What's new
  • ICMag with help from Landrace Warden and The Vault is running a NEW contest in November! You can check it here. Prizes are seeds & forum premium access. Come join in!

gibberellin + jasmonic acid = more trichomes?

stoneyriver

New member
Salacylic Acid – Help for Tobacco Mosaic Virus????

Seeking an alternative to the ill-advised use of external chemical sprays or
devices such as sulfur burners, scientists at a Canadian company called Advanced
Nutrients discovered how to create a vaccination for plants. Their goal was
to create “induced systemic resistance” to disease, pests, and other threats. The
product they created, called Scorpion Juice, uses several key components to
stimulate a pre-emptive immune response in marijuana.

During the design phase of Scorpion Juice, their scientists noted the similarities
between plant responses to attacks and human responses. When a human is
invaded by viruses, harmful bacteria or other pathogens, the body reacts with
fever, swelling, redness, inflammation and other responses. When pathogens or
insects attacks plants, plants respond using some of the same methods, such as lesions
on leaves, loss of leaves, and the release of cell to cell chemical signalers that place the
entire plant on alert against the invaders. During their research, the scientists found
the vital role that a naturally-occurring form of aspirin plays in plant immune
system function. Drug store aspirin is actually a chemical analog of this natural
form of aspirin. The chemical analog was created by the Bayer Corporation in
1859, based on a natural material found in willow bark and other plants, known
as “salicylic acid.” Bayer’s aspirin is acetylsalicylic acid.

Salicylic acid is found in many plants and trees, and is believed to be a first line
of defense against pathogens and other invaders. Plants release a large amount of
salicylic acid when they are attacked by pathogens; this corresponds to subsequent
releases of other plant proteins that also appear to promote plant survival.
Studies show that plants treated with salicylic acid became extraordinarily
resistant to powdery mildew, which is one of the most persistent plant diseases that
affect marijuana.

One Cornell University study found a protein and gene pair (salicylic acidbinding
protein 2- SABP2- and its gene) that facilitates inner-plant communication
that is believed responsible for increased plant immune system response. The
Cornell researchers said that using immune system enhancement rather than
pesticides, herbicides and other protective measures was a safer way of helping ag
crops battle threats.

In studies involving tobacco mosaic virus, which has been known to attack a
variety of plant crops including cannabis, scientists found that SABP2 triggered
release of salicylic acid, which then created a “hypersensitive resistance
response” that included programmed cell death at the site of the attack as plant
cells sacrificed themselves for the overall survival of the plant. The cell death
isolated the attacking organism so that it could not spread throughout the plant.
Using natural formulas on roots and leaves to create induced systemic resistance is
a delicate art. It is the same when using vaccines to inoculate humans against
disease. Some humans will develop symptoms of a disease after they have
been given a vaccination for the disease. Their bodies were unable to handle the
small amounts of pathogenic material that the vaccination infused into them.
Similarly, growers using products such as Scorpion Juice should closely monitor
their plants to ensure that the proper amount of immune stimulation is taking
place. Too much stimulation can slow growth and divert energy from floral
production. The proper amount of immune stimulation, combined with nutritional
support such as silica, vitamin, and enzyme augmentation, gives marijuana
plants an enhanced immune response that gives them a much better chance
of surviving pathogenic attack and also increases metabolism and vigor, which
results in higher yield and potency.
 
Last edited:

Jaymer

Back-9-Guerrilla☠
Veteran
Additionally, SA cross regulates the ethylene and jasmonic acid-dependent defense pathways

Functions of Ethylene
Ethylene is known to affect the following plant processes (Davies, 1995; Mauseth, 1991; Raven, 1992; Salisbury and Ross, 1992):

* Stimulates the release of dormancy.
* Stimulates shoot and root growth and differentiation (triple response)
* May have a role in adventitious root formation.
* Stimulates leaf and fruit abscission.
* Stimulates Bromiliad flower induction.
* Induction of femaleness in dioecious flowers.
* Stimulates flower opening.
* Stimulates flower and leaf senescence.
* Stimulates fruit ripening.

Ethylene has been used in practice since the ancient Egyptians, who would gas figs in order to stimulate ripening. The ancient Chinese would burn incense in closed rooms to enhance the ripening of pears.
 

spurr

Active member
Veteran
also found this:

Elicitors of plant defence include the plant signalling molecules salicylic acid (SA) and methyl jasmonate (MeJA), and some rhizobacteria.

wonder what SA does to cannabis?

