No germination, no hope?

[GoneGrowing]

Hey guys.

I'm about to start a new grow and have gotten me some Jack Flash beans from Sensi Seeds, so almost 48 hours ago I threw the 10 seeds in between some papertowel soaked in filtered water and into a plastic container. At first I had them a bit on my laptops power adapter but decided that maybe that was too hot and threw them in my cabinet where its about 75 F, but nothing is happening really, only one seed seem to have cracked, but it still shows no taproot. So my question is, should I do something different to get them to germ? would it be a completely stupid idea to just throw them into some soil now and see what happens the next couple of days?

I was really looking forward to these Jack Flash, but if I can't even get my seeds germed then there isnt much hope I guess. I have germed succesfully with the papertowel method before, but guess these seeds didn't wanna climb out of their shell as much.

Anybody got any good ideas on how I can save the seeds and get them popping or are they lost?

 

[whatsthatsmell]

Seeds can take up to 2 weeks to have a tap root show, be patient and let them do their thing. Make sure they are in a dark place that is warm.

 

[GoneGrowing]

hey, yeah I know it can take a while, but the previous attempts I have done using this method has usually made the seeds crack within 24-48 hours, even on my own badly stored 5-6 years old bagseed cross seeds.
Thats why I'm a bit worried that nothing really is happening and if I might be having the seeds in too wet an environment wont they be damaged and lost?

I know I'm a bit overreacting, have just read plenty of peeps experiencing germ problems with expensive seeds that just wouldn't pop

 

[whatsthatsmell]

Yeah, i had that problem this year, got 20 seeds, and out of that only 2 of what i ordered pop'd and the free bag of 10 had 6 pop. Out fo the 2 that i ordered they turned out to be male, so they got chopped after crossing, and out of the 6 that pop'd only 3 were female. Since i have been making my own seeds, my germination ratio has gone up, ALOT. Seems like the greenhouses are having issues with thier seeds.

 

[b8man]

I just had a seed pop up about 4 weeks after putting it in soil. Just make sure that you don't keep them on the paper towel for more than 3 days, then put them in some soil. Otherwise I find they rot really quickly.

 

[GoneGrowing]

Hey whatsthatsmell, thats the bad germ rates I fear, ul for you that you had so few that popped and that they turned out to be male, but the freebies were better, you definitely have a point that some of the greenhouses doesn't deliver the most fresh seeds, especially when you had paid a relatively high price for your seeds this is a sad thing. But it's not the case for all greenhouses, but feared this from Sensi Seeds. Good to hear your germ rates are better when you're handling the breeding

Hey b8man, that was really long time for a seed to pop in soil, 4 weeks, wow, when I have had seeds put in soil that didn't pop after about a week mostly they seem to have gotten to wet and rot in the soil, guess its a fine balance of how moist ones soil is. But you say no more than 3 days in the papertowels, ok then I'll go by that and get them into soil even though nothing has cracked, I guess, still hoping though!

 

[whatsthatsmell]

I am sure its not all greenhouses that have the poor germ rate, but instead of forking out the cash for seeds that may not germ at all, i would rather use it for something else. When you get at least one or two males, its pretty easy to just keep that gene line running, especially if you can get the male to flower, getting the male to root while in flower is actually pretty easy and there is little stress on the plant. Besides if there is a problem with it, who cares, its a male, not like you can do anything but breed it anyways. I have gotten some INSANE strains from the crosses that i have dont, an example would be Skunk x Caramella, Sour Bubble x Caramella, Speed Queen x Skunk, Speed Queen x Caramella, a couple sativa's x caramella, Durbon x Caramella, Durbon x Skunk, Durbon x Speed Queen, Durbon x Sour Bubble, the crosses go on and on. Just a matter now of locking down the genetics of each of those lines and then not having to worry about getting seeds ever again.

Patience is really the key to pop'n seeds, and just letting them do their thing, we want one thing, but mother nature says another, play by her rules and you will be rewarded...

 

[PeavillePride]

Sorry to hear Bro.But Sensi has the worst germ rates of anywhere.And with them being so big on :"helping" the ill you think they would do or want to do better quality control.They leave the old beans,no matter how old,to sell.And after years n years if they dont sell,they dont send new ones til the old non germing ones are gone.When you get a fresh batch,they have no problem germing,but Sensi doesnt care about there costumers,which is evident in the E-Mails between us.They said tough luck on the 48 master Kush beans that none made it,when the old ones are gone,they will send new ones,but they dont make good no matter what.. No more Sensi for me,i already have my Black Domina Mom,so im good.

