Motorist forfeited money despite illegal search

[guest]

Michigan Supreme Court: Motorist forfeited money despite illegal search
7/3/2007, 5:51 p.m. EDT
The Associated Press

LANSING, Mich. (AP) — The Michigan Supreme Court on Tuesday denied the appeal of a motorist who had to forfeit nearly $181,000 that was found in a backpack during a traffic stop, even though the money was seized illegally.

The court ruled 4-3 that Van Buren County prosecutors could seize the money, upholding decisions by a circuit judge and the Michigan Court of Appeals. Forfeiture is the loss of property due to breaking a law.

Tamika Smith, who was stopped by a Michigan State Police trooper, lost the money when a judge ruled prosecutors presented enough other evidence to show it was intended to buy illicit drugs. The evidence of the money had been suppressed because the trooper's search of her trunk was nonconsensual.

Justice Elizabeth Weaver wrote in the majority opinion that the totality of circumstances — including Smith having a large sum of cash despite reporting a meager income and the stop being made along a known drug corridor — backed up earlier rulings. She was joined by Chief Justice Clifford Taylor, Maura Corrigan and Robert Young Jr.

Stephen Markman, Michael Cavanagh and Marilyn Kelly dissented.

Markman accused the majority of redefining the law to avoid the necessary consequences of suppressing evidence. He said the fact that a person is low-income and driving in a rental car along Interstate 94 between Detroit and Chicago can describe innocent behavior and is not enough to support forfeiting the money.
© 2007 Associated Press

 

[guest]

Things that make you wanna puke .....

As far as property goes .. people in the US now have to prove that they should have the property they are holding.

Otherwise the cops get to keep everything they find.

 

[guest]

The cash is being held by the cops that committed the illegal search.

They are being rewarded for breaking the law.

 

[DIGITALHIPPY]

yea, i already hated cops.
stupid dirty rotten fuckin pigs.

 

[Guest]

If I actually had faith in our goverment/law enforcement, a little bit would have been lost after reading this.

Guilty until proven innocent.

 

[Jimmy_Shelter]

More than likely the money was Crack, or Meth money. If thats the case, i am glad she lost it all. What a dumb ass to carry that much cash through a known drug trafficking area. Kinda like being pissed that ya was bit by a gator , after walking through a swamp with raw meat in your pocket. Crack and Meth are Hard core drugs, that have no place in society.
However it does suck that they are holding the cash on an illegal search and seizure.

 

[guest]

More than likely the money was Crack, or Meth money. If thats the case, i am glad she lost it all. What a dumb ass to carry that much cash through a known drug trafficking area. Kinda like being pissed that ya was bit by a gator , after walking through a swamp with raw meat in your pocket. Crack and Meth are Hard core drugs, that have no place in society.
However it does suck that they are holding the cash on an illegal search and seizure.

I'm guessing that you haven't thought that through much ..

The "gator" is a cop that is supposed to obey laws.

BTW .. where is the list of roads that are subject to forfeiture of all your cash? I live in the countryside. Farmland .. period. Yet I live within three miles of 94. Does that mean that I can't carry any cash with me at all?

Perhaps she was a crack or meth dealer. It doesn't matter as there was zero evidence that it was drug money.

The current system is allowing any cop to take anyones money any time for any (or no) reason at all.

Doesn't that make your gut churn?

 

[Guest]

it doesn't matter what the money was for. Who's to say they weren't driving somewhere to purchase a home. Whos to say it wasn't someone who had just sold a shitload of ganga. Maybe they just didn't like banks.

the point is, cops shouldn't just be allowed to confiscate cash. What the fuck ever happened to innocent until proven guilty. o yea.....the patriot act fucked that over.....nevermind.

 

[Greenjag]

Isn't it about time you folk had another revolution?

You justifiably kicked out us Brits in the 18th century for giving you too much shit and now your own government gives you even more!

Our guns were taken off us, maybe time to use yours before the same happens!

 

[guest]

Isn't it about time you folk had another revolution?

You justifiably kicked out us Brits in the 18th century for giving you too much shit and now your own government gives you even more!

Our guns were taken off us, maybe time to use yours before the same happens!

Thank you.

 

[Dr. Smokepuma]

good question

good question

I'm guessing that you haven't thought that through much ..

The "gator" is a cop that is supposed to obey laws.

BTW .. where is the list of roads that are subject to forfeiture of all your cash? I live in the countryside. Farmland .. period. Yet I live within three miles of 94. Does that mean that I can't carry any cash with me at all?

Perhaps she was a crack or meth dealer. It doesn't matter as there was zero evidence that it was drug money.

The current system is allowing any cop to take anyones money any time for any (or no) reason at all.

Doesn't that make your gut churn?

where is the list of roads that are subject to forfeiture of all your cash? i'm doing some traveling in my RV with the old lady and we carry cash ya never know when credit won't be taken. i would hate to go through what thye call drug alley i heard it on the news but they never say where it is i'll be traeling from on coast to the other i would like to avoid this area

 

[Guest]

They do it every day if you're carrying 10 grand or more,no ticket or court date just confiscation.They bring a drug sniffing dog that would hit on a 20 dollar bill in the troopers pocket and you're moneys gone.Still the land of the free you just have to fight a little harder to stay that way.

 

[dude06version]

they dont have the right to take your money the way you make it seem .. if you have over 10,000 you have to show where the money came from, thats anywhere not just certain highways.. so if a cop stops you with 9000 dollars in your front seat they cant touch it, and you wouldnt be forced to prove anything. i honestly cant think of a legitimate reason to roll around with 181 k in cash.. write a check.unless your doing something "illegal" its extremly stupid and risky to travel with that amount of cash.