Don't use SA and jasmonates together, there is negative cross-talk between SA and jasmontes and SA hinders trichcome density/production.

If you haven't read my PGR thread you should check it out, I cover all this in that thread. SA induces SAR in cannabis and other plants, and jasmonates do not; inducing SAR is a wise move, there are other SAR inducers besides SA...

P.S. Nice find on the spider mite paper, I really like that jasmonates (as MeJA) also hinder powdery mildew.

:tiphat:
 

spurr

Active member
Veteran
also found this:

Elicitors of plant defence include the plant signalling molecules salicylic acid (SA) and methyl jasmonate (MeJA), and some rhizobacteria.

wonder what SA does to cannabis?

SA (and its analog found in aspirin) induces SAR (Systemic Acquired Resistance), some rhizobacteria activate ISR (Induced Systemic Resistance); and endogenous jasmonates (JA, IIRC) are needed for ISR to be activated. Jasmonates do not induce SAR, nor do endogenous or exogenous jasmonates activate ISR as far as I know. However,exogenous jasmonates could activate ISR, I just haven't found any info (studies) showing it does, yet.

AFAIK at this point, jasmonates (ex. JA and/or MeJA and/or MDHJ) induce plant defenses by some other mechanism; not SAR, but possibly ISR. Either way, exogenous application of jasmonates do induce plant defenses against some biotic and abiotic stressors; and MeJA increases trich density and probably terpenoid production.

In terms of plant defenses, co-application MeJA and MDHJ might provide the best response. According to folks from Jaz spray, MHDJ affects the defense response in plants differently than other jasmonates, that is, exogenous MDHJ can help the plant defend against different biotic and abiotic attacks/stressors than MeJA and/or JA.
 

spurr

Active member
Veteran
This thread seem to be the new jasmonate thread, separated from my PGR thread, so i figure I should post studies here, instead of to my PGR thread...

"Elicitation studies in cell suspension cultures of Cannabis sativa L."
Isvett J. Flores Sanchez, Jaroslav Pe, Junni Fei, Young H. Choi and Robert Verpoorte
Journal of Biotechnology, Volume 143, Issue 2, 20 August 2009, Pages 157-168
https://openaccess.leidenuniv.nl/bitstream/1887/13206/10/05.pdf
^^^ that study found JA and MeJA do not seem to induce cannabinoid production or affect cellular growth. The results are not definitive but I found the study to be interesting:
  • "Although, MeJA, JA and salicylic acid (SA) are tansducers of elicitor signals it seems that in cell suspension cultures cannabinoid accumulation or biosynthesis was not related to JA or SA signaling pathways"
  • "However, no signals for cannabinoids in 1H-NMR spectrum of the CHCl3 extracts were detected during the time course of the elicitation cell cultures with methyl jasmonate (MeJA), jasmonic acid (JA) and pectin."
  • "The results generated from NMR analyses and PCA are not conclusive, however, it seems that the main effect of the JA-, MeJA- and pectin-treatments was in the biosynthesis of primary precursors which could go into secondary biosynthetic pathways."
  • "In cannabis cell cultures, cannabinoid biosynthesis was not stimulated or induced by biotic and abiotic elicitors. A developmental, spatial, temporal or tissue-specific regulation could be controlling this pathway."
  • "As cannabinoids are constitutive secondary metabolites in C. sativa (Chapter I) a time course was made after induction with jasmonate and pectin. Both are known to induce the plant defense system (Zhao et al., 2005). These elicitors were used to induce the metabolism of the cell cultures during the exponential and stationary phases of cellular growth. As it is shown in figure 1 cellular growth was not significantly affected by the treatments."

"Unraveling the Function of Secondary Metabolites"
A Companion to Plant Physiology, Fifth Edition
Lincoln Taiz and Eduardo Zeiger
http://5e.plantphys.net/article.php?ch=e&id=313
^^^ That article discuses how jasmonates affect secondary metabolites such as terpenoids.

"Smelling the Danger and Getting Prepared: Volatile Signals as Priming Agents in Defense Response"
Jurgen Engelberth
A Companion to Plant Physiology, Fifth Edition
Lincoln Taiz and Eduardo Zeiger
http://5e.plantphys.net/article.php?ch=e&id=378
^^^ That article discuses how jasmonates affect secondary metabolites such as terpenoids.