 

[GoneGrowing]

Hey whatsthatsmell, well thats a whole lot of crosses you've gotten yourself, bet there some gems among them proves your point, yes you can relatively easily keep the genetics by using your males to breed with. But I haven't really got enough space to have a separate room for males and I want my 400 w cab to be running some sweet ladies, but if I get sprouts and they turn out to be males, then I'll try to keep em long enough to collect some pollen, but my main priority right now isn't getting males to breed with, my main priority is to try out some strains, get some female clones from them and then later on experience with breeding using those clones probably, but gotta use my cab for the ladies for now.

But it looks as 6 out of my 10 beans have cracked, 2 have been open for a while I guess, but the taproot seeems to be getting nowhere, not not getting out of the shell at all really, could this be because its too hot? too cold, too humid?

is it possible that I had it to hot for them to germ properly to begin with, and this has caused them to crack but at the same time die, remember reading someone mentioning this, that its possible they crack and suffer from a too humid environment in the plastic container and they wither from there on?

 

[GoneGrowing]

Hey PeavillePride!

Yeah it seems that Sensi isn't the best at delivering viable seeds, last grow I had some Mandala White Satin and Hashberry, and they were some robust seeds, they popped in the papertowel and shot tap roots within 24 hours with a germ rate of 9/10. These Sensi Seeds, can't compare to that in any way, I might not be the best at germinating, but one should be able to germ seeds at this prize without the biggest hazzle. Sounds like you've had your fair share of trouble with corresponding with Sensi, 48 master kush who didn't pop, thats just too much, nobody can avoid being succesfull at germinating a few from that many beans, so if they can't admit to you that their beans are off when you had a germ rate as low as 0%, then Sensi got a serious problem.

Good thing you've got yourself a keeper in the Black Domina, she's a knockout? Black Domina is definitely a strain on my "have to grow sometime"-list, but might never if I don't get more succes with these beans.

So I hope that there's still a chance I can get a couple of sprouts, cause there's probably no hope in thinking Sensi will compensate in any way.

 

[GoneGrowing]

Well to update this, I wasn't sure whether or not it was beneficiary to let the seeds stay in the plastic container between moist papertowels so decided to put them in some soil, I figured that couldn't hurt them.

I put all 10 seeds in the soil, 6 of the seeds had cracked open, but even though they had been open they didn't show any sign of the taproot going anywhere, the last 4 seeds I helped to crack open, seem to succesfully have cracked them without doing any damage to them. But the seeds generally don't seem to show much effort, but we'll see if it's just me overreacting, I'll report back if get some potential kickass herb growing despite the Jack Flashs lack of enthusiasm.

 

[redheadedbitch]

sorry to hear about your troubles GG but don't throw those babies away yet. i may not have been growing long but i have had exellent germ rates. i always put them directly in soil about 1-1 1/2 inches down and give em about 3-5tbs of water 8oz cups and i put them directly under my veg light to keep em warm, seedlings have to be warm. i add about 3tbs a day of water cuz the soil dries out fairly quickly( i use alot of perlite 40%) how much water/ what kind of medium are u using that your seeds get to wet and mold over. give those seeds time, its been a week since i started my new batch all GHS trainwreck and Rez DSD popped up days ago but im still waiting for my jhxwr and c99. i dug into the soil yesterday and found that they had cracked and were showing the start of a taproot. they should be up on day 8 or day 9. also, like everyone was saying, some greenhouses have piss poor germ rates, but i know you can't go wrong with Mandala or Rez. 15/15 for mandala and 10/10 for Rez. good luck bro, i hope those babies work out for ya peaceout~red

 

[GoneGrowing]

Hey redheadedbitch!

Nothing is being thrown away yet, all 10 of the Jack Flash have been thrown into soil, so nothing is yet totally lost, we'll just have to wait and see if they like the soil and were just slow starters, still hoping, but I really suspect that I won't see any sprouts, oh well. Sounds like you have had succes popping them directly into the soil, but you also mention Mandala and Rez as breeders and yes those breeders seem to have some nice viable seeds, I grew mandalas hashberry and white satin last grow, they were for sure some viable seeds, which is also what has been reported of several growing Mandala or Reservoir.

But i don't believe that my method of germing is bad in anyway, everybody has their preferred method of germinating, Mandala advices that their beans are put directly in the soil because they claim that their beans are fresh enough to pop easily in the soil and that others way of germinating should only be needed if the seeds are less viable or old... Sensi reccomends using the papertowel method, and I germinated this way as its a good way to check the viability of ones seeds and to maybe help those beans which have a hard time getting out of their shell.

