If Prop 19 Fails

[Tony Aroma]

It occurred to me that if prop 19 fails to pass this November, that the legalization movement should adopt an "if you can't beat them, join them" strategy. In other words, forget about legalizing cannabis and concentrate on criminalizing alcohol. We (many of us) want the two drugs to be treated similarly, so if cannabis can't be legal why not make alcohol illegal?

I have a feeling that an alcohol prohibition initiative might actually gain a following. All the same scare tactics used against cannabis legalization could be used to support alcohol prohibition. Much of it would even be true if referring to alcohol. And it's pretty obvious that the first go around with alcohol prohibition taught most people absolutely nothing. Just because it didn't work in the 1920s doesn't mean the exact same thing won't work now. So why not try it again?

What do you say? Let's eliminate the devil's brew from our society once and for all!

 

[Hazelnuts]

I really hope I'm not supposed to take this seriously (pretty sure about that, actually). If I am though, that's a really hypocritical position to take. You can't really be against the bullshit the government does for weed but think it's OK to do it when it comes to alcohol just because you prefer weed. As I said though, I believe this thread is satire so you can just ignore this post if that's the case.

 

[midwestHIGHS]

idk man y would to wrongs make a right?

 

[dgr]

self-inflicted divide and conquer?

 

[Grimr3efer]

What....Prop 19 fails.... NEVER!!!!

 

[Grimr3efer]

What....Prop 19 fails.... NEVER!!!!

 

[headstone]

I think what tony is saying is that if they want to keep us criminals, lets make them criminals too.

If thats the case then I'm all for it. Alcohol causes far too many issues in society and compared to prohibition days there are far less people home brewing. These days its all about the home grown so if alcohol prohibition comes in we'll be primed to take right over

Think about this for a minute, if alcohol prohibition were to come in and cannabis took over, how long do you think it would take for the prohibition of both drugs came to end?

ps: nice avatar tony

 

[amannamedtruth]

I see your point, but being one who is against any prohibition on personal substance possession, production, and consumption, this is not a valid approach. Perhaps emphasizing more about the dangers of alcohol, like the SAFER campaign.

 

[igrowone]

i don't fault the thought, but the reality is that alcohol prohibition is not going to happen
if 19 fails, we pick up the pieces and try to get some positives, not sure what those would be
i think the vote will be quite close in a defeat, which will make it the closest to legalization we've been
if nothing else, it should present a warning to anti MJ forces, this is going to happen
when you can put a bit of fear in them, some bargain may be possible

 

[purple_man]

high all!

screw that bro! it is that sort of "mentality" that led to all different types of "laws n regulations" (war on drugs being a part of it all...). like someone stated above 2 wrongs do not add up to be right... (no diss/pun/etc. intended).

ps.: you really feel like asking "pupa state" to "punish" the other "kids" too? (just kiddin bro!)

blessss

 

[desertdweller]

Right idea, wrong drug, nicotine should be a schedule I drug, it has no medical benefits other than being a poison(used in colonial time for this reason) it causes lung disease, COPD, emphasemia and other lung diseases. And it is highly, highly addictive. It is much better to wear a nicotine patch for life and not smoke cigarettes to get a nicotine dose. I have told my wife for years when marijuana is legal, i will stop smoking cigarettes. she says medical marijuana is close enough for her

I now have to eat my words, I have wore a nicotine patch for the past year, my doctor thinks i am crazy, but we both agree, it is better than smoke in the lungs

 

[el Dream Reader]

I'm not keen on the idea, the detrimental effects of alcohol on the body shows that our bodies treat alcohol as a toxin. Cannabis shouldn't be compared to alcohol, tobacco or narcotics period. While the intoxicating effects of cannabis is obvious, the only detrimental effect to out bodies is if the plant matter is combusted and inhaled, even potato chips and french fries that were fried in oil until crispy have shown that the chemical reaction creates a carcinogenic substance. I believe we should be comparing cannabis to dietary supplements like gingko and ginseng, comparing cannabis to real drugs should have never happened.

 

[subrob]

i wouldnt hate life if i woke up tom and both the killer poisins were no more! of course, ive finally outgrown bangin drunk 21 year old socali girls(translates to-ive finally gotten so old even the drunk 21 year old cali girls wont bang me anymore!)

 

[Ironeek]

Interesting idea. Seriously interesting idea.

 

[Tuggo]

I like the idea. Two wrongs might not make something right, but it would probably open a lot of eyes.

 

[Lazyman]

Interesting thread, I love this site SO much for it's open exchange of ideas.

I don't think 19 will pass, it never had the 65% approval ratings it would need to eventually pass anyway, but that's just THIS iteration.

In my opinion, California deserves better than Prop 19. We will have another chance at a better bill, probably within the next five years. The house just approved the decriminalization bill, going to the Governator's desk for signature now!

 

[StellarP]

So... if this prop fails Cali will be stuck in the "stoned ages" (pun) with just the medical marijuana statutes. That sucks... Oh wait the majority of us dont have medical.

The issue seems to be whether alcohol, tobacco, or cannabis, the government needs to get the Fook out. Really they just want their cut.(taxes) Think of it as protection money.

Cheers
StellarP

 

[Tony Aroma]

I think what tony is saying is that if they want to keep us criminals, lets make them criminals too.

...

Think about this for a minute, if alcohol prohibition were to come in and cannabis took over, how long do you think it would take for the prohibition of both drugs came to end?

