I need to run a 400w grow on my friend's bedroom electrical circuit

[SensimillaWolf]

I searched briefly for answers, and learned a little but I thought I should just ask and not risk big mistakes.

On the wall panel in this particular house, there is a "200" on the main breaker (maximum amps?), and then the various circuits are listed below. Corresponding with the smaller breakers are the house owner's labels for each, bathroom, bedroom, AC, etc.

Before I do anything I'm going to see which circuit is the bedroom in question, because one breaker has a "30" on it and is for the AC and one bedroom, and the other bedroom has a "15" breaker.

Does this mean I can most likely only run 15 amps for all bedroom and grow-related electronics?

Can I just flip the breakers to test which bedroom they go with by seeing which room's electronics turn off?

There is only one socket in the bedroom, and it is a two prong outlet. I want to try and convert it to a three prong for safety reasons, and I saw a video online where a guy pulled out the socket and connected a ground wire that was inside to a new, ground acceptable three prong outlet. Am I making sense here, or is this out of my league? I will not take any chances with this house which is owned by a good friend.

It seemed easy but I'm not going to risk burning a house down b/c of an ungrounded socket, just to grow six or seven ounces.

Here's the breakdown of what will be in the room:
400w HPS, digital ballast
stanley blower
rubbermaid veg cab running CFLs plus computer fan, less than 150w total
small air pump for oxygenating water
phone charger, alarm clock, other small accessories (expendable)
TV (expendable)

thanks for listening folks

 

[Dr Dog]

so you are planning on using a tote?

If that is the case, you will need to keep your heat down, cfls still generate heat, and will be hard to manage.

So the bedroom has no grounded receptacles there now? Well if the wire running to the outlet is not wire grounded system, then adding a new box with a ground is not going to do anything

whats the tv for

 

[PrinSeshJasmine]

.

 

[SensimillaWolf]

I'm not sure how old the house is.

Dr Dog-
Im not sure if I explained my setup correctly. The CFLs and computer fan are in the veg cab, and it works very well without overheating. If needed I could move these 150w to another room, but I would much prefer to have all grow items in the bedroom.

I am hoping when I take the two-prong receptacle off the wall, I will see what was described in the video I saw... a hot wire, a neutral, and a ground wrapped around them. I found a grounded outlet! Its strange looking, sideways and in the living room. Does this imply I will have the ability to convert the wall outlets to grounded receptacles?

The 400 HPS will be in a hydrohut.

The TV is for casual watching and is obviously not necessary.

Prinsesh-

How can I find out if it's 120 or 240? I would be shocked if it was not the house's original electrical system.

Is it risky to have my setup plugged into a surge protector, then an extension cord extending from the bedroom to the grounded outlet in the living room?

 

[PharmaCan]

I'm just curious why you think an ungrounded socket might burn your house down? The ground is for safety, to keep you from getting shocked. It has nothing to do with keeping things from burning down - that comes from following basic wiring standards and using good sense. If you try plugging all of your gear into a bunch of cheap extension cords or power strips you are going to be creating a fire hazard, regardless of if the receptacle is grounded or not.

You need to take the receptacle out of the box to see if there is a ground wire inside. Then you can decide whether to install a grounded receptacle or not. But, you don't necessarily need a grounded receptacle to do what you want to do.

The best way to see what is on that circuit is to turn all the other breakers off then see which receptacles and which lights still work. Once you figure out what all is on that breaker, determine the load - number of amps from everything on the circuit. Don't exceed 12 amps if you are using the 15 amp circuit.

PC

 

[SensimillaWolf]

thank you for your help. I will systematically test the breakers and the corresponding outlets.

The main point of my original post was that I am uninformed on what is a fire hazard and what is not.

Is is hazardous to plug my digital ballast, my outtake blower, and an oscillating fan into a surge protector, then extension cord it to the grounded living room socket?

that would free the bedroom socket for reasonable use and I would not worry about plugging in multiple units.

 

[Dr Dog]

Is is hazardous to plug my digital ballast, my outtake blower, and an oscillating fan into a surge protector, then extension cord it to the grounded living room socket?

YES
and would probably be tripping your breaker all the time, especially lights on time

 

[PharmaCan]

Go to a home improvement store and buy a heavy duty extension cord with #12 wire inside, the shortest one that will work for what you want, and a heavy duty multiple-plug adapter for the female end. There's nothing wrong with extension cords, you just can't use that cheap shit you buy at the grocery store.

PC

 

[madpenguin]

Not specifically trying to argue with you PC but I've burned up a 12/3 "Yellow Jacket" extension cord from lowes. The really expensive heavy duty ones? One 600w on a timer did it. Completely melted the female end of the cord and destroyed my timer.

Extension cords are for temporary use only. When you start using them to extend a branch circuit in the manner you describe, your rolling the dice.

If you do find out that the bedroom receptacle box does not have a ground wire, code allows you to install a GFCI receptacle in order to make things "right". But yes, the presence, or lack thereof, of a grounding wire does not pose a fire hazard, however..... The lack of a grounding wire will make it extremely hard for most florescent ballasts to properly fire, if they do at all.

