NorCal Growers Union?

[Bluenote]

I broached this subject in another thread , a gentleman spoke up in interest and there seems to be some interest both among those not on the 'net and folks on the 'net.

I would like to hear opinions on whether a NorCal or indeed statewide growers Union is a viable idea or not.

If we were to move forward we need to poke *every* hole possible in this idea prior to bringing it to fruition , if we get our ducks in a row early it will mitigate problems down the road.

Pros? Cons?

 

[Mia]

I kind of think it's a good idea but as with any bureaucracy there would probably end up being some kind of bullshit politicking. But maybe not. I don't know.
We all obviously have a common interest. Whether we can all get along with each othe eris another deal......
That being said I'm interested in the idea. Kind of been out of the loop for awhile.

 

[maxmurder]

humboldt growers association

http://www.humboldtgrowers.org/

there's also a new one called emerald growers association but i don't know if they have a site yet. not unions but similar idea?

 

[Skip]

Yes, these seem to be popping up on a county by county basis, since in many cases, it's the county that is attempting to pass new restrictive laws on growing. Maybe once enough of these groups have been established, each group can send a member or two to meet with reps from the other groups to coordinate legal strategies on a statewide basis.

Of course with the Fed crackdown in CA, it doesn't seem like it's going to make a big difference...

 

[Grass Lands]

are we talking medical, recreational or both?

 

[Hemphrey Bogart]

Hey Bluenote,

I agreed with your post in the other thread. Maybe it'd be good to outline what we want to accomplish first and maybe go from there?

Legalization for medical AND recreational is probably the #1 issue. Aside from that I would guess patient advocacy would be #2. It'd be nice to get away from the large dispensary model and have smaller, more direct grower-to-patient services.

Got any more? I'm just batting ideas around and came up with the obvious ones. I still have to check out that HGA website to see what they're doing, but I'm sure there's some things we could do that are similar.

HB.

 

[SeaMaiden]

I broached this subject in another thread , a gentleman spoke up in interest and there seems to be some interest both among those not on the 'net and folks on the 'net.

I would like to hear opinions on whether a NorCal or indeed statewide growers Union is a viable idea or not.

If we were to move forward we need to poke *every* hole possible in this idea prior to bringing it to fruition , if we get our ducks in a row early it will mitigate problems down the road.

Pros? Cons?

I'm currently on the fence about something like this, and I have a few reasons for it. First, it seems that growers are a fractious bunch, unexpected, but it's true--we cannot seem to agree on a single thing to save our lives at times. Another issue is the aforementioned bureaucracy, but that's a necessary accoutrement to forming any kind of an organized body. The most salient issue to me at this time has to do with the current political climate, I am uncertain as to how an organized body of growers might be viewed and accepted by the general voting public, as opposed to another organized body of patients.

The general public seems to take issue with the concept of recreational cannabis consumption, and that's where I see one of the biggest rubs for an organized body of growers in terms of political pull.

However, I am of the firm opinion that organization, including a growers group as one form, is absolutely necessary. I feel that if we don't regulate ourselves, others will do the regulating for us, and we really need to change the general public's perception of non-medical cannabis users.

 

[rives]

Nice idea, but I think that it would be akin to herding cats. I think that most of the long-term growers (not the people who have been forced into it by our wonderful economy), are by nature a solitary, distrustful bunch who got into growing because they didn't fit well in conventional areas of employment.

 

[Skip]

This "new" model I'm seeing whereby a patient lines up a grower to provide their needs, might seem like a good idea in theory, but in practice, it's little different from buying from a street dealer. You'll get a better price, perhaps, but YOU'RE STUCK with whatever the grower ends up with. And you'll have little to no choice in the matter.

Whereas with the dispensary model, you were able to choose from dozens of strains, from many growers and get recommendations from the staff to meet your medical needs.

So I don't buy this new model, although it can work for many. Esp. if there is more than one grower involved and more of a choice.

Imagine a patient taking cannabis for the first time. They line up a grower who maybe grows a couple of strains, but might not know what is best for the patient, or might not use the best methods to grow, and the patient doesn't know any better and may end up with inferior, ineffective medication or even something that does more harm than good.

Is this the best we can offer our patients?

 

[Bluenote]

It's gratifying to see the reponse , thanks folks. And everyone has brought up very good points......

