NAME THAT DEFICENCY ! !

[stussy22]

Grow in: soil
From: clone
Age of plant: 2.5 months
What stage flowering 28 days
Medium: FoxFarm soil
Pot size: 2 Gal.
Have they been transplanted, if so how long ago? 4/20/07 months
Water runoff Ph? 6 PH [IS THIS HIGH] not sure what is or isnt
Nutrients added? Botanicare Liquid Karma, Sweet, Pure Blend Pro, Tiger bloom
Feeding schedule? LK every water, along with sweet. Pure Blend Pro and Tiger bloom every 3 waters.
When were they last fed/watered? Today
How are you determining when to feed/water ? depending on how dry the soil is on top
TDS/EC/PPM? dont mesaure...
Tap/RO/Distilled water? Tap
Ph before and after adding nutrients? 6.6-6.9
Is your Ph equipment properly calibrated? use the liquid color dye test (cheap)
Light intensity/Age of bulb/Wattage? (1) 125w HPS/2nd grow (8 months)
Distance to the canopy? 8"
Temps at canopy? 78day - 64night
Temps at root zone or reservoir? not measured
Day/Night temps (Min.-Max.)? 78-64
Current air flow (CFM)? 450 cfm on variable speed control
Is there air blowing directly onto plant? from under the box, holes on bottom pulling air up across plants.
Using CO2? No
Relative humidity? 45-65
Has plant recently been pruned, clones taken, fimmed or pinched? No
Pests? NONE!


So heres the deal. Tips and edges on the plant are starting to brown some heavier than others. thinking it might be Mn def. not sure need a few other opinons.

heres the pics

plant 1




plant 2




plant 3

 

[Scientist]

it kinda looks like light/heat stress to me. i can't really tell from the pics (no perspective really)

 

[Guest]

thinking it might be Mn def. not sure need a few other opinons.

Theres no shortage of Mn in your feeding program. Would something block it out for some reason?

I don't think it's heat damage by the looks of the tissue damage and considering your temps.

Maybe it's nute burn?

 

[Pimp Aurora]

Looks like a mg def to me personally probably caused by too low a ph level, I'd invest in a proper digital pH meter, those litmus paper ones/ liquid testers are hardly accurate imho, also I think your p, ca and mg may have prossibly been locked out, first thing you should do is sort your pH.

Any chance of a picture of the whole plant?

 

[MTF-Sandman]

How much PBP & TB are you using per gallon when you feed them?
What's the water source & PH before adding anything?

 

[Blackvelvet]

^^ Add more details like mtf sandman is suggesting.

Sweet with every watering is adding magnesium. The pbp and tiger bloom are adding potassium in abundance with little calcium and magnesium. I bet your seeing calcium deficiency....

Tips and edges on the plant are starting to brown

Potassium, calcium, and magnesium all compete against each other. Too much of one will cause a deficiency of another.

Botanicare Sweet
0-0-0
1.065 grams/ml
@10ml/Gal
N 0
P 0
K 0
Mg 42
Ca 0
Fe 1.68
S 56

If your going to boost your magnesium level, I suggest about 30ppm mg. This would be about 1 1/2 teaspoons per gallon sweet. (2 teaspoons per gal gives you 42; see above) To maintain a balance, you should go ahead and add 60 ppm calcium too. This would be about 1/4 teaspoon per gallon powdered gypsum or calcium nitrate per gallon. Brew your own beer/wine stores have easily disolvable gypsum. Calcium chloride sold under names like tomato blossom end rot stopper would also be a suitable ca source. You will need to get the net weight and % calcium in the bottle in order to get a rate. If you get stuck not finding a ca source, drop using the sweet anymore. Then you could add cal mag plus or similar that contains both ca and mg. Adding more calcium and magnesium requires you to watch carefully for potassium deficiency.

 

[gratefuldawg]

If your using RO water, it's probably a Calcium defic. If not, it's really hard to tell, your cal to mag ratio could be all messed up. It's good to start with under 50 ppm with your water, but theres people that dont and have good results. I'd say up the PH to around 6.5, 6 is more hydro. I've had good results with fox farm soil [email protected]. If not using RO, go fill up a couple 5 gallon jugs at a water wheel, and add 5ml calmag to every gallon of water, no sweet either till you get your skills down. Learn from my mistake, sweet threw my ratio all off cause I had a bunch of Mag in my soil all ready. The pureblend has hardly any calcium in it, and that's why most who use it add around 5ml per gallon of cal-mag.

