How much difference should I see...

[Wiimote]

between a 150 and a 400w lighting system? I know there are a gazillion variables, but a ball park answer is all I am looking for.

Some details:
Last run with this plant (bagseed clone) I got approx 80g under a 150w HPS security light using Jack's Classic All purpose ferts (20/20/20) for veg and Shultz's bloom (10/60/10) for flower.

Using a clone of that plant, now under a 430w HydroFarm Sunburst (160 CFM inline fan for aircooling) and using Technaflora nutes (BC Boost, BC Grow, BC Bloom, etc)

Temps are slightly lower with the air cooling (65 at night 82 during lights on currently, compared with 65 at night and 85 with lights on previously), but other than the lighting and ferts, everything else is the same as the previous runs. The inline fan changes the air (mathmatically) 2.5 times per minute, but knowing how manufacturers fudge numbers, realistically prob only 2 times per minute. Soil is a 50/50 mix of perlite and cheap non-ferted soil (with 1.5 tbsp dolomite lime added per gal)

So, how much difference (especially in tightness as last run a 8in cola only weighed in at 3g) should I be seeing this run?

P.S. if you need any further info to give me a ball park answer, just ask

 

[jojajico]

between a 150 and a 400w lighting system? I know there are a gazillion variables, but a ball park answer is all I am looking for.

Some details:
Last run with this plant (bagseed clone) I got approx 80g under a 150w HPS security light using Jack's Classic All purpose ferts (20/20/20) for veg and Shultz's bloom (10/60/10) for flower.

Using a clone of that plant, now under a 430w HydroFarm Sunburst (160 CFM inline fan for aircooling) and using Technaflora nutes (BC Boost, BC Grow, BC Bloom, etc)

Temps are slightly lower with the air cooling (65 at night 82 during lights on currently, compared with 65 at night and 85 with lights on previously), but other than the lighting and ferts, everything else is the same as the previous runs. The inline fan changes the air (mathmatically) 2.5 times per minute, but knowing how manufacturers fudge numbers, realistically prob only 2 times per minute. Soil is a 50/50 mix of perlite and cheap non-ferted soil (with 1.5 tbsp dolomite lime added per gal)

So, how much difference (especially in tightness as last run a 8in cola only weighed in at 3g) should I be seeing this run?

P.S. if you need any further info to give me a ball park answer, just ask

well u should see denser nugs and a greater yeild i mean uve got double the watts. im not really sure what your wondering. i mean you can yeild alot under a 400W more than enough for personal smoke. there will be a learning curve but i think ull be happy with the upgrade.

 

[Wiimote]

Basically, I wondering if this run will come closer to what I consider "normal" tightness. A 8in long, 3in diameter cola should weigh a heck of a lot more than 3g by past (purchased) experience.

Also, I've noticed a lot of pics here (and always in comm bags) the buds are more of a rectangle type shape (longer and wider than thick) where mine all come out more like a cylinder (more conical then a cylindrical but you get the idea) and was wondering if the lighting switch would remedy that (to tell you the truth, I don't care what shape they are as long as the tightness gets to an acceptable level, as I want to get my reading experience turned into real-world experience before I drop a ton of $ on beans)

 

[aeric]

Yes it should be better in that department. Tightness is also a matter of genetics and temps. Lower those temps to at least 78 but even 72 and you will see a major increase in "tightness". The "diff" between day and night temps is also a factor. Basically the less a difference, the less stretch. Low 65-68 and high 72 will produce nice buds on almost anything. Certain Indicas are tight no matter what u do, Sativas the opposite. Excessive ammonia Nitrogen in the first 2 weeks of flo especially will also cause more stretch....this is why heat = stretch, because heat increases N uptake.

 

[suckerrepellent]

assuming you keep all of your other variables the same (temp, nutes, soil etc) then there is no reason not to expect both higher yields and higher quality. considering the amount of light recieved is about the largest factor in yield and bud formation, it is completely reasonable to expect higher yields and quality. being able to maximize your lumen output over that same sized area will make a dramatic difference, from the top cola to the lower buds. something you might want to consider, is a digital 600w system. these ballasts have very low amp requirements (less than 5/system) relative to the lumen production, and the electronic ballast technology helps quite a bit in heat reduction. of course this is only if a new light purchase is within your means. the point of differential is important as well. the closer you can keep nightime and daytime temps as stated above, the less strecth you will see. this means that your internodes will tend to stack much closer, which in turn will lead to the formation of closer set, denser buds. also, remeber that the distance your plants are from the lights creates a dramtic dropoff in efficiency the further away you move. it is essential that whatever size light you use, you make your best effort to create an environment in which you cna put your light as close to the plants as possible without making the area too hot or burning the top of your buds (avoid this by not only measuring your rooms temperature, but the temperature at the top of your canopy.

 

[SEEDYNONO]

i find that a lot of commerical herb is just squished into little dense nuggies.. doesn't always seem like it just grow that way.

 

[Wiimote]

My last run, I got approx 4.5 zips from 3 plants under 2 150w (security lamp) side by side. I used Jack's Classic for veg and Shultz for flower (in soil). Buds were very airy and loose. Like I said before, a 8in cola weighed 3g. My gpw was ok at around .5, and it was very good smoke for bagseed, but was just so fluffy it kind of ruined it.

