HomeBox XS Major Temp Issues

[Guest]

In a HomeBox XS (2"x2"x4") the temp was observed at 111 F
The room temp is 80 F

Inside the box is a 430W HPS. It is uncooled.

There is a 4" Inline Duct Booster (70 cfm) pulling through a carbon scrubber (97 cfm).

This is obviously unacceptable. Purpose of box is to run 2-3 plants in a perpetual harvest.

To remedy should the light be reduced to a 250W, use an aircooled hood on the 430W, upgrade fan, etc...?

If reducing the light to 250W would allow the continued use of the small 70cfm fan, that is preferred. Otherwise, staying with the 430W and using an aircooled hood, what is the minimum acceptable cfm (the cheapest option)?

 

[Maj.PotHead]

if you can swing this very very effective and fairly cheap http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=29341 and vent the setup into attick this way your not venting into fresh air supply erea.

 

[cjk]

to use a 400w hps in a hb xs you need an air cooled hood with glass. you also need a bigger fan. i'd go with a daystar hood and 6" vortex with speed control

 

[Guest]

You have 32 cubic feet. The Stanley is a great fan but WAY too much for that tiny grow cabinet. I wouldn't recommend a 400W light in that small a cab though. I think 250 is big enough. And for a 250W I think a small squirrel cage fan like a Dayton 265 is PLENTY of blower. It is also MUCH quieter than a 6" Vortex or the Stanley.

MT

 

[globel]

vent the box into the attic or another room. do not vent into the same room you get your fresh air from.

 

[Guest]

You have 32 cubic feet. The Stanley is a great fan but WAY too much for that tiny grow cabinet. I wouldn't recommend a 400W light in that small a cab though. I think 250 is big enough. And for a 250W I think a small squirrel cage fan like a Dayton 265 is PLENTY of blower. It is also MUCH quieter than a 6" Vortex or the Stanley.

MT

A few more questions and clarifications please:

1. The HomeBox XS, is 2"x2"x4" so that is a volume of 16 cu/ft not 32 ??
Since the volume is 16 cu/ft, what is the appropriate exhaust fan to use in a system with a carbon scrubber first, then thru air cooled hood, finally out exhaust port?

2. Is it easiest to build a DIY cool tube to have both ends open for this type of ducting system?

3. What problems could show up if the cfm flow through the scrubber is not rated as high as the cfm from the fan?

Quietness and cost-effectiveness are both the keys to this setup. The 430w was already available. Regardless of other changes, does the 430w need to be reduced to a 250w? Would that in itself alleviate a bunch of problems? Is a 250w that substantially cooler?

4. For the 2"x2" it seems that the 430w is overkill, but it is already around. If the 430w is to be used, is the fan required to cool the cabinet going to be extremely loud?

** Ducting out of the room, cutting holes in walls, etc. is not an option. In light of that info, is that reason enough to suck it up and go with a 250w? Just having the 430w on in the closet which is 3"deep x 8" long x 5-7" tall, the temperature was observed around 91 F. The rest of the room is around 80 F. Again, no ability to vent exhaust anywhere but back into closet which houses the cabinet.



-Thx

 

[Guest]

vent the box into the attic or another room. do not vent into the same room you get your fresh air from.

That is not necessarily true. Whether you can or not vent to same room depends on a number of factors.

I vent my Hydrohut mini into the same room, a 9x10 spare bedroom with the only window that stays closed for security reasons. My light is a 430W Hortilux and I am venting to this room as we speak. Temps stay in the 70's unless I turn on strip heat for this room.

MT

 

[Guest]

A few more questions and clarifications please:

This may be more than you wanted to know, but I like to try to explain myself as well as possible. Since some the questions are interrelated I'll give an overall answer/opinion on what I would do if I were you...Where there are choices, I'll try to explain why I would choose one over the other(s) OK? In all fairness to you and others, there is no ONE way to do many of these things. More often than not, it becomes a choice of various tradeoffs. Not "right" vs "wrong" necessarily.

