How long until additioanl nodes appear

[Ekras]

Hey guys,

so my plants are 2 weeks oldish now.... how long until they start growing more leaves besides their starter, and baby leaves? On one plant I have a second set coming out of the same node, but nothing else along the stem.... Thanks!

 

[Guest]

oldish.......like from when you dropped the beans in soil/water or 2 weeks since establishing a seedling?
What lights and how far away are they?

 

[Ekras]

Since they sprouted.... 400 Watt HPS bulb about 2 feet above the plants.

 

[Dave_the_stoner]

The second set of leaves coming from the same node, is gonna turn into branches. dont worry, the 7 leaf clovers are coming, they re much luckier than the 4 leaf clovers.
Peace

 

[Ekras]

Here's a pic if it helps

 

[Kitty]

Those plants don't seem to be doing much of anything they should be much farther along after two weeks of vegging. What type of soil are you using? If the soil is too moist you may have drowned them.

 

[Maj.PotHead]

Here's a pic if it helps

really hard to say what type soil r/they in ??
how often and how much do you water ???
what are your temps ???

i believe i read in another of your posts your lighting is 400w hps ???

for a seedling approx 2wks old they sure are quite small they should least be 3-4inch tall and have 1 finger leaves out . i would step back and examine the grow erea and what your doing, if your in the US and live by a walmart they sell a growlight advertised as lol its a 2ft singel bulb fluro 9.99$ 17w bulb 1 or 2 work great for starting seedlings out 2-4inch above plants

 

[Guest]

Youy have serious problems. My seedlings were that big at 2 days old.

I suspect your soilmix is the problem. However, why is your light so far away? mine is a 400 and I never had it more than 1 foot away. Do you have poor ventilation, and therefore heat issues? Why starve a seedling of light? It is utter nonsense that a seedling can't handle intense light. Heat is a problem, but never light.

The frigging sun is infinitely brighter than a 400 watt light will ever hope to be.

All that said, I bet your problem is soil related. What EXACTLY is in your soil? Who made it? Any added perlite. Any added lime? pH of water and runoff if you know it?

Obli

 

[Ekras]

I think I do -- my soil is a mix of Potting Soil, Peat, bloodmeal and bonemeal... thats it.

My plants just don't seem to grow past that. Heat isnt much of an issue - plenty of ventelation -- i've tried putting stuff closer to no effect.... Any ideas?

I moved it to a little more than 1/2 foot from the light -- what the hell cant hurt to try.... well yeah it can...but no more so than they are already hurting.

What else do you suggest?

How often do you water your plants when they are that age?

 

[teddybud]

try using party cups or something with less soil... looks like way to much soil for the size of the seedling...

 

[Truth]

you can average a new node every few days in hydro, soil may be a bit slower than this. but you are definitely far behind where you should be.

 

[Ekras]

I dunno what else to try....maybe new soil or mixtures..... any suggestions on what works best that can be purchased at Home Depot?

 

[Dave_the_stoner]

You do have a real problem, first off what type of lighting are you using? You say they have plenty of ventelation, this is a tough one.
The only times I have had plants grow that slow it was a problem with low light (I tried using a couple energy savers and all it did was sustain life at 3-4 inches), and then again when I thought I had reasonable ventalation, but the air was just recirculating in my cardboard box of an apartment (the plants stopped growing at about 2 feet)
Shit this is a tough problem to figure out without actually seeing the growing environment. Possibly shitty genetics???

 

[Ekras]

Very possibly shitty genetics....this grow is to get the "kinks" out of my system before I germ good seeds (which are at least 20 days away assuming they even arrive)

Ventilation is fine- 2 doors to the grow area, one of which is right next to a window outside. Both rooms are open durring the "daylight" period. I've moved the lighting to 18/6 yesterday to see if that helps.

 

[Guest]

I dunno what else to try....maybe new soil or mixtures..... any suggestions on what works best that can be purchased at Home Depot?

Ok my friend, lets see what we can do to get you going.

First, those seedlings may be doomed. We will see shortly. just be prepared to start over. That said...your soil mix is the problem IMO.

I think it is too acidic from the peat you added. And, I suspect it is too "heavy" or too "dense"....and these types of soils do not drain well. They stay wet too long. Weed, like many plants, does NOT like heavy, poor draining soils.

You should begin seedlings in a 'light" soil, a soil that will drain very readily when you water (more on watering in a minute). If you have no previous gardening experience, go to HD and buy a bag of Miracle Grow seed starting mix and a small bag of Miracle Grow perlite. HD doesn't sell dolomite lime, but many nurseries do, especially if they cater to organic folks. Get some dolomite lime. You won't need it for seedlings but you will later on when you transplant up. May as well get it now if possible.