So I changed the system a bit. Same space (5ft x 2ft x 6ft closet), 430w Hydrofarm Sunburst (160cfm inline for air cooling, ducted out of closet), Technaflora nutes (BC Grow, BC Boost, etc from starter pack), everything else is the same. I currently have 3 flowering. Two are 5 weeks in (clones) and one is just under a week (also a clone). I also have 2 seedlings going. All tips are between 8in and 12in from the light. The top of the soil for all plants is right at 20in. (for now, I may have to raise the light). So according to the foot candle chart that is all over this forum, I think I am ok. Sadly I don't have all of the light available being used yet, but what is in there should be in near prime light.

I'm not real concerned whether the yeild is increased, I would be happy if the yeild stayed around the .5gpw area, because I am currently working with bagseed and trying to apply all I have read here. I know my yeilds will go up over time as I get good genetics and hone my craft. I am just hoping to work on getting a more pleasing (to me anyway) product.

 

[jojajico]

My last run, I got approx 4.5 zips from 3 plants under 2 150w (security lamp) side by side. I used Jack's Classic for veg and Shultz for flower (in soil). Buds were very airy and loose. Like I said before, a 8in cola weighed 3g. My gpw was ok at around .5, and it was very good smoke for bagseed, but was just so fluffy it kind of ruined it.

So I changed the system a bit. Same space (5ft x 2ft x 6ft closet), 430w Hydrofarm Sunburst (160cfm inline for air cooling, ducted out of closet), Technaflora nutes (BC Grow, BC Boost, etc from starter pack), everything else is the same. I currently have 3 flowering. Two are 5 weeks in (clones) and one is just under a week (also a clone). I also have 2 seedlings going. All tips are between 8in and 12in from the light. The top of the soil for all plants is right at 20in. (for now, I may have to raise the light). So according to the foot candle chart that is all over this forum, I think I am ok. Sadly I don't have all of the light available being used yet, but what is in there should be in near prime light.

I'm not real concerned whether the yeild is increased, I would be happy if the yeild stayed around the .5gpw area, because I am currently working with bagseed and trying to apply all I have read here. I know my yeilds will go up over time as I get good genetics and hone my craft. I am just hoping to work on getting a more pleasing (to me anyway) product.

.5 gpw for your first grow (i think it sur first grow) is pretty damn good man. just try to apply all that youve learened and u should get close if not hit 1 gpw.

 

[Prone_2_Clone]

with that light you will see a huge increase in densness of nugs. also have you heard of a product called carboblast. i have just recently started using this but have seen great results so far.

 

[suckerrepellent]

another bud loader that i have tried (and liked compared to the control group) is the humbolt county's own gravity. i think the test group out did the control by approx. 11%. if your yielding 300 grams thats pretty significant.

 

[Wiimote]

jojajico: the last run was my first successfull run. So I consider it a great success. I know there are many pros here that would scoff at .5gpw but I'm easy to please I guess

As far as bud loaders, I haven't tried any yet (I do plan on getting some blackstrap molasses sometime this weekend). I don't want to change too much at a time, and seeing as I changed the nutes and lighting this run, I figure I'll need some time to dial this in before I make any more changes. However, the next change I am planning is to get an order from Gypsy. The problem with that is finding a safe way of getting the order here. I think I have a solution though.

 

[jojajico]

jojajico: the last run was my first successfull run. So I consider it a great success. I know there are many pros here that would scoff at .5gpw but I'm easy to please I guess

As far as bud loaders, I haven't tried any yet (I do plan on getting some blackstrap molasses sometime this weekend). I don't want to change too much at a time, and seeing as I changed the nutes and lighting this run, I figure I'll need some time to dial this in before I make any more changes. However, the next change I am planning is to get an order from Gypsy. The problem with that is finding a safe way of getting the order here. I think I have a solution though.

no one would scoff at at .5gpw for your first succesful grow. especially if you didnt use any "budloaders" as you called them. the learning curve is really sharp for growing your second will be alot better than your first. ur doing great.

 

[Wiimote]

Thanks. That means a lot. I know I screwed up a few times (mag def, burned tips, calc def, etc) so I know there is a lot of room for improvement. I'm starting to get confident enough to order from Gypsy, I just didn't want to drop $ into real beans and waste them ($50 to gypsy isn't a lot but $ is $). I'm just trying to get enough out of this to get me and 2-3 friends out of the "market" (rule #1 strictly enforced of course) and i think having real beans as opposed to bagseed will help a lot. Especially since it will give me good way to compare my results to other mroe experienced growers.

 

[suckerrepellent]

no one would scoff at at .5gpw for your first succesful grow. especially if you didnt use any "budloaders" as you called them. the learning curve is really sharp for growing your second will be alot better than your first. ur doing great.

im by no means a seasoned vet, but i agree with the call that the learning curve is sharp. the differences you will see just from experience will be more dramatic than the nutes for sure. just dialing everything in that much more will make a dramatic difference. i know it did for me to the tune of at least one and a half times the yield.