????Natural Feminization process????

[Guest]

Ok this is whats up i went on to one off my spots today and i find a dried up mj tree is about 3feet tall with one 13in dried up bud on the end.

i havent grown on this spot from the last season. this means that this plant was seed that germ from one of the delat trees i had growing there last year. but most importantly the plant grew from seed right to finish with out any help from man and still gave a good yeild.

Delat's a top strain to have.

The thing is it has in seed, but only a few, there were 13 seed pods but only 9 seed this means that the tree must of self polinate late in flower in fact all most at the end of the trees life.

So i am reasoning that the seed must be all female be cause both parents of the seed are female.

But both the parents are allso herims, but thats very late in flowering, in fact i belive that all mj plants will hirme if left unpollinated for a long time.

So these seed should be all women?????? and safe to plant??????

Will some one with experince tell me if i am correct in my thinking??

 

[zamalito]

Yeah man I think they'll probably be fine. It was probably a lot of stress.

 

[DocLeaf]

Hi bajanbud

In my experience female plants that "self-set" seed produce 99% female plants with a tendency for hermaphrodificy in lineage. Since a 'male part' fertilized the otherwise female plant, male-parts will show-up in the next line (something to do with XX chromosomes).

Self-set plants are, for this reason, prone to herms as a result of stress relating to photoperiod, heat and feed cycles.

hope this helps
peace dL

 

[zamalito]

I'm jealous over the dalat. So many guys have it but I've never been lucky enough. Wish I was around on og when that stuff was going around.

 

[Guest]

I think delat was a MarkSurfs strain, like Romp19, and RompStar

 

[Closet Funk]

Try them out some time. I'm sure they will be female or mostly female.

 

[Delta9-THC]

interested to hear about this ... I had a plant self pollinate but threw it away as this was before I knew about 99.9% feminization

Peace

 

[DocLeaf]

we've out-grown JackHerer self-sets b4 now. The results are still worth smoking,,, seeded with less THC than the original seed/clone,,, but still OK to sow. pon ya learn ya grow. dL

 

[muddy waters]

i think with the dalat you're dealing with a relatively monoecious variety, at least from what i've read about most landrace sativas. never-the-less this here is interesting to consider:

Photoperiodic control makes it possible to synchronize the flowering dates of male and female plants, thus making possible their cross-breeding. Most importantly, photoperiodic control enables breeders to stimulate the production of male flowers on female plants. Self-pollination can be accomplished only by means of such flowers. Male flowers on female hemp do not contain the Y (male) chromosome; they produce only female pollen. When this is used to fertilize female flowers on female plants, they will produce purely female seeds. The pollen from male flowers is of two kinds, and usually produces a ratio of males 1:1 females. A few viable seeds can be obtained from female flowers produced on male plants and self-pollinated, but such seeds are only weakly fertile and produce mostly female plants.

The following procedure will produce seeds which will grow 100% female hemp:

Cultivate two separate groups of female plants indoors. The plants should receive at least 50 watts of light per square foot of growing area. One group must not receive more than 7 hours of light daily. This will induce male flowers to manifest on the female plants. The second group of females must receive about 16 hours of light daily to ensure that no male flowers develop on them. The long photoperiod also inhibits the development of flowers so much that the short-day plants will mature 2 or 3 weeks before the long-day group. Therefore, begin cultivating the long-day females at least 2 weeks before planting the short-day plants.

As the two groups approach maturity, remove any males which may appear. A few weeks before the male hemp begins to flower, the internodes of the stem begin to elongate very quickly. The dominant male enzyme andrase produces thin plants with a tuft of leaves at the top. The leaves are smaller than those of the females, and have fewer leaflets (usually 5). Tiny buds sometimes appear in the nodes about 2/3 up the stalk. The future sexual expression of hemp may be determined by examining these premature flowers. If the buds remain erect, the plant is female. If the buds droop, the plant is male.

When clusters of female buds begin to appear on plants in the long-day group, cover each bud with a transparent plastic bag sealed with a rubber band around the stem below the bud cluster, so as to protect the flowers from accidental pollination.

When male buds appear on some of the female plants in the short-day group, cover each bud with a transparent bag sealed with a rubber band around the stem below the bud cluster, so as to protect the female flowers from accidental pollination.

When male buds appear on some of the females in the short-day group, carefully cut off every male bud and store them in a glass jar. Any new male buds which appear also must be pruned. Within a few days the anthers of the clipped buds will open and release pollen. Collect this pollen and apply it with a thin brush to the stigmas of the bagged flowers in the long-day group. Because this pollen contains only female chromosomes, the fertilized female flowers on the long-day female group will develop seeds which will produce only female plants.(63-66)

http://www.rexresearch.com/hhusb/hh4bot.htm#HH48

 

[muddy waters]

this, i believe, is what is known as 'selfing'

 

[Guest]

Try them out some time. I'm sure they will be female or mostly female.

Closet Funk whats up my man.

i all ready got the seed germ all nine of them.

I thinking that i should get all female plants that go hermi late into flowering.

When the buds are starting to dry off, and i am going to pick way before that, so i should be ok.

i am going to leave a next plant out there as an experiment to see if she "selfs" allso.

 

[zamalito]

One thing I never understood is the x, y chromosome thing with cannabis. Ok so if under one grower 10 seeds will make 5 male and 5 female and if another grower had the exact same 10 seeds gets 7 female and 3 male doesn't this mean the chromosome thing is somewhat meaningless in regards to cannabis? Because this would mean there could be an occasional occurance of yy males (typical male is xy female is xx) that when used as a pollen donor on any female could only produce male offspring. I've never seen or heard of anyone producing a large batch of seeds that inadvertently came out all male. My guess is that only xx that can change sex in differing environments. I have made seeds with a single pollen donor that came out 75-80% female so this could be the case. So xx plants can be female, female dominant intersexed, male dominant intersexed, and male in their expression. How does fertility and sterility in the flowers both male and female fit in with this?