P.S. after reviewing many more studies (most I haven't posted) I think 25 ppm, or less, of MeJA might be better than 50 or 100 ppm. I am going to try 25 ppm this coming grow, I think.

P.P.S. I found another source of MeJA in the US, and it's less expensive than other sources. I will contact them this coming week about any hops one would need to jump through to order MeJA from them...

:tiphat:
 

spurr

Active member
Veteran
Two more studies relevant to trichome production:

"Jasmonic acid control of GLABRA3 links inducible defense and trichome patterning in Arabidopsis"
Yuki Yoshida, Ryosuke Sano, Takuji Wada, Junji Takabayashiand Kiyotaka Okada
Development 136, 1039-1048 (2009)
http://dev.biologists.org/content/136/6/1039.full.pdf


"Hormone-mediated promotion of trichome initiation in plants is conserved but utilizes species- and trichome-specific regulatory mechanisms"
Lies Maes and Alain Goossens
Plant Signaling & Behavior 5:2, 205-207; February 2010
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2884137/pdf/psb0502_0205.pdf
 

spurr

Active member
Veteran
Sprayed one of my Blueberrys day 21. Day 24 now and it smells more then the other that I did not spray. Used Jaz at 1/2 str. Growth and frostiness looks same on both. (eyeball method)

Nice, keep us updated on what you see/smell. Does day 21 mean day 21 of flowering?

:)
 
D

DonkDBZ

Yep Yep day 21 of flower. Interesting note from day 25.....pistols of the 2 girls spray are turning slightly brown/dieing off. The blueberry not sprayed still all white.

So whats the deal with spidermites and Jaz? So ....from rooted clone when would be best time to spray jaz in veg? ....and would it hinder growth at all?

whats your guys best theoretical guesses?
 

spurr

Active member
Veteran
MeJA (methyl jasmonate; aka methyl ester of jasmonic acid):

I just learned one can use pH 7.2 PBS (Phosphate Buffer Solution) to dissolve 3 mg MeJA (neat oil) per mL of PBS. I like that better than using using EtOH because the PBS will not have a negative affect on the plants like can happen when using too much EtOH (I have experienced that using EtOH with a foliar spray before). I want to try using PBS to dissolve MeJA and then add the solution to a liter of water to reach the goal ppm. I will figure out the math later and post a how-to with info on buying and making pH 7.2 PBS...

One reason I like using EtOH is one can make a stock solution and then simply dilute it into a weaker solution for foliar spray. I also like EtOH (as Everclear) becuase 30 mg of MeJA can be made miscible in 1 mL of EtOH verses only 3 mg of MeJA into pH 7.2 PBS. FWIW, foliar spays of EtOH and methanol have been found to increase Co2 fixation and carbon assimilate of some higher plants.

If using PBS to make a solution of MeJA it should be used that day; but when using EtOH it can be stored (ex., as a stock solution).




Various application rates of MeJA from two studies showing increased trichome production:

I thought I should make a few quick notes about various rates used in some studies. I will write up MeJA directions like I did for TRIA here (link), later today or tomorrow. The molecular mass of MeJA is ~224.5 g/mol. I will calculate the exact mass later today.
Note #1: mM is "milliMolar", i.e., M (Molarity; mol/L) times 1,000. Ex., 1 M = 1,000 mM and 1 mM = 0.001 M.

Note #2:
1 mM = 0.001 mol/L
- 7.5 mM MeJA on tomato plants:

(0.0075 mol/L)224.3 g/mol = (1.68225 g)1,000 = 1,682.25 mg/L = 1,682.25 ppm


- 0.4 mM on tobacco plants:

(0.004 mol/L)224.3 g/mol = (0.08972 g)1,000 = 89.72 mg/L = 89.72 ppm


- 0.2 mM on tobacco plants:

(0.002 mol/L)224.3 g/mol = (0.04486 g)1,000 = 44.86 mg/L = 44.86 ppm

:tiphat:
 
Smoke Report​

I shared my harvest with four other patients, all experienced smokers in there 40s and 50s. All four smoke out of glass pipes. Each individual received three samples marked with colors. My testers were not told anything more than it was the same strain (Bubblicious) grown under different conditions. Each sample was color-coded. The reactions of all four testers were remarkably consistent:

The plants that received no treatment (white) was the least favorite, although they did like how it smoked—tight, hard buds.

