Help Save the Clonage =)

[kalikush]

The Clonage is Lavander and I've been stressing her out. I think I had a Cal/Mag def. and looks like still does, agree?

The soil needed a really good flush so she got it and I added some Cal-Mag to the last water. By next watering (4 days)she looked stable but more yellow so I fed light dose of Grow Big and half a dose of Cal-Mag. Next just used pure water 7.0, runoff was 6.7 (finally got a ph pen), this was Sunday.

Shes really needed a transplant but I've been lazy. Ive got a bigger pot and will probably use 60/40 FFOF/Perlite instead of 50/50. I am confident in my transplanting ability so that will cause as minimal stress as possible. I think she would benefit from the fresh soil. Would the watering after transplant be just fresh water or should I use a light mix of grow big+cal Mag since she hasnt ate in several days?

Thanks for looking! All other info at the bottom...






SOIL:
What STRAIN are you growing? Lavander
What was the establishing technique? clone
What is the age of your plants?3.5 mos
How Tall are the plants?7"
What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in?veg 24hr
What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot)1Gal
What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you using?(percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?)50/50 FFOF/Perlite + 2TBS dolomite lime/gal
What Nutrient's are you using?grow big + cal mag
What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"? 6.7
What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen?pen
How often are you watering?every 4 days
What size bulb are you using?4 42W CFL's
What is the distance to the canopy? 2-3"
What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity)< 30%
What is the canopy temperature?80-85max
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range)day mid 70's-80's, night lowest maybe mid to high 60's but getting warmer now
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.) 167cfm
Is the fan blowing directly at plants?could use more
Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist?wet/dry
Is your water HARD or SOFT?use brita water filter
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched? no
Have any pest chemicals been used? nope
Are plant's infected with pest's?nope

 

[Navigator330]

Start with a 1/4 strength of grow big .... they look like they need some N, lower your starting ph to about 6.4. You may be locking something you need out. Im not familiar with soil grows, but this is the best i can offer for help.
Find MYNAMESTITCH and ask him. He can help for sure!


Are you using big bud as your supplement???? I am using liquid karma instead of big bud. i like it better try it!

 

[kalikush]

Yea I think she definately, at least, needs N. She started really yellowing again this morning. I finally got some GH pH up/down today so I'll probably pH the next nute mix around 6.2-3 and end up around 6.4-5.

I hope Stitch makes his way over here too, he knows his shyt. I bought my Big Bloom today for flower too, never tried LK. How do you like it better? Is it completely organic?

 

[HerbGlaze]

Nitrogen/Magneisium its so hard to tell cause the defeincy.. of the two look similiar I recommend what Navigator told you.. and it would NEVER hurt to add some seaweed extract to it.

 

[Navigator330]

I believe it is almost totally organic 90% ?and i love it...... see how long its been since i used big bloom? i called it big bud..... lol and im not even high! Its really good to my crops:

Liquid Karma
Botanicare

It has seaweed extract, yucca xtract, sugars, aloe vera, yeast (sugar), humic acid. Give it a run sometime. 13 bucks a quart.

add silica blast and you got a great team with fox farrm grow big and tiger bloom...... I use coco and perlite.

I've tried everything from straight fox farms to Botanicare tri flex and mixing items etc... this formula is best.

Grow Big
Tiger Bloom
LK
Silica Blast (two times per crop, 1 in veg and 1 in flower)
you will never need cal mag or anything else.

PLUS LK has just enough N to keep your plants green if your not sure what to give them or while in flower(like your situation) makes easy transitions of re pots etc. Never screw them up again! Perfect for idiots like me that get chemical happy. My very first indoor grow years ago i was giving my plants so much monster bloom EVERY water buds tasted horrible!

OK...............ENUFF with the self made commercials..


Take care!

 

[Rastanfisk]

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=11688

Scroll down to the first Picture - Then scroll up again and read

Nitrogen (N) Mobile Element and Macro Element

Peace

 

[00420]

but I've been lazy.

here is the first prob........

