Led Vs. Hps - 70w Challenge

[LED_experiments]

oooo, look who came arround. wellcome knna.
thanks for compliment about the manufacturing even if i'm not completely satisfied with it. it still needs to be improved for next setups. the main problem is soldering to 5mm wide connections. i need to change that and make small rounds arround the soldering points. othervise if customer is satisfied, i am too.
btw: do you have any project in progress to show us? i'm very interested in your work because you proved so many times that your theoretical knowledge about leds is on very high level.

 

[Medved]

Helou everybody,

Truth I think you should buy yourself new glasses and stop smoking for a while. On the video that I show it, It's clear to see, that HPS is in lead! In HPS room the girls are nicer, bigger, and more healthier.

Today is 13 days under LEDs and the plants look bigger. HPS is still in lead, the flowers in there are healthier. In HPS room, are Ak-47 and DCSkunk very nice, but in LED room, only DCSkunk are nice, AK-47 is not going so well.

The net is on 40 cm, in LED room and also in HPS room. In HPS room I have to curve them under the net already, but in the LED room, the girls are about 40 cm but I don't need to curve them yet.

First you can see a HPS room, with 6 girls inside,

And here you can see girls under LEDs.

Here is one DCSkunk grown under leds, about 40 cm high (with pot)

And here is the pic of whole LED room.

ps. lightning was lifted because of picturing, Then I get it down.

 

[The Predator]

truth, youse a heckler...chill and observe and you just might learn something, really.

 

[AB1337]

Why not use hyperwhite LED's?

 

[LED_experiments]

any reason why we should? what is hyperwhite led? i must say i'm in this business for quite a long time and never heared for a model called hyperwhite. any links?

 

[pumpkin2006]

Do you think that some particular strains of cannabis respond to different wavelengths? I mean when we look at the graphs for Chlorophyll A & B, along with the others I can't spell, how are we knowing that these are the ideal wavelengths? The reason that a HID may be so successful is 1) Its photon penetration abilities but maybe more importantly 2)Its hit and miss success when it comes to wavelengths; they are fairly intense in the ballpark ranges of what we know to be the right wavelengths. Unfortunately, until we know the exact wavelengths to use, LED's should probably use an equal portion of 450, 460 & 470 and then equal portions of 620, 630 & 640; ect. ect. ect.

Now how to pattern that... I'll leave that to someone who's good at geometry.

 

[Truth]

try and read back if you don't understand, LED_Experiments claimed that the LED lights save more money and energy in a long run, compared to HID. I simply posted a mathematical explanation as to why he was wrong in that regard. he also pointed out that LED was only for people wanting to grow to save money, had limited space, and lack of the need to cool the lights. Obviously, you aren't saving money though, of which I pointed out. And as for space, you could fit a 400w HPS in that amount of space, and get amazing results. So who can benefit from this mis-information? people trying to convince growers that LED is better, so they can sell them these overpriced systems.

My point was that if HID can give you 4x the yield, in relatively the same space, and was cheaper cost over all, how can LED be better? Even with a par rating of 100%(led) and 30%(hid), the HID still comes out on top. of course I'm not trolling, just trying to get to the truth. LED_Experiments completely ignored that post where I had shown mathematical evidence that HID was cheaper and better, after he had stated LED was cheaper and better. And yes, I have seen comparison grows before between HID and LED, though I can't think of any links off the top of my head. I've also seen strictly LED grows, several in fact, and most have a hard time in flowering, and are usually worse off than if they were grown under an HID with the same wattage. whether you like it or not, growing is a science as well as an art.

note: it doesn't matter if there is a full spectrum bulb for 70w HPS or not. The point is, if you want a controlled experiment, you have to have controlled conditions. if one light has more spectrums than the other, obviously that light has an unfair advantage over the other. this does make up for the shortcomings of LED a bit, but there shouldn't be any making up for these shortcomings. I also had to point out the problems with the care between the LED plants and HPS plants, because the HPS plants were obviously being less cared for than the LED plants. you could see dead leafs, nute burn, PH problems, etc on the HPS plants. But even though they had been mis-cared for more than the LED, they still had grown more, and had more branching than the LED.