The plants that received jasmonic acid only (blue) was seen as more potent than the no treatment bud, as well as having a stronger fragrance.

The plants that received the mix of jasmonic acid and gibberellic acid that showed foxtailing (green) received the best reviews on potency and smell, but they were unhappy with the “airiness” of the buds.

I surely make JAZ Spray part of my regimen. As to whether or not I will also use gibberellic acid. . . right now I just don’t know if it’s worth the trade off.
 

spurr

Active member
Veteran
Smoke Report​


I shared my harvest with four other patients, all experienced smokers in there 40s and 50s. All four smoke out of glass pipes. Each individual received three samples marked with colors. My testers were not told anything more than it was the same strain (Bubblicious) grown under different conditions. Each sample was color-coded. The reactions of all four testers were remarkably consistent:

The plants that received no treatment (white) was the least favorite, although they did like how it smoked—tight, hard buds.

The plants that received jasmonic acid only (blue) was seen as more potent than the no treatment bud, as well as having a stronger fragrance.

The plants that received the mix of jasmonic acid and gibberellic acid that showed foxtailing (green) received the best reviews on potency and smell, but they were unhappy with the “airiness” of the buds.

I surely make JAZ Spray part of my regimen. As to whether or not I will also use gibberellic acid. . . right now I just don’t know if it’s worth the trade off.

Awesome post and color coded/bind smoke test, much props! I think GA3 might be worthwhile and not cause foxtailing, etc., if it's applied in low enough concentration. In some plants endogenous GA3 is found ~10^-6 M (~0.34638 ppm). I think using about that rate, slightly more, or less, might be helpful and not cause excessive foxtailing or unwanted flower morphology.

Below I broke down the exogenous application rates of GA3 from three studies; as well as the JA application rate from one study. Two studies were cannabis looking at affects on THC and terpenoids, etc. from GA3. One of the two studies in veg and the other study in flowering. This info could help us tailor the correct application rate of GA3, as well as JA, if people use JA instead of MeJA or MDHJ:


1. From the study "Interactive Effects of Jasmonic Acid, Salicylic Acid, and Gibberellin on Induction of Trichomes in Arabidopsis" by M. Brian Traw and Joy Bergelson (2003); JA was used at 0.1 mM, 0.45 mM and 1 mM and GA3 was used at 0.45 mM.

In that study it was found that 0.1 mM and 1 mM of JA both provided similar increases in trichcome destiny, but 1 mM had a much higher increase in trichome number than 0.1 mM. It was also found that 0.45 mM JA increased trich density and number by ~5%; but when 0.45 mM GA3 was co-applied with 0.45 mM JA the trich density increased by 48.9% and trich number increased by 93.1%!

In that study it was found SA reduced trich number and density, below the control levels, when co-applied with JA. And it was found that 0.45 mM GA3 alone increased trich number by 72%, but co-application of 0.45 mM GA3 and 0.45 SA only increased trich number by 29.6%.

What all that means is SA is not good to use, it will hinder trich density and trich number (verified by other studies on SA and trichs). And that co-application of jasmonates and GA3 increases trich density and number much more than either alone. Thus, if we can find an application rates of GA3 that do not cause negative morphological affects on buds, it could be well worth applying in terms of trich density and number.

Math:

GA3 (mol weight of 346.38 g/mol)

0.45 mM = 4e^-4 M = 0.0045 mol/L

  • (0.00045 mol/L)346.38 g/mol = (0.155871 g)1,000 = 155.871 mg/L = 155.871 ppm
JA (mol weight 210.27 g/mol)

0.1 mM = 1e^-4 M = 0.0004 mol/L

  • (0.0001 mol/L)210.27 g/mol = (0.021027 g)1,000 = 21.027 mg/L = 21.027 ppm

0.45 mM = 4.5e^-4 M = 0.00045 mol/L

  • (0.00045 mol/L)210.27 g/mol = (0.0946215 g)1,000 = 94.6215 mg/L = 94.6215 ppm

1 mM = 0.001 mol/L

  • (0.001 mol/L)210.27 g/mol = (0.21027 g)1,000 = 210.27 mg/L = 210.27 ppm


2.
From the study "The response of terpenoids to exogenous gibberellic acid in Cannabis sativa L. at vegetative stage" by Hakimeh Mansouri, Zahra Asrar and Ryszard Amarowicz (2010); GA3 was used at 50 uM and 100 uM.

