans that are speed controlled down are generally quieter than their rating but a proper speed controller costs a bit of money too. I went with way more fan than I needed for my 228 cu ft indoor but I am kind of glad I did; throttled down to 50% this vortex fan simply doesn't make any noise.

 

[qupee]

Let's try some math.

You want to turn the air over (exchange it fully) in your tent around once every 2-5 minutes. For that, you'd need a fan that blows only 1-3 cfm.

Ya, but it doesn't really work like that. Aiming for a full exchange every 2 minutes is absolute bare minimum in my opinion - and that would be with well cooled lights. 2 exchanges per minute is a more realistic target.

You're leaning way too far to the low end. I mean, do you really think 1-3 cfm would be enough air exchange, lol.

By that math I could ventilate a 10x10 room with a 120 cfm.

I feel like a fan and filter both rated for 50-85 cubic feet per minute would be about right

Which is right about where a TD-100x will fall when hooked up, which should be about perfect. And that's a heck of a lot more than one full exchange every 2 to 5 minutes, but that's what's needed.

 

[nugghead]

qupee, this fella's tent is really small. It is possible to overdo it with ventilation; you don't want the plants dealing with tornado-force winds; dries 'em out. Ventilation systems move CO2 in and O2 out; create air movement, which plants need a little bit of; cool hot lights; and suppress odors when used with filters; so we should probably be clear about what all we're trying to accomplish with the fan.

At low fan volumes and small volumes, turbulence and surface effects come into play and the math quits working right. I just wanted to make sure that the original poster saw how the math is done. As far as "cooling the lights," the gentleman has a 150w HPS. That's not going to make a lot of heat. I bet you could get away without active cooling it.

As for your 10x10 room, if you wanted your 120 cfm to turn it over twice a minute, it'd have to have its ceiling 7 inches above the floor. That wouldn't leave much room for veg assuming your pot was 6 inches deep. Regular room has an 8' ceiling; 10x10x8 is 800 cubic feet, so to turn it over twice a minute you'd need to be moving 1600 cfm. If you only wanted to turn it over once every 6-7 minutes, your 120 cfm fan will actually do that.

I like math. Agree the smaller TD-100x fan is probably the way to go if it's not too loud - never heard one. I like a bigger fan throttled down in general. My Vortex 6" is a really beautiful piece of equipment and I'd buy it again without thinking twice. But it moves something like 500 cfm; when it's roaring at full in my 228 cf room over a 600W HPS, the room equilibrates to the temperature of outdoor air within 1 degree, which is overkill to my mind - overworks your charcoal filter.

Lotta ways to skin this cat.

 

[qupee]

I understand you entirely, and didn't mean to imply he'd have to active cool the light. But at 1'4" square and 4' tall, 150w will build up heat, and he'll need more than a paltry 10 cfm for it to work.

I know one can read that a full exchange every 5 min is the acceptable low end of the scale, but in my experience that's just silly and not enough. I guess my point was that any of us who have put together a setup or two would immediately know that a little 4" blowing 100+ cfm would have no chance of properly ventillating a 10x10 room, despite if the math says it can.

Also, many fans don't take throttling down so well. If you set a speed controller too low, the fan may fail to start and overheat, potentially become a fire risk even. I find the S&P's in particular make a worse noise when they are dialed down on a solid-state speed controller. I haven't tried with a variac however.

A TD-100x on its low speed circut should be pretty comparable to a 4 or even 6" centrifugal dialed down to roughly 50% power, if not quieter.

And yes, lots of ways to skin the cat. I currently have 4 flowering tents in 2 adjacent rooms. I've got about 32 different ways to hook up my multitude of fans, filters, and hoods. I've jockeyed equipment around, upsized and downsized, pushed and pulled. I get ya on that believe me.


Lastly, if you reference the specs on the TD fans (posted above) you'll see the TD-100x on low speed will move 48-77 cfm at pressures from 0.25" to 0.125". I didn't find a cfm vs. SP chart for the phresh filters, but going by others it's probably safe to assume he'd be in that range.

 

[dankhoe417]

Simple fan. Suncourt 6 inch inline. 250cfm. $29.00 at Home Depot for your size tent.

 

[qupee]

Simple fan. Suncourt 6 inch inline. 250cfm. $29.00 at Home Depot for your size tent.

If you're talking about one of these types:

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc...splay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053


That would be a solid negative ghostrider.

 

[dankhoe417]

Nevermind. Didn't catch the sheer volume of tents.

 

[FreezerBoy]

If you're talking about one of these types:

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc...splay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053


That would be a solid negative ghostrider.

These are called "booster" fans because they provide a boost to your real fan. Without a real fan doing 90% of the work, boosters are useless. It may be in a tube, it may appear to be "inline" but, it's still an axial which, under pressure, moves less air than any other type of fan.