BINGO!!!! All's fair in love and (the drug) war.

Generally speaking, the people who support prohibition are the ones who are not affected by it. The minute it starts infringing on THEIR freedom, I'd bet big money they'd change their tune.

BTW headstone, that person in your avatar looks strangely familiar.

 

[Chimera]

There is no honour in imposing hardships on someone else because harships have been imposed on you.

The real issue is about freedom of choice for adults, and not having someone else tying to control your life..... I'm sure there is a clause in your constitution about freedom to life and liberty and the pursuit of happiness? I am not an american, so excuse me if I missed the line about attempting to remove another's freedom's because sombody removed yours.

Less choice is a step backwards... whether you believe in the right to consume alcohol or not.
IMO people should be trying to restore freedoms once held by all, a not trying to further restrict people's freedoms... hasn't there been enough of that in the past decade in the US? Do you really desire less freedom, less choice?
That's a slippery slope to be on....

Respectfully,
-Chimera

 

[JackTheGrower]

Pass or fail Prop 19 is not the end of the road.

First Prop 19 puts poor folks who rent when their land owners say no to a garden in a position to only buy so the poorest folks are the ones most disadvantaged by Prop 19.
The Rich man who owns property can have a garden.
The Poor who do not own property can buy cannabis. They may be the least able to afford legal cannabis and so the Black Market will be strong.

One Citizen can afford to buy and doesn't have to and one cannot but will be forced to buy..

Prop 19 can not be the end of the road.

Just because this was easy with some cannabis millionaire paying for the political action that CCI couldn't get volunteer folks to do for free, doesn't mean that Prop 19 is the best thing for California.

So pass prop 19 then we work from there. Fail prop 19 and we work from there.
Anyone thinking this is over because you are allowed to buy cannabis if a damn fool.

Under prop 19 you cannot grow out 100 plants to find the right Pheno for breeding as a ordinary citizen.
That means only corporations can breed your weed.. And Government has the right to regulate.

So there may be a G-13 and a G-2 and G-3 and a so on and all of them approved by the Government. I have a problem with Government engineered/approved weed

Do you want something a corporation or Government approves of or do you want what is the best cannabis grown by free cannabis growers?

Prop 19 by limiting common folks from growing out plants in spaces larger than 5x5 is instituting a form of Prohibition.

Think about it.. We have come this far do we want to give up on freedom now that we are a majority demographic.

Often the first deal you get in a negotiation is not the best deal possible.
Take a look at prop 19. 2 things stand out that are very Prohibitionist. First Individuals cannot have a garden of their own unless it is the only one on a qualified piece of land and 2 you cannot legally have a large breeding program as an ordinary citizen.
No growing out plants to breed The Prized Plant that you can enter in the State Fair next year Brother!

But I would guess the Cannabis Budweiser equivalent will be at the State Fair you can buy.

So it may be true that Prop 19 is a stepping Stone on the road but once big Canna-Industry has a hold do you think they will fund a new campaign to change the Canna-Rules against themselves?

If having gardens larger than 5x5 and for all people was such a bad thing it couldn't be in prop 19 do you think the Lee group will donate 2 million for another run at it in 2012?

Do the Alcohol Industrialists say we should make parking lots for bars illegal?

The answer to both is no way.

Once prop 19 passes more freedom will depend on people who didn't stand up for the Legalizing initiative CCI in the first place.
Those that waited until it was free and easy to sign the petition rather than volunteering to gather signatures for free..

So thinking that Prop 19 is the end if it doesn't pass is very disturbing. We need to fear more that Prop 19 is the end if it does pass.

Any system that allows some to grow and sell thousands of pounds of cannabis while making developing the family strain a crime is an unfair system.

At no time in our American history has taking a plant we use and improving it by ordinary people been a crime until Prop 19 when said plant is supposed to be Legal as Prop 19 tells us it will be.
Just grow out 100 plants and see how free you are if you are not a corporation.

So by all means vote! But don't wimp out on us after the vote one way or the other.

You personally may not need the right to practice Horticulture with Cannabis but your Grand Children might so selling things short now is a limp and lame as any coward can be.

Let us not be so selfish that we sign away rights to practice Horticulture with all plants as a free people.
Let us have all the garden we want where we can.
Landlords always have had contracts. Nothing is new in that.. But the idea that Prop 19 puts a third party in charge is wrong.
Just ask Black folks what the Right to Vote did for them under Jim Crow laws and you can see what poor people face growing some weed on the cheap.

We have a right as human beings to grow crops and improve them. Prop 19 limits us and especially the poor to mostly buying whatever is on a shelf some place.

...

Just a thought guys.. I mean when have we ever been more powerful? Some say we need to make prop 19 happen or else.. I say it is just the Beginning and Prop 19 is a power grab.

Would you spend two million dollars to cause Cannabis change if it wasn't going to make you 20 million?

So do vote.. The way Prop 19 fails, like I have been posting about for a year, is that low voter turn out happens.
That is a real possibility in an off presidential election year.
I told the Lee group 2012 was a better time.

I will say it once more "GET A VOTE BUDDY AND MAKE SURE THEY GET A VOTE BUDDY and so on.

It would humorous that the very thing that got Prop 19 on the ballot alone is what will cause it not to pass.. Low Voter Participation.

Maybe money can't buy everything politically.

We cannot stop at prop 19 pass or fail..

If you accept that then come what may we will still be on track to 2012.

Get up Stand up for your Rights.