In that study it was found 50 uM GA3 did not increase THC or CBD over controls, but 100 uM GA3 increased THC quite a lot over controls. The workers noted the increase in THC from GA3 was probably not due to a direct causality, instead they suggested the increase in THC was due to GA3 affecting endogenous plant hormones. Both application rates of GA3 increased some terpenoids, decreased others, and decreased chlorophylls (A & B), carotenoids, etc.


Math:

GA3 (mol weight of 346.38 g/mol)

50 uM = 50e^-6 M = 5e^-5 = 0.00005 mol/L

  • (0.00005 mol/L)346.38 g/mol = (0.017319 g)1,000 = 17.319 ml/L = 17.319 ppm

100 uM = 100e^-6 M = 1e^-4 M = 0.0001 mol/L

  • (0.0001 mol/L)346.38 g/mol = (0.034638 g)1,000 = 34.638 mg/L = 34.638 ppm


3.
From the study "Effects of Gibberellic Acid on Primary Terpenoids and 9-Tetrahydrocannabinol in Cannabis sativa at Flowering Stage" by Hakimeh Mansouri, Zahra Asrar and Mitra Mehrabani (2009); GA3 was used at 50 uM and 100 uM.

In that study it was found GA3 reduced THC content, chlorophylls (A & B), carotenoids and some terpenoids. In that study the workers applied 50 uM and 100 uM GA3 to flowering female cannabis when the "glandular trichomes on bracts were globose and resinous". I believe "globose and resinous" trichomes means the point when we would harvest, or very near that point, i.e., swollen trichs.

Because the results from the GA3-cannabis study in 2010 was the opposite in terms of THC verses this study, it seems the timing of the application of GA3 might be an important factor for increasing THC, or decreasing THC. In the 2010 study GA3 was applied before late flowering stage, but in this (2009) study GA3 was applied very near to when we would harvest.


Math:
Same as in the 2010 study above.


4.
The first hand smoking experience of OM&tW and his friends, Oswizzle, and myself, from buds sprayed with GA3 and jasmonates, seem to have all noticed an increased high. And that co-application of GA3 and jasmonates seemed to be more effective in increasing the high than jasmonates alone. That seems to provide anecdotal evince that GA3 does increase THC either by (A) directly per trichome or (B) indirectly by increasing trichome density and number; or a combination of A and B. Those results also seem to provide anecdotal evince that co-application of jasmonates and GA3 provides a better high than only jasmonates.

One issue I have is the negative physiological and chemical affects on the plants from GA3 application, re: reduced content of chlorophylls (A & B), carotenoids and some terpenoids...and maybe THC and CBD too.


5. After reviewing many studies and application rates of JA, MeJA and GA3, 100-200 ppm (and higher) jasmonates (JA and MeJA) was most effective. And 1-30 ppm (or lower) GA3 might be worth trying for less negative affect on growth. The GA3 concentration is the question, up to ~155 ppm (0.45 mM) GA3 has been shown to increase trich density and number, but that also makes buds foxtail and plants stretch. As I wrote above, endogenous levels of GA3 in many plants is ~0.3 ppm, so testing from 0.1-1 ppm may be a good idea. If we can find the highest level of GA3 that does not cause negative morphological affects on buds we would be golden, IMVHO anyway.


P.S. If anyone sees errors in my math or understanding of the studies please let me/us know.

:plant grow:
 

spurr

Active member
Veteran
@ DonkDBZ, OldMan&theWeed, Oswizzle:

Thanks so much for testing and reporting what you find. So far all of us have found similar results after application of jasmonates by looking, smelling and smoking; that is very good news. I look forward to reading DonkDBZ's results, and Xerhoss bought MeJA from phytotech labs, he will start testing soon too. That will make at least six people testing either MDHJ or MeJA (or both), and some also testing GA3...nice!

It's very cool we are on the cutting edge of application of science to cannabis growing. I have a feeling we are blazing a major trail and in the future using jasmonates will be the norm for cannabis growers. I just hope once fertilizer companies that market to cannabis growers catch up to us they don't start selling jasmonate products at crazy high price...YES, I AM TALKING TO YOU ADVANCED NUTRIENTS! ;)
 

spurr

Active member
Veteran
@ OldMan&theWeed and Oswizzle:

I cannot recall, did you tell us at what concentration you used GA3?
 

Latest posts

Latest posts

Top