Fan leaves go from green to crispy in 3-4 days

[otherwhitemeat]

Gang, I've been in 12/12 for about 28 days now and things have been going pretty good. Then the last week or so I am getting premature yellowing on some fan leaves, some leaves go from green to yellow to crispy in days. I know I am supposed to lose some fan leaves during flowering, but this is happening very quickly. Since this is my first grow, I have no idea if this is normal or not but the pace at which I am losing leaves (about 2-3 per day) is sort of alarming. I was just told that I should have been feeding veggie nutes until about 2 weeks into 12/12 but I didn't do that (newb) Could this be a N deficiency, overfeeding? Just have no clue! Would love to hear any input!

SOIL:
What STRAIN are you growing? BAGSEED
What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?) SEED
What is the age of your plants? ABOUT 3 MONTHS
How Tall are the plants? 2-3 FEET AVERAGE
What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? FLOWER
What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc) NATURAL
What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot) 2 GAL-1 PER POT, hols in bottom a and clay pot pieces for drainage
What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you using?(percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?) FFOF STRAIGHT UP
What Nutrient's are you using?How much of each with how much water? How Often? *Knowing the brand is very helpful* EACH PLANT GETS ABOUT 1-1.5L every 3-4 days, use 1 capful of Botanicare PBP Bloom each watering or every other water
What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used? Don't Know
What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"? 6.8-7.0
What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen? pH pen, about 6.8
How often are you watering? Every 3-4 days
When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding? About 3 days ago, feeding with each watering
What size bulb are you using? 250 W HPS
What is the distance to the canopy? 6-12 inches, varies
What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity) About 30%
What is the canopy temperature? About 85
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range) 80-85 F day, 70 F night
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.) 4 in Can Fan going 24x7 with a small muffin fan to keep air moving
Is the fan blowing directly at plants? pretty much
Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist? Not really, moist for 2 days, dry for 1, then they get water
Is your water HARD or SOFT? Water is pretty neutral, but tending towards hardness
What water are you using? Reverse Osmosis (RO)? Tap? Bottled? Well water? Distilled? Mineral Water? Tap, sits for 24-48 hours to dechlorinate
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched? No
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when? No
Are plant's infected with pest's? No

 

[Queso45]

It looks to me like you're feeding them too much. One of the pro's will help you out better, but I don't think you should be giving them that much PBP every 3 days.

 

[sirgrassalot]

These pictures appear to be suffering from the same thing....Phosphorus deficiency during vegetative growth. Than they'll get nice & crispy burnt.

This yellowing appears to be lack of light & the early stages of nitrogen deficiency around the lower part of the plant which will be normal in bloom.

I believe both could be fixed with some fish emulsion. You have about 35 days to go a little shot won't hurt with your next feed. "I should have been feeding veggie nutes until about 2 weeks into 12/12", correct. Pots are very light when you're watering them right.

 

[otherwhitemeat]

Queso, I was doing so well for a while perhaps I was guilty I loving them TOO much. A common newbie mistake, I am told. I am going to start with feeding every other watering and see if this helps a bit.

grassalot, are yours suffering from P deficiency? Your pics are similar but don't appear to be going through the intermediate stage of yellowing first. I think this may be a significant difference. The leaves that are doing this are primarily the lower fans, but some are also yellowing at the top of my canopy. Once the yellowing starts the entire compound leaf set is crispy within about 2 days. Even those in full view of the HPS (about 10-12" away)

Thanks guys, for the input so far. They are going to get straight water today and no nutes for a few days to see if that slows the die-off

 

[sirgrassalot]

The leaf I posted IS suffering from P deficiency from the sick guide...see sticky above postings. But I don't think it goes through a yellowing stage, the similarity is why I posted it. I'm leaning toward over watering or under/over feeding. The quick die off = overfed.

"PBP Bloom each watering or every other water"
A cap every other or every watering doesn't seem like a lot of nutes. I'm a free pour guy how bigs the cap??? I feed every watering but I'm using promix.

Any of the greener growth have anything happening the odd burn here or there any slight discolouring?

