My room is no bueno! HALP!

[ThePizzaMan]

Hey guys!

Been quite a long while since I posted anything on this forum..but ive been here since 2010 and these forums have helped me so much...I like the new look..man how things have changed since 2010. My room has taken a nose dive...and im here to gain some knowledge and advise as to what is happening here in my room(s). Im not really sure where to begin...but I have uploaded some pics ... I have one main room with 4 lights (2 led +2 1000w HPS) and another smaller room with 2 1000w HPS lights. My main room and to a smaller extent has been a real pain in the butt ever since I came in here about 5 years ago. I Originally built the room inside of the basement to be ready for C02..I have a 1.5 ton MR. Cool mini split with heat pump that controls the room and does a pretty decent job of it. The room is below grade...but now in the winter the humidity is within optimal range(not following VPD)...

Let me break down the nitty gritty so you can get a better understanding of what im doing...

First I am growing in Rockwool..
4 4x4 trays with ebb and flood capability.
No circulating fans
no extraction fans no intake fans other than the fan ontop of the scrubber
I have a 70 pint dehuey that keeps thing in check pretty much if need be
I have an 8inch fan attached to a scrubber that sits at the end of the rows
The room was never quite finished...and there is an area at the end by the garage door that is not sealed off but covered from light for bloom 12/12 there are no light leaks
I am using basic Floranova Bloom ... calmag...and Maxibloom at the end of flower.. flush for two weeks.

Now onto the problems

Clones are going into 4x4 rockwool cubes.
Used to plant in white square wilma pots with rockwool croutons ... and would simply place the block on the croutons and hand water for the first 2 to 3 weeks.
This worked ok ....but I caught a massive fungus gnat infestation as I wasnt covering the tops of the blocks...algae would grow and theyd be all over the pots going in the drain holes and swarming the tops of the plants... it was horrible. I tried mosquito dunks..azamax..nematodes..noth ing worked and i realized that I need to change up what I was doing.

So a few months ago I started putting the rockwool blocks inside of fabric two gallon pots...covering the top with clay pebbles and then attempting to make a make shift cover for the tops of the rockwool. Worked ok for the first few rounds ...but Im getting moldy buds and slow growth ... fan leaves are just dying and massive deficiencies. I realize that ebb and flood is not the ideal method for rockwool...so Im going to try and set up some drippers.

Im really here to ask ... where do I start..and how do I widdle down what could be causing this issue. I know that the roots are not hitting the bottoms of the pots...I tried to flush the rockwool thinking that it was overfed and too salty...and my fresh water when the runoff was collected WAS MAXING OUT THE TRUNCHEON! Like if it could go higher it would! So there is a salt buildup in the rootzone or in the block ... but im handwatering from the top ...so Im not sure what exactly is going on.

I also looked at the root system on one of the dying plants...and other than the roots not growing to the bottom...the roots were not rotten...and there were no signs of Aphids. didnt see any fungus gnat larvae as the algae problem has mostly been fixed. Few flyers but populations have been reduced.

So what would be the correct order in fixing this problem. Throwing C02 at this and sealing up the room completely would be a good idea .. or no? My thoughts are that the air is stale and Co2 that is naturally in the air is not enough for the plants ...and they are slowing down and getting burned by my overfeeding. Should I add extraction and intake and go drip while changing the way I do my plants in rockwool? Im thinking of going straight 6" Rockwool blocks with drippers..I can only recirculate in this room as I am space limited and wouldnt have anywhere to put the reservoirs. No place to put the drain...unless one of you have a suggestion. The room is made of plywood ...and I know that its not ideal....how do you sterilize the room? The guy at the grow store said that I shouldnt spray my plants..but here good things about regalia and other products.

The other smaller room is more of an ideal setup... I will be running drip DTW in rockwool blocks and adding C02 ... this room has an exaust fan and scrubber. The larger room doesnt and the air is def stale.

Could stale air be my problem? I just figured the scrubber was pulling enough air for things to be ok... wow I know nothing.

Any help would be massively appreciated.

And yes I am aware that my rooms are a bit dirty...I am trying to fix that. In the coming weeks I will be cleaning and attempting to sterilize the whole room(s)

Thanks

TpM

 

[TPFTFW]

hmmm.. I’ll bump so hopefully you can get some other help.


obviously lock out if run off was that high
flushing may compound issues with roots.

you don’t reuse the medium do you?

 

[stashpot]

Hey guys!


No circulating fans
no extraction fans no intake fans other than the fan ontop of the scrubber


Thanks

TpM

Hey, this is all i needed to know.
There's your answer. All the best.

 

[ThePizzaMan]

hmmm.. I’ll bump so hopefully you can get some other help.


obviously lock out if run off was that high
flushing may compound issues with roots.

you don’t reuse the medium do you?