 

[inflorescence]

.. if you have over 10,000 you have to show where the money came from, thats anywhere not just certain highways.. .

There is no law on the american books that I know of that says a citizen must prove where the money came from if over 10K. If that was the case the cops could just illegally enter everyones home and seize any monies over 10K just like was done here.

The problem is forfeiture is civil so when a cop busts you you may get out of the criminal liabilty but during the exact same bust you will be liable for the civil aspect of the money and if that's not double jepordy then what is, and civil forfeiture requires only a preponderance of evidence, not a beyond a reasonable doubt like the criminal aspect of the same bust.

 

[Guest]

There is no law in Amerika that states that you have to prove the origins on amounts over $10k. There -are- laws governing crossing international borders with sums approaching or exceeding $10k, or engaging in commerce with 'financial institutions' in amounts approaching or exceeding $10k; in those cases, paper work is supposed to be required.

And since the passage of the USA PATRIOT ACT, there are newer laws governing the reporting of money orders in excess of, or approaching, $3k.

Nope, for several decades, and especially where the War On(Some) Drugs is concerned, the (politically stacked) SCOTUS, and many state courts, simply 'make it up as they go.'

Both parties' judges do it.

Like Scalia stating that rights are not guaranteed, and can be taken away, depending on how society is conducting itself, as though we're all in our early teens, and subject to being disciplined by our daddies and mommies on the bench, by having our unalienable rights suspended for not bending over far enough, or not jumping high enough, based on the narcicistic, theocratic, and corrupt Antonin Scalia's or Mr. Roberts interpretation of 'what is moral' or 'not moral.'.... A more subtle form of totalitarian theocracy.

There are many persons who believe that if we simply bide our time, and talk reasonably with these folks, that they'll eventually see the light, and become more fair or just in their rulings and actions. The people who believe that, in my opinion, don't understand the nature of power gropers and totalitarianism, or of government institutions; those government bodies and larger organizations that tend to feed themselves more and more power as a primary objective of their being. They become growing organisms. Cancers that need to be cut out and disposed of. Or the entire body whithers and rots.

I only see a couple of ways that these fascists are going to become more humble, but I'm not going to get my blood pressure any higher by elaborating much on that..

"Send me lawyers, guns, and money...."

BTW, I'd hate to live in a system where it was -openly acceptable- for the courts to take things away simply because someone else didn't like them or was merely suspicious of them, but I guess that we're approaching that reality now.

And, after all, prohibition works so well, doesn't it?? Whether talking about meth, coke, smack, mushrooms, weed, or any other substance, prohibition has been a dismal failure, destroying far more than it has helped.

All that seizures of this sort of capital provide for is the fascists decking themselves out with better equipment, faster cars, more pigs, higher tech surveillance toys, more advanced communications equipment, etc.

And if you think that when they come to your door, or pull you over, that they're going to be all warm and fuzzy because you had a joint instead of syringe, then you haven't been paying attention.

We're at war, and in this war, every junkie is my potential comrade; he's been shit on by these zealots every bit as much, if not moreso, as any pot heads I've known. And much for the same relatively arbitrary reasons.

Banish the theocrats, zealots, fascists, totalitarian socialists, corporatists, drug warriors -and- their supporters all to a theocracy in the Middle East, with a swift boot in the arse as they depart, and give me back my country.

moose eater

 

[guest]

Someone just filled me in on a situation:

A landscaper went to purchase a large batch of tree seedlings. He took nine grand with him to make the purchase.

He flew. And paid cash for the plane ticket. The ticket agent saw he had a large amount of cash and turned him in.

The cops took his money.

 

[guest]

There have been no standards established yet to determine how much money is to much to carry.

At this time, that is determined on a case by case basis.

Now it's whatever the cop and the judge determine is suspicious.

 

[badboyg]

time to start shooting... you take 10+ k of my $$$ and it will be covered in someones blood,,,...

 

[Guest]

>>>Now it's whatever the cop and the judge determine is suspicious.<<<

Just in case anyone's wondering, that -is-, in large part, the definition of a 'police state.'

When Alaska passed its original medical cannabis law, then Senator Loren Leman responded by asking the State Pigs if it was O.K., and what would make it both acceptable and enforcable from a police pespective; the People had spoken via a -very- successful initiative, and our legislative response was to ask the Pigs, the virtual PFCs of the 'public servants,' if it was O.K.

I pointed that out to them in my testimony to the legislators re. Leman's gutting of our original MMJ law; that only in a police state do the People engage in a legitimate vote, then have their legislators ask the police if it's O.K.

There's no more need to ask, "Is Amerika heading toward fascism??" We've already arrived a while ago, and then some.

These folks are enemies of the constitution of this country, and should be dealt with as such.. They have no legitimacy, and their assertions of authority should be denied or ignored whenever possible.. From Shrubco and the Head Chimp, all the way down to Officer Friendly, and most points between.

moose eater

 

[Dr. Smokepuma]

well

well

they dont have the right to take your money the way you make it seem .. if you have over 10,000 you have to show where the money came from, thats anywhere not just certain highways.. so if a cop stops you with 9000 dollars in your front seat they cant touch it, and you wouldnt be forced to prove anything. i honestly cant think of a legitimate reason to roll around with 181 k in cash.. write a check.unless your doing something "illegal" its extremly stupid and risky to travel with that amount of cash.

i would travel with that much cash i think the cop can and have taken peoples money for no reason