Flowering problems, please help!

[3BM]

I'm stumped, I need some help.

The settup is organic soil in 3 gal nursery pots with drainage. Lighting is 600w HPS, aircooled hoods, plenty of circulation. Temperatures are 72-80F day, 62-65F night. Soil is promix BX with added mushroom compost, EW cast, sand, bark, and nutes: kelp meal, greensand, alfalfa meal, Indonesian guano, rainbowmix grow, dolomitic lime, and rock phosphate. Fed solubles infrequently (once a week or less) at concentrations around 500ppm

The problems began soon after flowering. Clones side by side show completely opposite effects. About 40-50% of clones show it, while others show very limited or nothing at all.

Heres a few pics:








This plant shows the more advanced form, both are around 4-5 weeks but the problems started earlier on this plant.




Bottom fans wilt, becoming soft, twisting w/ some yellowing. Transplanting the final pictured plant revealed a base of dry, dead root fibers. No discoloration, no odor.

Is this root death the result of over watering or compaction? The soil mix emphasized perlite, but the gardener may have poorly judged some water applications. None of these errors seemed drastic at the time, but could a cumulative effect lead to these symptoms?

Is this a recognizable disease or contamination?

If anyone has an idea, please post. Thanks for the time guys, I appreciate any input.

3BM

 

[sproutco]

Have you tested soil ph yet? Directions are in my signature. Are you adjusting the fert water ph after mixing?

 

[3BM]

soil pH is 7.0

watered with 6.3

 

[sproutco]

Ph is too high.

 

[Guest]

im no dirt grower but looks over fed to me

 

[3BM]

Talk more about that. How does high pH cause rootdeath sproutco

 

[sproutco]

Along with aiming for a lower ph, you might want to consider these possibilities:

The plant is wilted, even though the soil is moist. >> Over-fertilization, soggy soil, damaged roots, disease; copper deficiency (very unlikely).

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=24496&highlight=aquaman2112

 

[3BM]

Seeing the root system definitely seems to indicate it is damaged roots. What's your experience with damaged root systems? Can too high a pH damage roots like this? My experience with pH problems is an aray of lockouts, these plants are vigorous and green until the problems start creeping from bottom up.

 

[sproutco]

I don't know if we should consider your soil mix soilless. Promix surely is. Optimum ph in soilless mix is 5.6 to 6.2. In a soilless mix, micros except molybdenum and phosphorus dramatically decrease in solubility at higher ph's. You could end up with a phosphorus deficiency = reduced root growth. This could be a way the plant is affected. But, consider the other possibilities mentioned previously.

You added dolomite lime to your soil mix. Promix already has lime. How much did you add? You may have used too much lime if your ph is so high.

One authority I read suggests soil grows 6.2 - 6.8 and another suggests 5.8 - 6.5. So even if your using soil and not soilless then your ph is still high.

You can test soil ph accurately using the directions in my signature.

Excess ferts would show up probably as burned edges along bottom leaves
first.

Interestingly, your petioles on the infected leaves are purple.

Do you have a way to test electrical conductivity(ec) or total disolved salts (tds) in the runoff water? Directions are in my signature with the ph directions.

 

[3BM]

The soil tests around 6.9, and I typically water between 6.0 and 6.3. This would hit the range you describe. I add lime to the mix at around 1 cup/50gal. I use only 30% Promix. The ec is also in the range you suggest. Has anyone ever seen a problem like this in their own plants? I feel like the conditions are generally correct, and still I see these exponentially increasing problems. I have encountered over fert issues before, and they looked nothing like this. I fear there are a combination of small problems working together to create a larger issue.

I would to thank sprout and the others who have contributed for their prompt and helpful responses. I appreciate your input.

3BM

 

[sproutco]

Interestingly, your petioles on the infected leaves are purple.

I can't tell well. Has the stems turned redish purple too? I put an arrow on what I see. Click on it to enlarge.

 

[3BM]

Most stems remain green and healthy, petioles as you describe turn purple as lower leaves die off. None of the leaves dry out, rather they get soft and wilted and then never recover. The purpling you indicate was a N deficiency early in the plants life. Follow the branches up to new growth and you can see where it was corrected.

 

[sproutco]

Here is what Mynamestitch says about Phosphorus. I think the color can also be purple.

When your plants are deficient in phosphorus, this can overall reduce the size of your plants. Not enough causes slow growth and causes the plant to become weak, to little amount of Phosphorus causes slow growths in leaves that may or may not drop off. The edges all around the leaves or half of the leaves can be brownish and work its way inwards a bit causing the part of the leaves to curl up in the air a bit. Fan leaves will show dark greenish/purplish and yellowish tones along with a dullish blue color to them. Sometimes the stems can be red, along with red petioles that can happen when having a Phosphorus deficiency. This isn’t a sure sure sign of you having one though, but can be a sign. Some strains just show the red petioles and stems from its genes.
So pretty much the overall dark green color with a purple, red, or blue tint to the fan leaves is a good sign of a Phosphorus deficiency.

Dont go dumping phosphorus on just yet though. You may just have "lock out" from a high ph. Plus, you got root damage.

Your nights may be too cool. 62 f is kinda chilly.

Anybody else want to give some input?