Purpose I would personally see as multi-fold , political activism as regards legalisation , intervention and negotiation within the framework of the current dispensary/sales situation so as to develop a *safe* and fair sale system , and as Skip so succintly pointed out , patient advocacy...........he hit that point much better than I could have and very neatly accented the large economy size holes in the " new' system.

And if the smaller groups that are developing can be networked together we'll have the rise of a " grass roots" (heheh) activist group.

Appearances , we need to diffuse the media/govt portrayal of growers , they want to exploit the images of " granny afraid of the grow house" , we respond with " granny who grows and is a retired librarian."...........

And undoubtedly it'll be like a herd of cats , we keep that crap behind closed doors and to ourselves and to the opponents we present a pride of Lions.

Y'all want this legal? Best look at the way the pendulum is swinging 'cause the Juggernaut is bearing down and the time is NOW.

And if not NOW.....then WHEN?

 

[Bluenote]

Hey Bluenote,

I agreed with your post in the other thread. Maybe it'd be good to outline what we want to accomplish first and maybe go from there?

Legalization for medical AND recreational is probably the #1 issue. Aside from that I would guess patient advocacy would be #2. It'd be nice to get away from the large dispensary model and have smaller, more direct grower-to-patient services.

Got any more? I'm just batting ideas around and came up with the obvious ones. I still have to check out that HGA website to see what they're doing, but I'm sure there's some things we could do that are similar.

HB.

Those two are primary , along with some sort of market stabilisation that would benefit both end consumer and grower and shortcut some of the crap currently going on with the dispensary model.

And development of a Growers Code of Ethics...........if we want to be taken *seriously* as a business then we need to BE serious about it.

For developmental models we look to how the Wheat/Rice/Soybean etc Growers co-Ops work , give a decent template to start from.

 

[SeaMaiden]

Bluenote, a code of ethics is KEY, in my opinion! Like I said, if we don't regulate (read: police) ourselves, someone else is going to do it for us. So, do we put on our big boy/girl panties and get it done, or do we just let it happen to us? I'm of a mind to take the bull by the horns, I'd rather grapple with the problem directly.

Nice idea, but I think that it would be akin to herding cats. I think that most of the long-term growers (not the people who have been forced into it by our wonderful economy), are by nature a solitary, distrustful bunch who got into growing because they didn't fit well in conventional areas of employment.

You herd cats just like pigs--with a cane. Seriously, it works. (I used to raise and show pigs for 4H.)

Perhaps that's why I'm stepping into the fray.

Bluenote, have you perused ASA's advocate's 'course'? The most difficult part of their set of workbooks is the strategizing section. However, I must agree with their assessment, if there is a specific goal or set of goals in mind, then strategies must be examined and adopted.

 

[Bluenote]

Bluenote, a code of ethics is KEY, in my opinion! Like I said, if we don't regulate (read: police) ourselves, someone else is going to do it for us. So, do we put on our big boy/girl panties and get it done, or do we just let it happen to us? I'm of a mind to take the bull by the horns, I'd rather grapple with the problem directly.


You herd cats just like pigs--with a cane. Seriously, it works. (I used to raise and show pigs for 4H.)

Perhaps that's why I'm stepping into the fray.

Bluenote, have you perused ASA's advocate's 'course'? The most difficult part of their set of workbooks is the strategizing section. However, I must agree with their assessment, if there is a specific goal or set of goals in mind, then strategies must be examined and adopted.

Thank You!!! And the above is exactly why I started this thread , the whole concept may never get beyond the discussion stage , it's up to us *collectively* but we have to start somewhere and getting this stuff hashed out ( yeah yeah y'all are sick of the puns by now ...ok ) and our ducks in row prior to really going public and doing something like dropping and ad into West Coast Leaf or something is likely to be the best course of action.

And we're going to need effective spokespeople , and I t'ain't *it* , I have a habit of saying what's on my mind , and at times not in the most diplomatic manner , unfortunately for me.

So we're going to need an effective spokesperson , articulate well spoken well read women are often the most effective.

(HINT)^^^^

We'll need a legal analyst of some sort. Will need to look into 501c3 status etc.etc.

And while I'm at this , *obviously* as people make contact with each other there will be a good deal of genetics trading and the like , sorry folks but we need to keep this behind closed doors at this time , we're going to be treading a fine line with the market negotiation/stabilisation and patient advocacy factors as it is...............this IS still activism folks and *all* who become involved should exercise caution and remember how things such as RICO have been misused in the past.