I guess no one has realized that you could get these lights (same wattage) for the same price this guy did, retail. And if you built it yourself, you could probably pay much less. LED_Exp said he only charged him the supplies costs, when that is not the case. the supplies costs would have been lower.

 

[LED_experiments]

@truth:
i had a lot of experiences with guys like you and i know there is no way to explain them anything. they are convinced that they are right and they don't change their oppinion even if you prove them wrong. so i learned to ignore them. don't be offended or smth, but i really see no point wasting my time for you. you would most probably claim that hps is more economical even if we get 10g/w under leds.

edit: the price of the material is not the only data that you need. there are certain specifications that you need to know what you are dealing with. i can make a 70W lamp for under $100, but what would be the output? you really don't know even a basic things about leds and you are trying to teach me about them. ok dude, i will stop spreading my knowledge about leds because i see you know so much more about them. so now all we have to do is wait to see if you have the balls to make your experiment and start developing this tecnology. i would really want to see that.

 

[Truth]

you seem to think that since many people don't grow under LED's that they are ignorant of the prices per LED, and wide range of LED diodes available. would you like me to use the specifications of your LED's to compare the prices of what they can be bought for, vs what you charged this guy? don't be coy, you want to develop this so you can convince people LED is better so you can make a killing off of future sales. if LED's did get 10g/w, HID would be most definitely doomed, but thats not the case is it? so, no, I would not most probably claim such, as you incorrectly assume. People try to exploit the cannabis community with new and improved products all the time, and usually these products are over priced, and don't perform up to par. how can you ask me not to be offended when you blatantly insult me? kind of ironic. you clearly stated that LED was over all cheaper, which I clearly proved, was not the case. I have yet to see LED surpass HID in g/w, so surprise me then. there is no need to continue, I've said what I had to say, you said what you had to say...Just prove me wrong. Just surprise me.

 

[The Predator]

whether you like it or not, growing is a science as well as an art.

so is intelligent conversation...

i dismantled you in another led thread under a diffrent nick, so you decided to s**t in this thread ?

go, educate yourself about led techology then come back and apologize to led_ex for makig such dumb, unfounded and very ignorant claims. You have no idea what or who you are talking about, it's a shame to see a human being on a such a low level...and i had such high hopes...

and please, don't bother responding. use that time to sit in a corner and think about what strange insecurity you are trying to overcome by this type of ignorant behaviour...

 

[pumpkin2006]

OK, THATS IT, WHY THE FUCK DOES EVERY NEW AND EXPERIMENTAL IDEA IN THE CANNABIS COMMUNITY BRING OUT TROLLS?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!??!?

I'M FUCKING PISSED, I TRY AND TALK WITH REASON, BUT NOOOOOOO JUST HAS TO KEEP ON COMING.

Man my pussy as site over at gardenscure is looking better and better, no trolls and we check people the second they get outta line. Where the fuck is the admins on this shit?! Its like one site, you have to tip-toe around subjects and be all nice and then on this site a bunch of people are dicks, WTF?!

Truth, your a troll, we don't care what you have to say, go away, your on my ignore list and I just don't want to see anything you typed. Refer to my previous posts for any response you might have.

 

[GhostToker]

Ive studied differents Mj strains photons by wavelenght, and differences between strains are of 3% as max, when growed in sunlight.

What many people arent aware is the plant's adaptability to differents lighting regimens, both is quantity and quality. Most plants, and Cannabis is one of the plant's species with higher adaptability, can adapt their photosynthetic system in order to use more effectively the light in one week.

If you take a Cannabis plant growing in sunlight and put it below a HPS, in about 7-10 days, chlorophill B content doubled, in order to use better the dominant orange light provided by HPS.

Sunlight peak photon flux reaching Earth is 670nm, so plants are adapted to use this wavelenght the best. But if you put a plant below a acuarium MH, it adapt to use 440nm more efficiently than any other wl.