Thanks man...no I dont reuse my medium. I flushed with plain phd water but read that its not good to do so in rockwool....so Ive lowered the ppms to 700ppms for the next few feedings.

Thanks

TpM

 

[ThePizzaMan]

Hey, this is all i needed to know.
There's your answer. All the best.

Thanks Stashpot...extraction fan here I come! I started building the room..and then just stopped...figuring ambient air wouldnt need to be replaced as the scrubber was pulling air in...but the air is thick down there sometimes being in a basement.

Thanks

TpM

 

[stashpot]

Thanks Stashpot...extraction fan here I come! I started building the room..and then just stopped...figuring ambient air wouldnt need to be replaced as the scrubber was pulling air in...but the air is thick down there sometimes being in a basement.

Thanks

TpM

You're welcome.

Yeah that's the problem your pulling the only air and c02 available to them away from them with the scrubber although it gives it back it takes away more than gives.
I would go with a stand up Osculating fan before extractor the extractor would cause the same problem without the air movement fans.
If you can get both that would be best, but if you can only choose 1 go with the stand up osculating fan its a necessity, if noise is a problem you can stand it up onto a chair or something and put rubber or foam under it.
Extractor's are needed but without a air blowing fan its actually worse in this case.

Also another few things to help you out... get rid of the insulation from inside the pots they will create bad humidity build up especially that you have no fan blowing around at the root zone, when you water your plants the water will become stagnant and go stale which will rot your roots and basically drown them overtime, that's why your plant looks like this also added to the fact that the raised boxes you are using blocks most of the very little airflow in and around the soil zone.

No fan leads to no air movement, no air movement leads to humidity build up and water retention at the soil zone and around the plant's, which leads to the root zone being smothered which leads to lack of oxygen and co2 intake and a host of other by products, this is what one fan can do.

So my suggestions
1. osculating fan
2. extractor.
3. remove insulation on pots (at least until you have fans set up)
4. Rockwool dries fast if you cannot change your set up for the next grow i would use soil or coco.
All the best. (oh and P.S keep the change ya filthy Animal )

 

[stashpot]

just another tip for the future, air movement is a top 5 necessity when growing.

1. light
2. water
3. air
4. food
5. temps.

Anytime you have a problem go through these top 5's before you look at anything else, also you can include mediums in that list with checking PH, over/under watering lock outs etc.

 

[ThePizzaMan]

You're welcome.

Yeah that's the problem your pulling the only air and c02 available to them away from them with the scrubber although it gives it back it takes away more than gives.
I would go with a stand up Osculating fan before extractor the extractor would cause the same problem without the air movement fans.
If you can get both that would be best, but if you can only choose 1 go with the stand up osculating fan its a necessity, if noise is a problem you can stand it up onto a chair or something and put rubber or foam under it.
Extractor's are needed but without a air blowing fan its actually worse in this case.

Also another few things to help you out... get rid of the insulation from inside the pots they will create bad humidity build up especially that you have no fan blowing around at the root zone, when you water your plants the water will become stagnant and go stale which will rot your roots and basically drown them overtime, that's why your plant looks like this also added to the fact that the raised boxes you are using blocks most of the very little airflow in and around the soil zone.

No fan leads to no air movement, no air movement leads to humidity build up and water retention at the soil zone and around the plant's, which leads to the root zone being smothered which leads to lack of oxygen and co2 intake and a host of other by products, this is what one fan can do.

So my suggestions
1. osculating fan
2. extractor.
3. remove insulation on pots (at least until you have fans set up)
4. Rockwool dries fast if you cannot change your set up for the next grow i would use soil or coco.
All the best. (oh and P.S keep the change ya filthy Animal )

10" Extractor fan on the way! also some hurricane fans to spread the love! Ill keep this thread updated so you can check out the progress! Hopefully one day I can have my very own cheese pizza

 

[stashpot]

10" Extractor fan on the way! also some hurricane fans to spread the love! Ill keep this thread updated so you can check out the progress! Hopefully one day I can have my very own cheese pizza

That's the shizz hopefully you can save them, if i was you i would try just put 1 light on and keep them cool during lights on and stuff until you get your fans.
Lol yeah that or buzz will have to barf it up for ya
Just drop me a reply when you update i'll pop in see how you're getting on, peace to the middle east.

 

[f-e]

8" on a scrubber thought to be pulling air in?
That sounds a lot like an extractor to me.

 

[ThePizzaMan]

8" on a scrubber thought to be pulling air in?
That sounds a lot like an extractor to me.

no stale air is being pulled out of the room. the air is thick so I have a 10" that will be sucking out of the room. the 8" and scrubber are going to my smaller room and i will have to upgrade to another scrubber at some point. Thanks

 

[ThePizzaMan]

That's the shizz hopefully you can save them, if i was you i would try just put 1 light on and keep them cool during lights on and stuff until you get your fans.
Lol yeah that or buzz will have to barf it up for ya
Just drop me a reply when you update i'll pop in see how you're getting on, peace to the middle east.

me too stash...Ive also lowered my ppms to around 900 1000 to prevent salt buildup cause that runoff was insanely high! Will keep posted !