So yes if your starting point is good viable looking seeds theres nothing wrong with popping them directly in the soil, but my Jack Flash didn't look all that viable. I can't give you any numbers of how much soil or water I use to begin with, I use some low in nutrients airy soil and water this with ph-regulated water half RO/half tap, with an EC of about 0.5 and PH of 6.5, I let the plastic cups with the soil drain and put in the seeds to a depth of about 5mm(0.2 inches). Wrap some plastic film on top and place the cups not too far from my fluoro. Well that's basically what's going down now, nothing new to report from the beans in their pots, but I'll let you know if they escape the soil to make me a very very happy grower.

 

[MynameStitch]

If there is not enough moisture the plants even though they popped open, they still have to have moist area, if they dry out and get moist and keep doing that they will turn brown and die. They have to be kept moist. Are you using RO water?

 

[GoneGrowing]

Hey MynameStitch, good to see you again, thanks alot for all your help in my last grow

Yeah I know they should be kept moist especially when they crack open I presume, haven't had problems germinating like this before, but yes because of my problems with too high EC on tap I used RO water to wet the papertowels, first later I thought that maybe I shouldn't have? But anyway, they have been in soil that has been watered with half tap and half RO with an EC of 0.5, that should be fine right?

I germinated some other supposedly bubblegum seeds I had, put 3 in, mostly to see if they didn't germ to see if I was geting it too moist or too little moist between the papertowels, but after not much more than 24 hours they have all 3 cracked and shown taproot. So as a comparison they popped alot faster and actually starting growing a taproot fast, so that should have been possible for the Jack Flash too I guess if they were viable enough, not nescessarily that fast, but they should be starting to grow a taproot. But for those 3 I think I also used a mix of tap and RO water to soak the towels, can this make a significant difference?

Anyway as earlier written I threw them in the soil, figuring that will only do them good. They're in plastic cups with plastic film over them and the temp where they are is about 76 F, so if the soil is properly moist that should be an ok environment from them to pop, hoping some day they will pop!

 

[redheadedbitch]

sorry gonegrowing if i offended u or something. My bad man. it just sounded like you were thinking about chucking em and at that thought my heart skipped a beat.

 

[GoneGrowing]

Hey redheadedbitch, you haven't offended me in any way, if you thought I was just gonna throw them in the garbage then you should have offended me

naah, lets see what happens after they have been in the pots for a while, nothing showing yet.

 

[GoneGrowing]

Hey, as I'm obviously not the best at waiting for my jack flash seeds to grow into something I inspected the plastic cups to add a tad of water to ensure proper moist in the pots and to check in to seeds that had been put into soil 2 days ago.Inspected 3 of the seeds, there seems to have happened nothing, the seeds still seem fresh and has opened showing a bit of taproot, but the taproot still ain't growing.

I tweezed one of the shells to see a bit more, it seems a bit as the taproot is a bit stuck to the one side of the seeds shell but the point is, theres still some sort of taproot, so is my best option to just let'em be in the soil or could I be succesfull in trying to put some of the seeds in the papertowels again?

I don't know if the seeds somehow cracked open and died, seems like it doesn't it? But the ones that I helped cracking myself and then put in the soil(4 seeds) didn't seem to differ from the others, they too have small visible taproots which seems to indicate that the other seeds which cracked automatically didn't in anyway suffer from being between the papertowels, but that they're just slow starters, that might never start, lol But anyway, I would just really like to get one survivor, so I'm willing to experiment a bit.

 

[MynameStitch]

I never use paper towels to germ seeds, I have seen some brands carry some bad stuff in there dyes they use and have seen seeds not grow after popping open. I would avoid using that brand if you are having problems with seeds germinating.

I always take a paper towel wet it down real good in hot water and squeeze any excess out of it and do it again an hour later and finally use it for seeds.I would always use tap water to soak seeds, you want the plant to absorb as many micros as possible, I would never use RO water to soak seeds ime.
Did the seeds you put into the soil have a tap root at all?

 

[GoneGrowing]

Hey MynameStitch

Yeah ok, maybe I should use something else than the brand of papertowels to germinate, but same paper didn't seem to have inflicted other seeds I have germinated.
Your way of wetting is nice described as to how wet it should be, sounds like a good measure of how moist the papertowels should be. The seeds I put in the soil had cracked and some showed the white taproot coming out of the shell, but nothing more than just visible, it there was a visible taproot it had only grown a tiny little out of the shell.

But you say you'd never use RO to germinate instead you'd use tap water, hmm maybe I shouldn't, I have just read several people saying the use filtered water, but what you say about the water missing micronutrients was also what I started thinking and what got me to get them in the soil instead of the papertowels. But could I maybe try to get some out of the soil and try getting them in between some papertowels soaked in tapwater? I think I might try that. Maybe I shouldn't have used RO water and that might be the issue, but still the seeds didn't look very viable to begin with.