 

[MynameStitch]

Your plants are deficienct in nitrogen, they need more of it, not phsphorus problem he has plenty of it and his pH is within good range so all available nutrinets are able to be taken in. He has no nitrogen and the plant is showing it.

Use some nitrogen with your bloom fert, depending on which one you have post it here and I can give you a dosage, you use 1/2 the amount you would of used in veg, they don't need a lot of it, but the plant is short on it and they still need small amounts of nitrogen in flowering.

 

[whatsthatsmell]

To add to what Stitch has mentioned, try and get that canopy temp down a little bit, your running on the extreme high side, i personally would be uncomfortable with the canopy temps of 85, and also with a 15 degree swing from lights on to lights off the plant will not use the nutes effiecently, try and get that to be a 10degree swing at the most. Now there are 2 different schools of thought on the temps so your gonna have to go with what you are comfy with. Here is an example of what i am talking about, i am going to use my temps for this. I know theres gonna be some people who tell me to raise my temps, but trust me, i'm not that new at this. My veg runs 24x7 with lights on and i keep the temp at 74. When i flip the switch (move to another room) my temps are completely different and here is where people will say otherwise. My temps with lights on are at 74 and with the lights off i can get the temps down to 65. Now, yes they do grow slower, however, i have no proof of this, but it seems as i get the temps lower i can grow a stronger flower. They do use less water at lower temps so when it comes time to ripen them, i switch to another room where the temps are almost 80 with the lights on (more lights in this room), and are down to 74 with the lights off. My buds are dense, strong, have a crap load of flavor.

Now all this is just an opinion and something to think about when your looking at your temps. Also, the lower temps will bring out the colors, and people who look at your bag will be drooling and say "Hey thats purple haze" or "hey, thats purple soandso, i would know that from anywhere".....i personally get a nice chuckle out of it.

Hope that helps ya tho.

 

[otherwhitemeat]

mynamestitch, thank you very much for the insight. Can I use my Botanicare Veg for the Nitrogen deficiency or should I add something else? I do have access to a hydro shop and can get whatever I need. I'll give my girls ANYTHING! Do you think that I am overfeeding or perhaps just not going a few weeks into 12/12 with veg ferts was the issue?


whatthatsmell, thanks for insight I agree that my temps need to go down. the 250 is a bit big for the cab, but I am going to get a bigger cab with more vents shortly. For now I am just leaving the doors open and it seems to get down to about 83

Thanks everyone for your help. I wouldn't have gotten this far without the knowledge of everyone here, hopefully someday I'll pass it on!

 

[otherwhitemeat]

The leaf I posted IS suffering from P deficiency from the sick guide...see sticky above postings. But I don't think it goes through a yellowing stage, the similarity is why I posted it. I'm leaning toward over watering or under/over feeding. The quick die off = overfed.

"PBP Bloom each watering or every other water"
A cap every other or every watering doesn't seem like a lot of nutes. I'm a free pour guy how bigs the cap??? I feed every watering but I'm using promix.

Any of the greener growth have anything happening the odd burn here or there any slight discolouring?

No tip burn or anything like that, just green to yellow to crispy in 3-4 days.


Yanno, I just use the cap that came with the bottle. It says to use about 30mL/gal every other or even every feeding. The cap is about 15-20 mL and I dump it into a 3L soda bottle of water after the water sits for 2 days. Each plant gets about 1.5L every 3 days or so and was doing fine right up until this week.

It's weird some leaves look healthy and green and some just yellow and die QUICKLY. It looks alot like N deficiency based on the guide. I gave it 1/2 strength Botanicare PBP Veg this time and we'll see if that slows the die off or makes things worse. I still have about 3-4 weeks left. I anticipated some yellow leaves, but my feeling is this happening too quickly and happening too early in flowering. It's oddly consistent among the 4 plants, they are assorted bagseeds and obviously different strains, and they are all going through the same stress.

Next watering, I think I'll flush and then go back to every other watering with the PBP Bloom ferts.

 

[sirgrassalot]

I believe you're on the right track. As in my first post a little N should do. Your plants do look healthy even with the few leaves that are visibly yellowing in your picture of the plant. I don't know about the flush unless they get worse, otherwise just return to your bloom schedule.

I have some harvesting tonight myself, grow on.