 

[stashpot]

Good job man you seem to be dialing her in better everyday, hope all goes well for you, either way it will be all set up for the next run.

 

[vulcanofilo]

Hey guys!

Been quite a long while since I posted anything on this forum..but ive been here since 2010 and these forums have helped me so much...I like the new look..man how things have changed since 2010. My room has taken a nose dive...and im here to gain some knowledge and advise as to what is happening here in my room(s). Im not really sure where to begin...but I have uploaded some pics ... I have one main room with 4 lights (2 led +2 1000w HPS) and another smaller room with 2 1000w HPS lights. My main room and to a smaller extent has been a real pain in the butt ever since I came in here about 5 years ago. I Originally built the room inside of the basement to be ready for C02..I have a 1.5 ton MR. Cool mini split with heat pump that controls the room and does a pretty decent job of it. The room is below grade...but now in the winter the humidity is within optimal range(not following VPD)...

Let me break down the nitty gritty so you can get a better understanding of what im doing...

First I am growing in Rockwool..
4 4x4 trays with ebb and flood capability.
No circulating fans
no extraction fans no intake fans other than the fan ontop of the scrubber
I have a 70 pint dehuey that keeps thing in check pretty much if need be
I have an 8inch fan attached to a scrubber that sits at the end of the rows
The room was never quite finished...and there is an area at the end by the garage door that is not sealed off but covered from light for bloom 12/12 there are no light leaks
I am using basic Floranova Bloom ... calmag...and Maxibloom at the end of flower.. flush for two weeks.

Now onto the problems

Clones are going into 4x4 rockwool cubes.
Used to plant in white square wilma pots with rockwool croutons ... and would simply place the block on the croutons and hand water for the first 2 to 3 weeks.
This worked ok ....but I caught a massive fungus gnat infestation as I wasnt covering the tops of the blocks...algae would grow and theyd be all over the pots going in the drain holes and swarming the tops of the plants... it was horrible. I tried mosquito dunks..azamax..nematodes..noth ing worked and i realized that I need to change up what I was doing.

So a few months ago I started putting the rockwool blocks inside of fabric two gallon pots...covering the top with clay pebbles and then attempting to make a make shift cover for the tops of the rockwool. Worked ok for the first few rounds ...but Im getting moldy buds and slow growth ... fan leaves are just dying and massive deficiencies. I realize that ebb and flood is not the ideal method for rockwool...so Im going to try and set up some drippers.

Im really here to ask ... where do I start..and how do I widdle down what could be causing this issue. I know that the roots are not hitting the bottoms of the pots...I tried to flush the rockwool thinking that it was overfed and too salty...and my fresh water when the runoff was collected WAS MAXING OUT THE TRUNCHEON! Like if it could go higher it would! So there is a salt buildup in the rootzone or in the block ... but im handwatering from the top ...so Im not sure what exactly is going on.

I also looked at the root system on one of the dying plants...and other than the roots not growing to the bottom...the roots were not rotten...and there were no signs of Aphids. didnt see any fungus gnat larvae as the algae problem has mostly been fixed. Few flyers but populations have been reduced.

So what would be the correct order in fixing this problem. Throwing C02 at this and sealing up the room completely would be a good idea .. or no? My thoughts are that the air is stale and Co2 that is naturally in the air is not enough for the plants ...and they are slowing down and getting burned by my overfeeding. Should I add extraction and intake and go drip while changing the way I do my plants in rockwool? Im thinking of going straight 6" Rockwool blocks with drippers..I can only recirculate in this room as I am space limited and wouldnt have anywhere to put the reservoirs. No place to put the drain...unless one of you have a suggestion. The room is made of plywood ...and I know that its not ideal....how do you sterilize the room? The guy at the grow store said that I shouldnt spray my plants..but here good things about regalia and other products.

The other smaller room is more of an ideal setup... I will be running drip DTW in rockwool blocks and adding C02 ... this room has an exaust fan and scrubber. The larger room doesnt and the air is def stale.

Could stale air be my problem? I just figured the scrubber was pulling enough air for things to be ok... wow I know nothing.

Any help would be massively appreciated.

And yes I am aware that my rooms are a bit dirty...I am trying to fix that. In the coming weeks I will be cleaning and attempting to sterilize the whole room(s)

Thanks

TpM

Tienes un patógeno que se perpetua, .

Buscalo y elimínalo, todas las habitaciones son buenas

 

[Creeperpark]

You are burning the shit out of your plants. You need to use less fertilizer when your cuttings are very small. What is the EC or ppm are you using?

 

[Creeperpark]

Also, I have found that feeding rockwool from the top is better than bottom watering in the long run.