 

[MynameStitch]

Agreed there 00420. The problem is when a plant is rootbound it will cause a deficiency weather there is food or not, the roots are crowded and will not be able to absorb nutrients correctly.

First transplant it and give it good, you have magnesium,phosphorus and nitrogen problems.

How much grow big were you using and how often? Also having low night time temps and warm temps in the day time can cause the plant to go up in down with it's metabolism, you want to try to keep a stable temp if you can.
Warmer temps the plants eat more, cooler temps they slow down.

Also given the fact they have more lighting and such they will eat more.

Your pH is correct so that is not a problem, the problem being is you being lazy and not transplanting

So get her into a bigger pot, 1 gallon size pots to 1 foot tall plants minimum!

How tall are these plants? THey gotta be hella rootbound.

 

[kalikush]

Navigator330 - I'll have to look into those a little more and maybe try them next time around. I'll see if anyones used your stuff with soil and check out their results. Thanks for the suggestions.

I guess the laziness was part because I didnt care too much about this clone. She was kind of a practice run, first one I grew in years and first time I tried SCROG. I'd rather put this one thru the ringer so I know what Im doing when I get my genetics. But still, no excuse! Now that shes so big, I want to get her healthy and pimp her for all shes worth. haha

Stitch - Im sure shes hella rootbound and she wont be for much longer. I planned to flower her long ago but things kept coming up, blah blah blah and here we are, rootbound and suffering.

Grow big was being fed every watering for the last 2 months, varied from light 1tsp to med 2 tsp/gal and she still seemed to yellow a bit, then the other deficiencies came.

I noticed you said she has magnesium,phosphorus and nitrogen problems, wouldnt the burns be a calcium deficiency?

The temps should start to stablize more now that its getting warmer and I rigged up the diy thermo controlled outlet from the site.

And she covers a lot of real estate, has 4x42W CFL's over her but from dirt to the tallest tip is only 7"!! I trained her for a very small cab and since then have upgraded so theres a bit more vertical.

I was also reading about Foxfarm today and read about someone who had something rattling in their bottle... Mine has the same stuff and has had it for at least a month now. They said it has gone bad if this happens, maybe this is partly to blame?? She still needs to be in a bigger pot and will be by tomorrow.

 

[MynameStitch]

THe burn like you are referring to is necrotic tissue the plant caused it by sucking it's leaves dry from the nutrients being removed from the plant by the plant.

That tissue was not burned.
How old is your nutrients? You should always shake your nutrients well before mixing, because stuff settles to the bottom and you won't get the dosage you think you are giving your plants.

Your problem won't go away until you repot and feed.

 

[kalikush]

That makes sense, she was basically starving so she was feeding on herself ehh? Thanks for the clarification. The nutes were only 3mos old and I shook every time before using. I dont know why it got the 'rocks' in the bottle but I found that other people got it too. I bought a new bottle today.

I transplanted today too and it was really root bound,especially at the bottom. I've never had one get that bad but I read that you sould cut an X across the bottm to help loosen up the roots. I put her in her new home but just used plain water, I figured the new soil will feed her for a couple weeks?? Should I have fed her with nutes? I can foliar feed her if I need to.

 

[MynameStitch]

3 month old nutes are fine as long as you were the one buying them, now if you got them from someone else and did not know how old they were I would not use them.

Thats good, a lot of people tend to forget to shake the bottle good everytime they use it.

What I do with mine when mine was root bound in my first grow, I had taken a small butter knife and lifted some of the roots up a bit to losen them up from the rest since I was in flowering.

You want to try to avoid cutting any roots if possible, but since you are in veg, I am sure it was badly rootbound so if I were you I would rather try to untangle the roots when it's laid on it's side.

The only time I would reccomend cutting roots is when you are trimming the rootball.