Peece-

 

[stussy22]

ANSWER

ANSWER

Well heres some more pics before I start answering questions.














Scientist: I sure its not from heat from the light my last grow was same temps if not hotter did not have this problem.

Northern Farmer: From Pimp Aurora chart with a pH run off of 6 im lacking in P,Ca and Mg. What are some fairly price accuate pH test inst. that you use or have experance with? Thinking nute burn or nute lock out.

Pimp Aurora: THX for throwing up that chart helped alot. Now the water i water with is from the tap in my kitchen. With my shitty checmical test kit I'm looking at about 6.8 pH. and My run off is about 6.Now with your chart or as a standard you measure your run off pH to use that chart? I'm with you going with the P,Ca and Mg being locked out if my PH is at 6. As far as pH test inst what would you recomend?

SANDMAN: PBP 15 ml/per gallon, TB 1 tps/per gallon, LK 10 ml, sweet 15 ml. The sweet is what i think is killing me on top of the low ph. Hey now when u measure pH is it the run off or the pH or the pH of water added? pretty sure its the run off. Water is from my kitchen faucet, and Ph is ruffly 6.8 going to grab a new electronic test inst what would u recomend? thx again for all the help.

Blackvelvet: PBP is a 1.5-4-5 and TB is a 2-8-4 and yea can't believe i didnt see that abundance of of P. I agree with you with the over kill on the P and the constant feeding of sweet 15ml per gallon is what i was going with, and from Pimp Aurora chart I see what you mean. PPM is new to mean really enjoy math and just learned/found out about ppm (ya im a noob). Now back of the sweet says 10 ml is good for 50 ppm Mg. now with P,Ca and Mg do i want all PPMs ruffly the same? Now on the back of TB says Mg 0.5% how would i determind ppm off that? I think I will drop the sweet and start using calmag. And as it gets closer towards harvest switch out the cal mag and get back with the sweet. Thx for the math lesson.

gratefuldawg: Ya i think i made the same mistake you did. This is my 1st grow using sweet. and i think im going to get rid of sweet till im on the end of my grow. cause it is messing up my levels. thx for the advice

thanks to everyone for the help.

 

[Blackvelvet]

If your adding 15ml per gallon sweet with every watering, thats 61ppm magnesium. Alot! This was the source of the calcium trouble you have now. Giving the plant more magnesium than calcium is not what you want.

If your going to use 15ml pbp bloom for soil, you end up with this: (ppms)

n 61
p 74
k 174
mg 21
ca 42

You want a ratio of k to ca to mg of 4:2:1 So if you got 174 k, then you want 174/2 = 87 ca. You have 42 already. 87-42 = 45 still needed. If your going to use cal mag plus, 5ml per gallon adds 43 ppm ca...almost exactly what you need. This also adds 16ppm magnesium for a total of 21+16= 37. You wanted 174/4= 44. Close enough.

If you have just repotted and added dolomite lime, you won't need so much cal mag in your water.

If your going to switch back to sweet at the end of flower, you will want to add 23 ppm magnesium. 10 ml per gallon adds 42. 23/42 x 10 ml = 5.5 ml per gallon sweet you would add with the pbp bloom. Remember! You need to add 45 ppm calcium along with this to keep a balance or your leaves will start burning on top again. You would add 3/16 of a teaspoon per gallon calcium nitrate or calcium sulfate (powdered gypsum). Calcium chloride easily disolves ...you might want to pick up a bottle. I can help you come up with 45 ppm ca once you get net weight and % ca.

Good luck growing!


.

 

[gratefuldawg]

15ml pureblend bloom soil, 5 ml cal-mag, with RO water=GOLDEN. I'd like to hear Jdogs opinion on this cause I know he uses sugar daddy which is like sweet, but I'm not sure if it has the same magnesium..Hold on, let me go find him,lol.

Yo BlackVelvet, you seem like your good at all these ratios, math etc. I'd love a formula where I could use 15ml pureblend, and then some kind of calcium chloride with sweet. I've heard lots of good things about sweet, but it's caused nothin but problems for me.