Need the numbers , ultimately at the ballot box , get it to go viral and bring the people to the ballot box and it'll go legal in Calif , that has it's own can of worms yes , still the power lies in shaking folks out of their apathy and getting them to the voting booth.

 

[SeaMaiden]

Ahh... the old NPO status, on a federal level, eh? I'm familiar with the 501(c)3 filing, and I'm not sure how well it would work for a growers union with the current state of cannabis federally.

If NPO filing is what's desired, then careful consideration must be given as to what could occur under the auspices of this union.

For those unacquainted, 501(c)3 filing status is a tax filing where an organization declares themselves officially as a non-profit organization (NPO). This allows anyone donating funds or other items of value to the organization (computers, desks, office equipment, vehicles, cash) to be taken as a tax deduction on your federal filing.

More caveats abound with this status, for instance, 501(c)3 organization may endorse a candidate, and I believe there may be restrictions on endorsement of legislation.

And, if patient advocacy will fall under the auspices of this organization, that further muddies the NPO waters, because federally we are all still forbidden to handle, cultivate or distribute the product in any way, shape, form or manner.

As for my abilities to articulate myself, it's one thing to read me, it's another to listen to me. Long and short of it is this--I come off as a very confrontational person, apparently. I don't know how or why or what it is about my manner, but that is the flavor many people are left with, according to my husband and some other friends of mine. So, I'm not sure that a good spokesperson would be someone who essentially pisses people off from the first utterances.


Legal advice would be wonderful, but it comes at a cost, so I've purchased for myself Robert's Rules of Order, and will be purchasing a Black's Law Dictionary when I can as well. Even though the laws of the land are supposed to be written so any person may understand them, and that's been a standard since, what... the Magna Carta? we still have great difficulty with legal language.

 

[bad gas]

Farmers have CO-OPs.

Is it possible portions of this concept might be applicable to our needs?

stay safe. bg

 

[Bluenote]

Farmers have CO-OPs.

Is it possible portions of this concept might be applicable to our needs?

stay safe. bg

That's one of the models , any input you might have is welcome , the SeaMaiden has already pointed out a couple of the potential drawbacks as regards non-profit 501-c3 status.

As I stated , I personally feel that it would behoove us to blow any holes in all this here and fix them , that way it can't be used against us down the road.

A farmers stype co-op might mean bargaining power with dispensaries/consortiums when this all goes legal and some measure of security in purchase for the purchaser if it's grown to a strict code of growers ethics according to the co-op.

 

[Mtn. Nectar]

gotta' find something within the Constitution that will allow the movement to gain acceptance.....


ganj on.......

 

[Al Botross]

Why couldn't the ORG start more organically instead of a corporate model.

Just a group of principled growers that organize to create a standard for Norcal medicinal growers, Educate medical users (just like the Organic Veg Groups did), Educate dispensary buyers and future growers to the Org's principals and standards.

Start by having monthly virtual meeting (IE GOTO meeting)and let it evolve naturally. A good model would be SLUG group - SF Linux Users group.


Maybe start by defining governing principles and standards that the org could collectively agree to operate under. Try it's very hardest to keep money out of the discussion for as long as possible. Function more organically and for the love of the hobby/profession.

 

[Mtn. Nectar]

cause in the end the FEDS still sit atop the totem pole.....................until their 100% acceptance.. consider it a game..............ya wanna play ya may pay in many a way..............


ganj on...............

 

[Yes4Prop215]

one thing that concerns me is look at most agricultural industries in california right now....they all hire (and rightly have too, to keep prices down) illegal immigrant mexican labor...

we can start a union and all if this goes legal...but whats to stop the big producers of just hiring migrants to trim and process everything..

i cant sit here and soundall self righteous because in our vineyard the cheap labor of migrants saved our asses...if we didnt have them to pay 8 bucks an hour we would go broke because the margins are just that slim..

once weed prices crash same thing will happen...

the only real talent are the people with the knowledge and genetic holdings that could start their own grows, but lets face it we are a dime a dozen in california...and when you look at colorado, most mega warehouses would hire smart talent for a year or two to set everything up, then dump them to the curb and hire cheap labor to keep things running...