(Juicy Fruit x Royal Orange) V's (Royal Orange x Juicy Fruit) Reciprocal Diallel F2

[Mate Dave]

Here is what I am going to be growing as my main crop of 2020.

Both parental lines are F1 Hybrids & I thought it would be interesting to see what would happen if they we're to have babies..

I've no idea when to expect but it sounds like fun.

I'm wanting to continue to exploit heterosis without outbreeding depression or 'Hybrid breakdown'

I feel that I will have some interesting plants in the progeny & I want to see the GCA SCA & REC of the crosses & find the Super High Yielding hybrids and exploit heterosis in F2 rather than loose 50% of it in a generation..


I'm growing the F1's @ 37N & all my selections will be done under natural light in the field where I can grow big plants to test for the Yield trait & also make the strain as early & resistant as I can.

I registered with Phylos Bioscience https://phylos.bio/plant-breeding & intend to use their test kits to separate the Males & Females before they go in the field from pots. It would be beneficial to know what Chemotype's they are so I can omit any that are not suitable & label them as clones for future breeding.

 

[Mate Dave]

 

[Mate Dave]

I'm not sure on the route that I will be going yet but here is an example of what might occur, who knows what will happen I shall keep you informed

I'm just waiting to pick up the Packets of Royal Orange. I thought I'd get 2 packs as it's supposed to be hard to find the better pheno & this strain makes some awesome bubble hash..

 

[Guy Brush]

Both parental lines are F1 Hybrids & I thought it would be interesting to see what would happen if they we're to have babies..

I've no idea when to expect but it sounds like fun.

I'm wanting to continue to exploit heterosis without outbreeding depression or 'Hybrid breakdown'

I feel that I will have some interesting plants in the progeny & I want to see the GCA SCA & REC of the crosses & find the Super High Yielding hybrids and exploit heterosis in F2 rather than loose 50% of it in a generation..

And then comes Sensi and puts some random shit in their packages...;-)

 

[Mate Dave]

Thanks for stopping by Guy. No doubt there will be issues, life is not without it's problems. That's how it go's I'm afraid. Man's best laid plans put in ruins by some dodgy antics in the packing room.

I suppose it's worth a mention here that the last lot of Sensi I got in to breed with didn't germinate This much lead time before planting season gives me a while to get some sprouting & complain to Ben Himself. There is also some backup genetics I'm carrying for such an occasion, F1 seeds of CheesexDeisel, I've some Blueberry IBL & some PsychosisxPure & a couple types of haze ear marked for a run & a few other packs of Orange'y terp'y shizzle..

The Flying Dutchman seems to be reliable from what I've seen even if Sensi is a bit shocking @ times.

Buddy of mine did get 30 hash plants up in the Uk a while back & all grew well till the rain came..

Maybe Sensi will take more care in the packaging if people put up threads showing the problems with the seeds, rather then just saying they don't work just show it in open forums & they will have to rethink business. They get a lot of credit here in Spain as there is lots of seed growers about, I've seen some recent grows with these strains & they gave good strong plants from seeds that germinated well. It remains to be seen GuyBush.

All my seeds are kept in the door of the fridge. I maybe killed a few hundred by accident when I turned it down & some freezing happened because I had poor germination 2nd time round but I only came here with a few vials not ounces of seeds..

I've got other breeding projects. Those Psychosis x Pure's we're acclimatised this season just gone & was bottlenecked to a good finish time & big plant structure. It's a Superskunk type with a loud nose, I prefer it to Blue cheese.. The males I'll backcross this season coming onto the original mum & I'll restart my selections & see what's up. Any time I find interesting females i'll include their traits to the IBL.. I see the many males & 1 female as diversity but with selection, it allows me to then pick out the chemotype I might need for future breeding.. I think I started a thread about that line already.

 

[Mate Dave]

This is an example of what I will be looking into for my personal medication but this is theoretical @ this stage as the Ratio's may end up higher or lower & I could have more than one reciprocal or f2 line to cross & I may even find some CBD heavy stuff to inbreed..

The next bunch of crosses would then go back to the top & depending on the amounts of reciprocals, I could make the F3's a selfed generation or BX & then breed the F3 selfed inbred lines together with the BX males or cross up the F2 Hybrids.. It's all about the reciprocals..

I will have to run some bigger charts

 

[Mate Dave]

Here's a couple of short video's from Phylos Bioscience explaining a few things, 1st one is the plant sex test process showing how to use the Kit, perhaps you will find it interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVK1mATz2mE&feature=youtu.be

This other video explains how to perform a Genotype test with another of their kit's

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qOJjEnQQKw

 

[Mate Dave]

From what I understand a variety is a seed line, be it a Naturalised indigenous Landrace or a cultivated/man-made variety within isolation grown in either a field or lab.

Cultivars are clones. If you register a plant it's a cultivar.

Ok, so a seed line is a Varietal. Now lets say that from here then that there are no Cannabis 'strains' per say..

A Varietal consists of a group of plants having the same genotype right?

I've read a few breeding books & learned about different types of hybridisations.

Types of Hybridization

Plant hybridization can be of 2 main types.

Based on the taxonomic relationship of the two parents, hybridization may be classified into two broad groups.

1) Inter-Varietal Hybridisation:

The parents involved in this type of hybridisation belong to the same species. In a crop improvement programme this type of hybridisation is commonly used. Inbreeding the pure F2 seed lines in the above genealogy chart is an example of such.

Inter-Varietal crosses may be simple or complex depending upon the number of parents involved.