Even then I would give it some carbs or some kind of vitamins to help with the root trauma, like superthrive.

But if you do use that use 1 drop or 2 per gallon of water.

You can use many others besides superthrive though. I would use it after a transplant if I were you.
Foliar feed works well on smaller plants, but the concentration you would have to use to get the leaves what they need could cause some burns on the leaves so I would transplant and then feed.

You can cut the roots, I would cut it on the bottom into the middle. So like cutting a pie down the middle, but do it on the bottom only.

 

[kalikush]

Oh yea, for sure I bought the nutes brand new.. I dont take chances on the small stuff: nutes, dirt, rapid rooters... Its too cheap to risk on "used" items

This bitch was so dry the day of, the bottom roots and dirt was like the crust on a baguette from the bakery... Untangling was out of the question and I didnt have time to moisten them and try. I had a small window of opportunity, having roommates and all, and this had to be finished in like 10 mins! I had a small but really sharp kitchen knife and cut an X all the way across the bottom. Once that was cut, I opened it up a little bit to expose the dirt underneath. The bottom opened easily and there was not much root mass under the 'crust' of roots that had formed on the bottom. I noticed there werent much of any roots, against the pot at least, except at the very bottom 15-20%. I think its better to just to with a shallow but very wide pot at transplants since the roots just accumulate at the bottom.

I transplanted and watered heavily but no nue nutes. She seems to be doing ok, I sprayed with plain H20 and lowered her from the lights. Today she was 2" away from her artificial suns and Im thinking I should have used some nutes in her H2o. I wish I still had some Superthrive around but I think she'll be ok and will try and post a pic in a bit.

Im thinking I'll use a med dose 2 tsp/gal of Grow Big and maybe half a dose of Cal Mag next watering.

 

[MynameStitch]

Ya, when your plants are rootbound they need watered like every day to every other day and they use 2x the amount they normally would use.
This is cause there is so much roots in there to soil ratio there is not much soil to hold up moisture due to the root mass and it drys out much quicker.

Ya, the dosage sounds good, but make sure you don't use it all the time the dosage I mean, feed every week with the amount until you hit flowering, then you switch over to bloom nutrients after a week of flowering.

and stop using the grow ferts, as long as the plants are not showing problems before you hit the switch to 12/12.

 

[kalikush]

Do you think 2 weeks is enough time before 12/12 if she recovers? Im talking lush green growth like she used to spew.. I've read to give veg nutes until the strech is over, Im guessing like 2-3 waters after the light change. Then dump a big dose of organic Big Bloom, then regular dose from then on out. Alternate with plain water too right?

If this lady gets lush again, shes gonna reward me. But nothing likes whats to come...

 

[MynameStitch]

Ya, that should be plenty of time for her to recover, just make sure you put her in a nice size pot but not too big. What size pot did you put her into?
How tall is she?

 

[kalikush]

Only 7" tall dogg! She fills out a screen of about 12" x 10" with soo many shoots. She went from a 1gal 2 too gal pot. She should be cool to get healthy, flower then kick it. I hope by then Ive got my DJ genetics well under way

 

[kalikush]

Ok heres some pix

The root mass




Couple shots from the top, she doesnt look that healthy here






Just under the sick looking top, the growth is lush green. Could it be I have her too close to the lights? She usually is between 1" and 2" from each 42W CFL.





And just a shot of the stemage and the branches I've trained





A sack of nuggs I just picked up.. They said the sticker is for insurance reasons haha

 

[MynameStitch]

ROFL Dude, I am forever saving that picture of that bag dude, if there was anyway you could ever pay me back for help dude, that right there takes the cake!!!

Thanks for sharing that picture dude LOLOL

Damn dude, that is rootbound, the roots were even dying

Brown roots you know were rootbound for a long time.

 

[kalikush]

Like that one? haha Thanks for the help too!

Would I have been better off cutting all the dead root 'crust' off?

Any idea why the growth just below the surface is so lush and green?