 

[PharmaCan]

Not specifically trying to argue with you PC but I've burned up a 12/3 "Yellow Jacket" extension cord from lowes. The really expensive heavy duty ones? One 600w on a timer did it. Completely melted the female end of the cord and destroyed my timer.

Extension cords are for temporary use only. When you start using them to extend a branch circuit in the manner you describe, your rolling the dice.

Oh humbug! lol

I've built entire houses using extension cords. I've put them through heavy-duty trials for many years.

So now we have two cases of anecdotal information, neither of which account for squat when it comes to the reality of the matter.

A prudent person would check their extension cord, especially a new one, for heat build up and replace a defective cord long before it melts down. Every situation in life doesn't fit into a perfect little paradigm and sometimes people have to adapt to do the things they want. I'm one of the most anal people you could ever hope to meet, so I can appreciate your avid desire to see everything done to perfection. However, people will go to great lengths to get their grows going and I think, in some cases, it's more important to help them safely achieve their goals than to lecture them about every little thing that could possibly go wrong.

In any event, the OP proposed a temporary use of an extension cord - albeit that his "temporary" could be an extended period of time.

Just my - now we're up to $.04

PC

 

[SensimillaWolf]

so,

if there's a ground wire inside the receptacle, change to a three prong receptacle. If there's no ground wire, install a GFCI receptacle. If I can't install a GFCI receptacle, test the growtent system with a quality extension cord to a grounded circuit. If there is no heat buildup, get started on the grow.

 

[madpenguin]

so,

if there's a ground wire inside the receptacle, change to a three prong receptacle.

yep

If there's no ground wire, install a GFCI receptacle.

Sure, but it's not completely and totally necessary. Just safer for you.

If I can't install a GFCI receptacle, test the growtent system with a quality extension cord to a grounded circuit. If there is no heat buildup, get started on the grow.

Um...... That's up to you. :wink:

 

[SensimillaWolf]

ok thanks everybody

 

[Dr Dog]

Oh humbug! lol

I've built entire houses using extension cords. I've put them through heavy-duty trials for many years.

So now we have two cases of anecdotal information, neither of which account for squat when it comes to the reality of the matter.

A prudent person would check their extension cord, especially a new one, for heat build up and replace a defective cord long before it melts down. Every situation in life doesn't fit into a perfect little paradigm and sometimes people have to adapt to do the things they want. I'm one of the most anal people you could ever hope to meet, so I can appreciate your avid desire to see everything done to perfection. However, people will go to great lengths to get their grows going and I think, in some cases, it's more important to help them safely achieve their goals than to lecture them about every little thing that could possibly go wrong.

In any event, the OP proposed a temporary use of an extension cord - albeit that his "temporary" could be an extended period of time.

Just my - now we're up to $.04

PC

I dont see how a heavy duty extension cord would burn up either

I would guess it was still rolled up and heated on itself, but you should never use a 50' cord for a 10' run

 

[PharmaCan]

I dont see how a heavy duty extension cord would burn up either

I would guess it was still rolled up and heated on itself, but you should never use a 50' cord for a 10' run

It's not the wire that usually fails, it's the connections. In Madpenguin's example, the end melted - probably due to faulty connections between the wires and the female cord end (female plug). It can happen. While MP is completely right in what he has said about extension cord use, there are other factors that should be taken into consideration.

First of all, we're either looking at an old house or a house that was built with no regard for electrical codes. A single receptacle in a bedroom doesn't conform with any code requirements I've ever seen. In residential construction, receptacles are required every 12 (or so) feet. I don't know if this is NEC or local codes, but any way you cut it one receptacle in a bedroom is either antique or chicken-shit wiring. If you think about it, any builder who is so cheap as to put only one receptacle in a bedroom probably is not going to dedicate a circuit to just that one receptacle. So one has to wonder what else might be feeding off that 15 amp breaker.

Secondly, over the years that one bedroom receptacle has probably been loaded to the max, thereby creating excess heat in the wires. Vintage wire insulation gets brittle with age under normal circumstances. With excess heat it tends to just crumble off the wire when it is moved. I'd just as soon the OP leave the house wiring alone. If he messes with the wires in that box and the insulation crumbles off, he's then got exposed wires in the box and that opens up a whole different (and expensive) can of worms.

The main panel in that house was upgraded at some point. One has to wonder what electrical problems, if any, existed that prompted the upgrade. Without being able to look at the house, it's impossible to know.

All things considered, I think it's better for someone with no electrical knowledge whatsoever to leave the house wiring alone and use quality extension cords to distribute their load. In my opinion, it's much safer in the long run.

PC

 

[SensimillaWolf]

I found another socket in the bedroom, and it's grounded. Hidden below a shelf, I was just too tall to see it. My girlfriend walked into the bedroom, saw it immediately and smacked me for not looking around the room from a different perspective...

moral of the story, cool your jets and plan well before you light up a grow, be patient and spend time looking for alternatives before you cut up your friend's electrical sockets. I had the most simple solution just staring at my waist.

Wish me luck everyone, may the DSD reach for the sky