2) Distant-Hybridisation/Inter-Specific Hybridisation/Inter-Generic Hybridisation

The parents involved in these types of cross belong to the different species of the same genus or of different genera. When two different species of the same genus such as the indica x sativa are mated it is commonly known as Intra-specific hybridisation. When the parents belong to different genera such as Thai x Afghan it's known as Inter-Generic hybridisation. Generally the objectives of such crosses are to transfer one or few characters, like disease resistance.

So basically like 'strains' cannabis hybridisation can be classified in many ways; Intra-varietal hybridisation Distant hybridisation Intra-Generic Intra-Specific


Single Cross Hybrids Progeny from the cross between two pure bred lines produces an F1 generation called the F1 hybrid

(F1 is short for Filial 1, meaning “first offspring).

The cross between two different homozygous lines produces an F1 hybrid that is heterozygous; having two alleles, one contributed by each parent and typically one is dominant and the other recessive.

The F1 generation is also homogenous, producing offspring that are all similar to each other.

Double Cross Hybrids Progeny from the cross between two different F1 hybrids.

Three-way Cross Hybrids Progeny from a cross between one parent that is an F1 hybrid and another from an inbred line.

Triple Cross Hybrids Progeny from the crossing of two different Three-way cross hybrids.

Top Cross Hybrids Cross's between inbred lines (IBL's) & open pollinated variety's (OPV)

Distant Hybridisation (Population hybrids include)
Intergeneric hybridization – crossing between parents from the two different genera
Interspecific hybridization – crossing between parents from two different species.

(Here is a list of some of the divergences in the above breeding plan not by any means it it exclusive )
Indoor x outdoor
Sam x neville
indica x sativa
highland x lowland
Landrace x landrace
F1xF1
Chemotype x Chemotype
If you see something diverse I missed in the above please tell me. I’m going to add to this


General Procedures for Hybrid Production or Hybridisation & Hybrid evaluation involves following a few basic steps;

Choice of parents
Evaluation testing of parents & progeny
Protection of male & female P1 parents
Bagging seeds
Tagging plants
Pollination, bagging & tagging
Aftercare
Harvesting


An example of a triple cross hybrid breeding program

 

[Happy Times]

Sounds like a super tasty citrusy mix there

Juicy Fruit is one of those good old memories for me of a cut you wish you still had

 

[Illuminate]

Nice thread

 

[Mate Dave]

Nice thread

 

[Mate Dave]

 

[Mate Dave]

 

[Mate Dave]

I've been waiting for Phylos to get back to me with regards to their tests. I'm glad they haven't now because I have discovered my own way of doing their analytical tests that require no postage & none of their import charges or 'Nada'

The sex tests are not inaccurate but they do not allow scope for environmental stress & they are not fast enough & now I have discovered I can do it myself in-house, this goes for the predicative testing too.

Simple & cheap as chips it is. No long tings

I am confident enough to do it myself & have the best plants that have been field tested analysed by Fundación CANNA by their advanced methods to cut down my costs. I ain't paying 40K to nobody to do what I can do myself..

They might even become redundant in this project apart from facilitating a Genomic test, you can use the Galaxy for free & that is all we need them for..

I need time to think if I want to have that done & let them have a sample of my (IP).

@ the moment I have mixed views of such nonsense & I might just show you all how I did this after fruition to help you all out.

I've learned so much in a few weeks it's hard to think beyond this.

What I know is I can test sex myself in-house. I can test the Potency of the plants in-house with regards to the flow chart with the reciprocal hybrids. I can do plenty more than that too by the looks of it. I'm just discovering it's true value as I type this

Feliz año nuevo

 

[farmerlion]

P1 reversals

P1 reversals

I did a side by side grow of reversed parental plants last season. It was only with 4 plants. The seeds were feminized and turned out identical. I made a thread in the side by side test grow section. If you're using f1 crosses and not exactly the same plants reversed. You should have some noticable differences. Peace. MedDakotabis

 

[Mate Dave]

I managed to get the Fruity Juice seeds to split in 2 days under the sun, I placed them in the paper towels into a black resealable food container in the sun. All 10 split but I only potted up 9. One of the seeds I didn't notice had a cracked shell. It's still germinating but I didn't pot it up. (Today it's an unviable embryo that needs special care & attention like, micropropagation to bring it along. All the useful stuff is all going El natural in proper dirt. ETA Croptober..

They have been planted into a mix of homemade garden compost, EWC, Sphagnum moss peat, perite, screened landslide, pine bark & goat shit.

I just hope it's not too rich for them, the mix was looking like serious dirt so they got it.

I planted maybe 50 Skunk Haze freebies just to see what happens, 3 of them had split when I looked today. Going to pop the orange ASAP.

 

[ValleyHill]

Think I'll sit in the corner, : listen and learn " I think the saying is.
Atb with this mate dave
Vh

 

[Mate Dave]

3 seeds look to be viable, germination is 4 x as slow on these as was my Blueberry.. We will see what happens over the next few weeks.. I may complain to Sensi as all their seeds grow shitty..

 

[MJPassion]

Sounds like a fun reciprocal project ya have going here Mate Dave.
I'll hang out and watch the happenings from the side lines.


That Fruity Juice (previously Juicy Fruit) is some wonderful buds all on it's own. There's a Juicy Fruit cut floating around Colorado that I'd like to get hold of again and put it back into my project to strengthen the Thai side of things in the progeny. It tasted exactly like Juicy Fruit gum!

 

[handshake]

Woohoo! This sounds like a fun project!

That Fruity Juice (previously Juicy Fruit) is some wonderful buds all on it's own. There's a Juicy Fruit cut floating around Colorado that I'd like to get hold of again and put it back into my project to strengthen the Thai side of things in the progeny. It tasted exactly like Juicy Fruit gum!

Sounds exactly like the Juicy Fruit cut that was floating around in the 90's in BC, too, and had a yellow-y tinge to it... some amazing smoke!