I use a plastic coffee "can" as a scoop and measuring thang. Just so happens to be like .9 gallons...close enough. Miracle grow seed starting mix is OK to use as is. However, I think you can improve it by mixing in more perlite. So mix in more perlite at a 3:1 ration ..that is: 3 gallons(scoops, whatever) of potting soil with 1 gallon(scoop, etc.) of perlite. This will improve drainage considerably because it lightens up the soil. Perlite is inert. It provides more pathways through the soil for water to drain. And then it provides more air spaces, if you will, for oxygen. Roots will like that, especially new roots.

Think about it. If you were a new, tiny, struggling hair of a root which is more appealing?
1) Fighting your way through a DENSE, waterlogged, compacted, oxygen poor soil..... OR
2) Winding your way easily through a light, moist, oxygen rich soil

After you get it mixed fill your new pots( the size they are in now is a little large to start in, but it'll do for now) with it and thoroughly water. Set the pots aside and let drain for 10 minutes or so.

This is the critical part and you need to be careful. Take a spoon and use it like a miniture shovel and VERY carefully and very gently scoop your seedling out of its currrent pot. The idea is you want to save, INTACT, whatever roots it may have developed. I'm guess that you won't have roots out much further than 1-2 inches. You'll have to just start out at maybe 2 inches and see. When you see how much soil you will have to take with the seedling, then you'll see how big a hole you will need in the new pot. Scoop it out.

Set you seedling in it and GENTLY firm the soil in place. You ain't packing this soil for a roadbed!! Don't compact it. Watering will settle it enough. The soil is already wet, but just just gently trickle a few tablespoons around the stem area so the soil around the seedling will 'marry" with the new pot's soil.

Watering. I water in this situation like this:

You need to be a bit careful watering soil with generous amouts of perlite. If you pour water on your seedling too quickly, that light soil might "boil up" and uproot your seedling. Remember, your seedling doesn't have much for roots right now. It has very little to support itself in the soil. You need to water very slowly, keeping fingers of one hand ready to keep soil and seedling in place if the plant wants to "float" out of place...meaning you're probably watering too quickly

Now you are transplanted and watered. Set them under your light as close as you can. The rule of thumb is close as you can without it being uncomfortable for your hand to be there for 1 minute. You say ventilation is no problem. You should be able to get that light within 8-10 inches. THAT INTENSE LIGHT WILL NOT HURT YOUR SEEDLINGS...BUT HEAT WILL.

When to water again? Learn to feel how much your plant weighs in its pot when wet...somewhat heavy. It will lighten up over time. Pick them up every day. Look at the soil o top. Scratch in around edges away from any possible roots. Learn how it feels and how heavy it is as the pot dries out.

I suspect you will not need to water for 4-5 days. Your plant got stressed a bit being transplanted and wasn't doing well anyway. It won't use much water right off. A lot will be evaporated by your light, fans etc. You need to keep an eye on it during the first week or so. Water when it looks and feels dry on the surface AND feels fairly light. IMO maybe err on the side of watering a day sooner rather than later in this situation. You don't want the new forming roots to go too dry. Your light, well draining soil will allow you to get away with watering sooner. Excess water drains off and air/O2 will get to roots soon enough.

No Nutes until your plants have a root system healthy enough to handle them. At a guess, maybe 2 weeks hence? Your plants will "tell" you if it is sooner. My advice is better under nuted than over nuted. Much easier to feed a plant than undo the damage from burning one. Speaking of burning a plant ....I'm getting cramps from typing. I hope this helps, im gonna burn a bud from one of mine that I had to cut because the buds are so heavy my plants are wanting to fall over!

Cheers
Obli

PS
I'd do 24/7 lights. That's another myth that plants need to a dark or "rest" period.



See all that perlite in there? Clear cups are nice cause you can see whats going on. Indoor lights DO NOT harm roots. IMO, it would be educational for some folk to grow in clear containers. They would see how their plants roots system grows, what it likes and doesn't like, when it gets rootbound, etc. etc.

Click to enlarge

 

[Ekras]

Ok my friend, lets see what we can do to get you going.

First, those seedlings may be doomed. We will see shortly. just be prepared to start over. That said...your soil mix is the problem IMO.

I think it is too acidic from the peat you added. And, I suspect it is too "heavy" or too "dense"....and these types of soils do not drain well. They stay wet too long. Weed, like many plants, does NOT like heavy, poor draining soils.