Jdog, if you read this..does your sugar daddy have mag in it??

 

[Blackvelvet]

I'd love a formula where I could use 15ml pureblend, and then some kind of calcium chloride with sweet.

You can get a 50 pound bag of 30% ca calcium chloride for $16.50. www.hydro-gardens.com You may also find calcium chloride as a liquid in hobby size bottles to stop the blossom end of tomatoes from rotting. Call around to garden centers in your town for that. Calcium nitrate and calcium sulfate (gypsum) are also suitable ca sources. Calcium sulfate has to be a powder or it won't disolve. Try brew your own beer/wine stores for that.

Hit me up with a pm when you get all your fertilizers together and I will show you how to calculate your nutrient solution.

 

[Core]

stop giving me negative rep Black velvet....you supposed 2 be Banned from here...L

 

[JDOG6000]

Yes sugar daddy has mag in it. It also has a little sulfer in it. It's kind of like sweet and florolicious bloom combined, with molassas added. All in one.
The cal mag plus is my source of calcium and iron.
From the looks of it,some cal mag plus would fix that garden right up.
Kind of looks like an iron def. Either way the cal mag plus should fix it.

I feed 1 tablspoon of Pure blend pro, 1 Tablespoon of Budswel, 5 Ml.'s Cal mag plus or sugar daddy. Depending on how the plants looking.
I mostly add sugar daddy in the first feed and in the last month of flower a couple times. Other then that I use the cal mag every other feeding. When I don't flush.
I also add Liquid Karma in the first feed and then every couple weeks.
And silicate during the stretch.

 

[20kw dreams]

That's heat stress. No doubt in my mind whatsoever.

It could have just been one time, for 20 minutes, that your temps went up. Your N deficient as well, I see. Bump up your nutrients, back the light off. The N def made them slightly more sensitive to the heat.

Ca or Mg will show up on your lower fan leaves first.

 

[Scientist]

"Ca or Mg will show up on your lower fan leaves first."

This is what i thought at first glance

If this is a diff. strain than your last grow it is entirely possible to see diff. results from the same environment.

 

[Grat3fulh3ad]

Ca is an immobile element and will show up on new growth as Light green color or uneven chlorosis of young leaves; or margins of young leaves fail to form (strap-leaves); or growing points of stems and roots cease to develop (blunt end)

Mg is a mobile element, like N P or K and will show up in the older leaves first.

 

[Grat3fulh3ad]

If your adding 15ml per gallon sweet with every watering, thats 61ppm magnesium. Alot! This was the source of the calcium trouble you have now. Giving the plant more magnesium than calcium is not what you want.

If your going to use 15ml pbp bloom for soil, you end up with this: (ppms)

n 61
p 74
k 174
mg 21
ca 42

You want a ratio of k to ca to mg of 4:2:1 So if you got 174 k, then you want 174/2 = 87 ca. You have 42 already. 87-42 = 45 still needed. If your going to use cal mag plus, 5ml per gallon adds 43 ppm ca...almost exactly what you need. This also adds 16ppm magnesium for a total of 21+16= 37. You wanted 174/4= 44. Close enough.

If you have just repotted and added dolomite lime, you won't need so much cal mag in your water.

If your going to switch back to sweet at the end of flower, you will want to add 23 ppm magnesium. 10 ml per gallon adds 42. 23/42 x 10 ml = 5.5 ml per gallon sweet you would add with the pbp bloom. Remember! You need to add 45 ppm calcium along with this to keep a balance or your leaves will start burning on top again. You would add 3/16 of a teaspoon per gallon calcium nitrate or calcium sulfate (powdered gypsum). Calcium chloride easily disolves ...you might want to pick up a bottle. I can help you come up with 45 ppm ca once you get net weight and % ca.

Good luck growing!


.

According to Mel Frank... 60 ppm of Mg is dead on correct...

Do you grow cannabis?

 

[Scientist]

K I S S

(the stupid reefers to you bv)

 

[stussy22]

Im sure its not heat problems. so i picked up some cal mag and a pHep by hanna

Now the "proper pH" What should the water be that I'm watering my plants with? and my run off what should that number look like im growing in fox farm.

 

[Grat3fulh3ad]

6 ish