 

[Guest]

Hi folks,
I am confused with all the xx yy chromosomes talk. I got some freebies from BOG, the skunk 1 x durban. I was 9 for 10 on the germ. but i was 100% male...is this what you are talking about with the yy?

Striving for knowledge,
Seed

 

[KingRalph]

those are NOT good s1 or feminized seeds, because when a plant pollinates itself, all seeds will be herms. and i would hate to grow somethin that takes as long as the dalat an have it all go to shit causa herms!

feminization or s1 comes from taking either stress or chemical induced pollen from a female and pollinating another straight female. you can make s1 by doing that to a clone of the plant and pollinating the same mother plant with that induced clone pollen. these are the only ways you can get mostly herm-free feminized seeds. there are little tricks and tips along the way there that will help in making better feminized seed n stronger non-herm ratio, but that's for another time...

basically just remember, when a plant pollinates ITSELF, the seed is WORTHLESS. perhaps if grown out 100, 1 might be a semi-strong female that won't herm at the slightest bit of stress... my advice would be to stress them near the beginning of flower to bring out the herms and then kill them leaving you some more resilient female types that hopefully won't herm, at least till much later on... shame it would waste all those weeks of dalat growin ahhhh what i would do for viet genes... well good luck, an peace n green thumbs as always.

 

[zamalito]

I would think growing from germination to death without any human asistance would be quite a bit of stress wouldn't it? Also in some of the older experiments they found plants put out earlier in the season are much more likely to become intersexed. This is because of hormones stored in old growth along with cultivating at a latitude and light cycle with a much larger variance than it is acclimated to. So when the plant is put out and the nights are long it comes close to flowering but then the days get shorter then longer again. I would think since the plant grew from a seed put out the year before last would've started very early in the season making this the likely cause of pollen production. I guess the bottom line is noone knows if it would've produced pollen if it wasn't stressed. So noone can tell you if its ok to grow. It might be fine it might not. I was under the impression that the dalat typically didn't produce pollen unless heavily stressed or grown inside. I've never grown it though.

 

[zamalito]

I always though the reason they pollinated a different clone from the same mother isn't because it always produces bad seeds but because of both the mutagenic affects of giberellic acid and the fact that actually growing the seed on a chemical exposed female would make chemical exposed seed. I think that producing pollen merely through stress it wouldn't matter if the pollen went on the same plant that produced the pollen or a cutting from the same mother. I don't see how this would be different.

 

[KingRalph]

by outsourcing the pollen from the female pollen donor to a straight female, you are ensuring the seedbearing female is herm-free resulting in feminized seeds of all female chromosomes, but recessive herm trait... if a herm pollinates itself then you have herm trait everywhere and herm herm herm.

dalat being an old landrace sativa has a recessive herm trait already, and that is how that seed was made and fell to the ground, and sprouted and grew and hermed like its parent, and so the seeds will be 99% herm at this point, NOT 99% female. comprende?

 

[zamalito]

Ok I thought you were saying that it would be ok if he pollinated a cutting from the same plant with the pollen. At the same time I've seen guys get proven cuts from f1 c99 seeds to reverse and I couldn't inagine that happening even intentionally. I'd grown the same cutting for 90% of my harvest for 4 years and didn't see one anther. he had to have fucked things up royally. So alot plants will produce pollen its just a matter of how much stress. Also by that logic shouldn't chemdog and sour diesel or whatever all be intersexed? At least I think. I don't think I've ever grown any seeds that self set I can't remember.

 

[Guest]

I like this type of thinking, you raised some good points here. Got me thinking...

One thing I never understood is the x, y chromosome thing with cannabis. Ok so if under one grower 10 seeds will make 5 male and 5 female and if another grower had the exact same 10 seeds gets 7 female and 3 male doesn't this mean the chromosome thing is somewhat meaningless in regards to cannabis??

Because this would mean there could be an occasional occurance of yy males (typical male is xy female is xx) that when used as a pollen donor on any female could only produce male offspring.

I've never seen or heard of anyone producing a large batch of seeds that inadvertently came out all male.

My guess is that only xx that can change sex in differing environments. I have made seeds with a single pollen donor that came out 75-80% female so this could be the case.

So xx plants can be female, female dominant intersexed, male dominant intersexed, and male in their expression. How does fertility and sterility in the flowers both male and female fit in with this?

How does fertility and sterility in the flowers both male and female fit in with this??????????

Fllowing this line of thinking would mean that male plants produced from only female chromosome should be xx and sterile

But that is not the case because we all know male plants produced from only female chromosome(xx) give pollin thats produce female only plants.(xx)

If there is in fact an occasional occurance of yy males and this is crossed to a normal xy female then the offspring should be mostly male. Because there still is a x chromosome from the mom.

then the females from this cross should be yx ( is this any different from xy)

makes me wonder Can there be a yy female allso??

If xx plants can be female, female dominant intersexed, male dominant intersexed, and male in their expression. Then yy plants should be the same way too....

we are on to someting here......................any one that can help me understand this please do

 

[zamalito]

Hey Bajan,

In answering your question it's gonna slightly feed into some feminist propaganda and all us guys are gonna have to take a slight blow to our egos

Well, I don't want to even come close to saying I know for sure, but in nature a yy chromosomeal formation is somewhat taboo. If you look at the shape of a Y it is sort of the shape of an incomplete X (missing one leg). In nature its sort of the same way an organism with two y chromosomes has an incomplete genetic set and the embryo dies shortly after forming. I believe all monoecious varieties and possibly some dioecious landrace are consitently xx (male and female)