1. The HomeBox XS, is 2"x2"x4" so that is a volume of 16 cu/ft not 32 ??
Since the volume is 16 cu/ft, what is the appropriate exhaust fan to use in a system with a carbon scrubber first, then thru air cooled hood, finally out exhaust port?


2. Is it easiest to build a DIY cool tube to have both ends open for this type of ducting system?

3. What problems could show up if the cfm flow through the scrubber is not rated as high as the cfm from the fan?

Quietness and cost-effectiveness are both the keys to this setup. The 430w was already available. Regardless of other changes, does the 430w need to be reduced to a 250w? Would that in itself alleviate a bunch of problems? Is a 250w that substantially cooler?

4. For the 2"x2" it seems that the 430w is overkill, but it is already around. If the 430w is to be used, is the fan required to cool the cabinet going to be extremely loud?

** Ducting out of the room, cutting holes in walls, etc. is not an option. In light of that info, is that reason enough to suck it up and go with a 250w? Just having the 430w on in the closet which is 3"deep x 8" long x 5-7" tall, the temperature was observed around 91 F. The rest of the room is around 80 F. Again, no ability to vent exhaust anywhere but back into closet which houses the cabinet.



-Thx

Hehhehehe, my math is bad, but 16 ft3 is all the more reason for a smaller blower than a Stanley. Let's assume that 4 changes of air per minute is sufficient to get rid of the heat of a 250W lamp(and 250 is all you can do in there IMO, although others may have a different opinion. (I'll get to that issue below). Dayton makes a small very quiet squirrel cage type blower that is rated at 140 ft3/ minute "unloaded" meaning without any resistance at either the input or output of the blower. That means without a scrubber, the 140 will change the air in your cab 140/16= 8+ times a minute!! Once every 7-8 seconds. IMO one of those small 4lb size carbon scrubbers is sufficient for a 16 ft3 grow space. Let's face it, just how much smelly plant material can you get in that small space? You don't need a big 12 pound plus scrubber. Even if the 4# scrubber drops the blowers flow to 1/2 its rated output, you'll still change the air 4 times a minute Do you see how I am calculating all this?

I had to work earlier today and just got home. I'm a bit whacked so bear with me on this post. I need to express my opinion on blowers here so my recommendations make sense...hopefully. Others are free to disagree of course. That's OK. I am relating my own personal experience here with regard to blowers. Others have different experience. It's all good as kids say these days

Many don't understand about blowers and why some work better than others.

Let's get one thing clear first on what is NOT gonna work with scrubbers. And that is those cheap "inline" booster fans for ducting. They are fine if used for a supply air blower if you don't have any obstructions in the tubing. They are somewhat noisy though. I don't use them at all.

1. Vortex blowers. These are good blowers for grows. They are compact, easy to install, and move air very efficiently through a scrubber, lights, etc. My biggest objection to them is they are more noisy in my experience. They are more expensive(about 2x) than squirrel cage types too. Although that may not be true in all cases. "Deals" abound on the internet. A Vortex blower would work for you, but it will be more expensive and more noisy.

2. I prefer squirrel cage type blowers like the Daytons. Dayton blowers are sold all over the USA. I do buy the flange adapters from a grow place though. I buy blowers from WW Graingers for 10-20% cheaper than grow places. They are much cheaper #1(even after buying flange adapters for round ducting). And they are quieter #2. The reason they are quieter has to do with the design of a squirrel cage vs a Vortex which is an "axial centrifugal" type blower. The handy flange adapters make it easy to mate with round ducting.

OK back to your grow.