I think the main mistake many people do is thinking in the spectrum action response of plants as something fixed, when its constantly adapting and changing.

Because of this, side by side grows as this performed by Medved are so necessary to see how plants adapt to LED lighting.

That's amazing! Is this the case for all plants, or just MJ? Nature's ability to adapt is truly astounding. That being said, I THOUGHT that different plant hormones are linked to the light spectrum they recieve

 

[AB1337]

any reason why we should? what is hyperwhite led? i must say i'm in this business for quite a long time and never heared for a model called hyperwhite. any links?

The SUPER bright white LED's they use in high-powered flashlights, spotlights, etc.

Seems it might have a better wavelength? I'm not questioning your knowledge so no worries...

 

[LED_experiments]

ok, i know superbright white (cool and warm), but i thought you found a model called hyperwhite.
do you have any specific model of them? any spectrum output charts or something like that? i also looked for white leds, but i think those i used have more usefull spectrum. white is a full spectrum and there are not all the wl necessary. i was thinking about adding some of them but then i decided to use only what is really necessary. maybe in my next project i'll put some white into the setup.

 

[Medved]

new update, girls are in 17 days of vegetation. I'm worried about AK-47 in LED room, but DCSkunk is awsome in the LED room. I will wait for a week or two and then 12/12 for flowering.

My girls under led system.

HPS room

both places together:

If anybody know what should be the problem by the AK-47 at led room, please tell me. Thanks


greetings till nextime

 

[Truth]

just as I expected, the HID is doing much better than the LED.


and as for 'the predator'..I think you are confused. oh and if you are that someone who has been recently banned for using two nicknames to agree with yourself when everyone else told you, you were wrong, you will be banned again.

 

[The Predator]

more childish behaviour from truth...so what else is new?

medved, i don't know what could cause that, but maybe it will get better during flowering, since the led system has more red leds. i may be way off here...

and medved, i'm sorry for letting myself get provoked and respond to bs in such a wonderful thread, it won't happen again. i promise

 

[Truth]

well it looks like you have 1-2 scraggly ones in each room, perhaps if they are the same strain, and the ones that are better off are a different strain, it could just be the strain or condition of the seeds itself from the beginning. Only you can really know what went wrong with them because you are caring for them. ask yourself, are you doing anything different for them? has any condition possible been different for them than the others? perhaps they just came from bad seed stock. I don't think the lighting is the culprit since the others are doing so well (unless it is a specific strain having problems, but if the same strain is having problems under HPS, that kind of cancels it out), although it could have gotten too hot in there for them somehow.

Also, since LED pushes out less heat, it is easier to overwater plants under them, the water will take longer to dry out. on a separate note, if you can try to turn the pots or space them a little more, whichever will allow you to give those fan leafs some more direct light and space. I see that a few are starting to intersect and shade each other. a suggestion I would make is to remove 1-2 of the scraggly ones from the grow spaces, since they are so far behind, your other plants would be better off if they had that extra space and lighting coverage.

thepredator: you were not provoked in any way, that does not justify your outburst. you are saying I am acting childish when Ive been completely reasonable. you are placing your descriptions on me, you are the one who is acting childish. you are the only one I see making disrespectful comments. remember, you promised, so I don't expect to see it again.

 

[Medved]

Yes there are all ak-47 that they are wierd. It look's like that this strain is more sensitive than DCSkunk. Is't possible that there is too little co2 in the air? because the fresh air comes out in the HPS room, and then get filled with oxygen and then goes into led room, I have only 1x 80mm (cumpter) vent for exaust. All other things are the same: soil, nutrients, watering, ... And I doubt It's a bad seed, because I already grow with clones, from this mother. And everything was OK. But when I took clones from this mother, the mother already was wierd. Does anybody know, what should I do, with this clones of AK-47?

Thanx

 

[Medved]

Ok, I went to messure what't the temp in the pots. Temp of the soil is about 23,5 - 24.0 °C in led room, and 23,0 - 23,5 °C in HPS room. The temp of the air in the Led room was about 26 °C, and about 25 °C in the HPS room.