You should begin seedlings in a 'light" soil, a soil that will drain very readily when you water (more on watering in a minute). If you have no previous gardening experience, go to HD and buy a bag of Miracle Grow seed starting mix and a small bag of Miracle Grow perlite. HD doesn't sell dolomite lime, but many nurseries do, especially if they cater to organic folks. Get some dolomite lime. You won't need it for seedlings but you will later on when you transplant up. May as well get it now if possible.

I use a plastic coffee "can" as a scoop and measuring thang. Just so happens to be like .9 gallons...close enough. Miracle grow seed starting mix is OK to use as is. However, I think you can improve it by mixing in more perlite. So mix in more perlite at a 3:1 ration ..that is: 3 gallons(scoops, whatever) of potting soil with 1 gallon(scoop, etc.) of perlite. This will improve drainage considerably because it lightens up the soil. Perlite is inert. It provides more pathways through the soil for water to drain. And then it provides more air spaces, if you will, for oxygen. Roots will like that, especially new roots.

Think about it. If you were a new, tiny, struggling hair of a root which is more appealing?
1) Fighting your way through a DENSE, waterlogged, compacted, oxygen poor soil..... OR
2) Winding your way easily through a light, moist, oxygen rich soil

After you get it mixed fill your new pots( the size they are in now is a little large to start in, but it'll do for now) with it and thoroughly water. Set the pots aside and let drain for 10 minutes or so.

This is the critical part and you need to be careful. Take a spoon and use it like a miniture shovel and VERY carefully and very gently scoop your seedling out of its currrent pot. The idea is you want to save, INTACT, whatever roots it may have developed. I'm guess that you won't have roots out much further than 1-2 inches. You'll have to just start out at maybe 2 inches and see. When you see how much soil you will have to take with the seedling, then you'll see how big a hole you will need in the new pot. Scoop it out.

Set you seedling in it and GENTLY firm the soil in place. You ain't packing this soil for a roadbed!! Don't compact it. Watering will settle it enough. The soil is already wet, but just just gently trickle a few tablespoons around the stem area so the soil around the seedling will 'marry" with the new pot's soil.

Watering. I water in this situation like this:

You need to be a bit careful watering soil with generous amouts of perlite. If you pour water on your seedling too quickly, that light soil might "boil up" and uproot your seedling. Remember, your seedling doesn't have much for roots right now. It has very little to support itself in the soil. You need to water very slowly, keeping fingers of one hand ready to keep soil and seedling in place if the plant wants to "float" out of place...meaning you're probably watering too quickly

Now you are transplanted and watered. Set them under your light as close as you can. The rule of thumb is close as you can without it being uncomfortable for your hand to be there for 1 minute. You say ventilation is no problem. You should be able to get that light within 8-10 inches. THAT INTENSE LIGHT WILL NOT HURT YOUR SEEDLINGS...BUT HEAT WILL.

When to water again? Learn to feel how much your plant weighs in its pot when wet...somewhat heavy. It will lighten up over time. Pick them up every day. Look at the soil o top. Scratch in around edges away from any possible roots. Learn how it feels and how heavy it is as the pot dries out.

I suspect you will not need to water for 4-5 days. Your plant got stressed a bit being transplanted and wasn't doing well anyway. It won't use much water right off. A lot will be evaporated by your light, fans etc. You need to keep an eye on it during the first week or so. Water when it looks and feels dry on the surface AND feels fairly light. IMO maybe err on the side of watering a day sooner rather than later in this situation. You don't want the new forming roots to go too dry. Your light, well draining soil will allow you to get away with watering sooner. Excess water drains off and air/O2 will get to roots soon enough.

No Nutes until your plants have a root system healthy enough to handle them. At a guess, maybe 2 weeks hence? Your plants will "tell" you if it is sooner. My advice is better under nuted than over nuted. Much easier to feed a plant than undo the damage from burning one. Speaking of burning a plant ....I'm getting cramps from typing. I hope this helps, im gonna burn a bud from one of mine that I had to cut because the buds are so heavy my plants are wanting to fall over!

Cheers
Obli

PS
I'd do 24/7 lights. That's another myth that plants need to a dark or "rest" period.



See all that perlite in there? Clear cups are nice cause you can see whats going on. Indoor lights DO NOT harm roots. IMO, it would be educational for some folk to grow in clear containers. They would see how their plants roots system grows, what it likes and doesn't like, when it gets rootbound, etc. etc.

Click to enlarge

Ok So I followed your advice for the one new seedling. I also put it back on 24/0 light (It just sprouted so didnt have time to acclimate to anything)

The others are pretty much doomed. So i'm gonna leave them alone until I need their pots.

Wish me luck!