You could do a DIY cool tube, and that might be best in a limited space like that. Cool tube takes up the least space of all the light designs I think. The cab is so small that having no reflector isn't really a disaster. Put reflective material all over. You might even get away with a 400 in there if you use a cool tube. It might mean stepping up to a Dayton 265 blower, but that is no big deal. If you do go to a 400, Dayton 265, you will have to use a bigger scrubber. Not because of smell. If you try to push too much air too fast through a scrubber(they have ratings in cubic feet/minute) it reduces the scrubbers efficiency. Lighting (heat production), ventilation, scrubbing are all interrelated. You need to match them up right if you want to avoid problems. Anyway a cool tube will work.( I just read more. I think a 400W is not good for you since you have to exhaust into closet.)

So using a cool tube, you make a 4" hole in the top of cabinet for your exhaust port. If using a cool tube, you may have room beside it for a small scrubber, I don't know. You'll have to research that...or maybe someone knows.Then run your 4" dryer tubing to the blower input. You can get an output flange and exhaust the "cleaned" air into a small trash can type muffler. There is a thread on here how to do that. That would make the grow damn near silent IMO. These small squirrel cage blowers do not make a lot of noise. The Dayton 140 is popular as a bathroom vent. When you add tubing on input and output, they are very quiet IMO....but I'm hard of hearing so I'm told And you can BLOW through a carbon scrubber. It's not ideal, but it will work if you don't have room inside the cab for it.

Ducting out of the room, cutting holes in walls, etc. is not an option. In light of that info, is that reason enough to suck it up and go with a 250w? Just having the 430w on in the closet which is 3"deep x 8" long x 5-7" tall, the temperature was observed around 91 F. The rest of the room is around 80 F. Again, no ability to vent exhaust anywhere but back into closet which houses the cabinet.

I vent into the same room. And this is another advantage of the Dayton IMO. Every room will be different. In my situation I found out (by carefully measuring) that the air near the floor is 5-7 degrees F cooler than air at waist level...and as much as 8-10 dgrees cooler than eye level air. This differential varies with seasons and if I have heat on etc. BUT it is always there. Soooo. My "intake blower pulls in air at floor level( or any level I want to pull from because I just place the blower at whatever level I want) Right now the air going in is about 77.7F RH is 43%(room air at 18" from floor today). Inside my Hydrohut the temp/RH is 78.8F/48% I have a RS inside outside wirteless gadget($39.95) a great investment for small cabs, TRUST me on that one. Get that gadget.

You have to vent the grow cab into the closet? Yeah, then you probably need to stay with a 250W. If the closet door is a standard hollow core door, buy one just like it. They are cheap. Then cut holes in the top and bottom for some passive ventilation to the room the closet is in. If you can do that(holes in closet door which you replace before moving out) then you can run your 4" exhaust tubing to the TOP hole in closet door. New, cooler, fresh air can enter via the second lower hole and/or cracks underneath door...but cracks probably won't be enough.

You are going to have to vent that closet the cab is in somehow, someway...else you will have problems with temps and humidity build up.

Well I have run outa gas and Im hungry. I hope this helps you a little bit.

MT

 

[Guest]

Wow MT, really above and beyond what was expected, really appreciated.
+K a million times!!

One final question:

Is a Dayton 265 approximately twice as loud as a Dayton 140? Or is cfm rating not a good indicator of perceived noise level?

The squirrel cage fan seems like the way to go.


-Thx again

 

[Guest]

There's not a lot of difference in noise between a 140 and a 265. I have a 465 for my current grow. It doesn't have anything on the discharge side of the blower to muffle sound. I can't hear it in my other bedroom. I have guys living directly above me. If it was a problem, I'd have heard about it long ago.

In all fairness, before you make a final decision,,, go look at some of the threads on micro grows and equipment design. Do an advanced search for "titles" containing words like blower, Vortex, etc. There's a lot of good info there you might compare what I say to.

I like squirrel cage fans for the reasons I said, but many like Vortex.

CFM rating isn't necessarily a indicator of noise.

Whatever blower you choose, make sure all the screws/nuts/bolts are tight. Some guys put rubber or fiber washers under troublesome screws/bolts/nuts. Over time they sometimes loosen and vibrate making noise.

Good luck with your grow.

MT