Drooping after transplant

[Deadly Fear]

Hi all, this is my first grow and my second transplant. Finally got everything I need for the soil I want so I transplanted it about an hour ago.

Have Miracle Gro organic soil, perlite, earthworm castings, and seabird/bat guano in the mix. Since I added the plants to the new soil they have been extremely droopy and rubbery. I haven't watered them in 2 days (which was not a good thing to do) so maybe they just need more time to soak up the water? I watered them after replanting.

Here's how they look now. The lights are usually closer but the plants are drooping:

Plants

Should I expect to see some improvement soon?

 

[Desiderata]

DF, you have not watered them in good enough, especially since you stated they were dry when you transplanted. That was the first thing I learned when transplanting was to water the pot until water comes out the bottom of the pot. It sets the transplant. All roots and soil become one.

Yep, I would water them more. Some B-1 rooting hormone solution would help also. Plus you have some fairly strong ferts in there too with your organic MG.

 

[sunnyside]

it happens..no worries. They will perk up before too long

 

[Deadly Fear]

Ok it's a new day and they do not seem as rubbery. The tops are still flimsy but they look better than yesterday. Hopefully today will be even better

 

[Desiderata]

Here's your answer from FAQ:

How can I tell whether my drooping plant is overwatered or underwatered?
Added by: administrator Viewed: 782 times Rated by 23 users: 7.86/10
Leaves that are drooping from underwatering will look limp and lifeless.

Leaves that are drooping from overwatering will be firm and curled down, even from the stem of the leaf.
Last modified: 17:55 - Feb 25, 2003

 

[Deadly Fear]

Yeah I knew they needed water I just didn't know if it was a bad combination with transplanting them. Thanks for the info

 

[Desiderata]

It seems the consensus about transplanting shock is way over rated. That's why I was focusing on the amount of water you gave them after transplant.

I'm in the middle of transplanting babies, clones, and 2nd week of 12/12 revegged mother plants. That's why this is a good restudy for me also. I had a transplant baby last winter that drooped completely over. I thought I had given it ample water. So I experimented by totally watering it in and it perked up in one hour, the whole baby was waving her arms!........

 

[Deadly Fear]

Yeah, that's what's got me concerned. It's been about 20 hours and they're still not back to normal. But I'm sure it could be attributed to a lot of things as this is my first grow, hehe.

I'll update later today to see how they are faring.

 

[Desiderata]

You got it! :smile:

 

[MynameStitch]

what kind of MG soil did you use??

and how much of the added castings and guano did you mix with it?

what is the soil. ratio castings and guano mixture?

they droop all the time after a good watering they perk right back up later on after alot of the water is soaked

but the point im concerned is how old these plants are and what size container did you transplant from to?

the mixture is very strong dfepending on the kind of MG soil you used... which possibly you may have some more problems down the road from the soil mixture being to strong

 

[Deadly Fear]

Hm I'm not great at ratios but I can give you an idea of how much I used.

Have 3 plants each in one 12 inch pot.

Used Miracle Grow organic soil (2 big bags filled up the 3 pots).
Added 1 lb bag of worm castings into each.
Small brown bag of bat guano was spread over all three. (around this size but different guano):
about this size
Also added two big two-handed scoops of perlite in each pot.

The plants are at least a month old, probably a few days older than that. They are slowly perking back up, at different rates. Also, I transplanted from 12 inch to the same 12 inch pots, just wanted to get a different soil mixture in there. Had miracle gro soil (regular kind) in there until 2 weeks ago, and since then it's been all organic miracle gro. Only thing inorganic is the perlite I think. Also have an organic tea that will be ready to go tomorrow, they're sure to love that :wink:

 

[Desiderata]

Hold on a second,..... that Jamaican Bat Guano even though it's 1-10-1 , you spread 12lbs of it between the 3 pots. But you used two bags of MG too. Still that sure seems like overkill with the guano, if that is the amount used. The Organic Soil thread has a lot of recent posts, especially by LavenderCowboy on organic mixes and the proper amount/ratios of amendments to use. It will help form a reliable formula that's safe.

 

[Deadly Fear]

No, I said it's different guano. It was a mix of seabird/bat and it was in a small brown bag. It was maybe 1-2 pounds tops.

Just checked on them. Stems seem to be back to normal on all 3, if not a little rubbery. Leaves are decent on 2, but still pretty soft and wilted on the third. Not sure when to water again, what would be safe, a few days?

 

[Desiderata]

Sorry about that. Well good it was the seabird, it has lots of N too.

Okay, well assuming you have not given any additional water since transplant, normally it could take 4-5 days to kick in producing new growth. So it can be a week or more depending on the size of pot and plant before more water is needed. Do not feed them for two weeks because you have plenty of nutrients in there.

How does the weight of the wilted plant compare to the other two (pots)? Does it need water? If you have a dry pocket in there that will cause some parts of the plant to wilt. A moisture meter from Home Depot or Lowes (7-8 bucks) would tell you.

My question is, did you give them any more water after the transplanting watering in? If not, it won't hurt to try on the wilted one to see if it will perk up. They can be wilted for a day without any harm done. After that it's a gamble. I found a couple of wilted water clones yesterday. After giving more water, one perked up, the other didn't.

 

[Deadly Fear]

I gave them a bunch of water when I transplanted. Haven't given them anything since but the topsoil is pretty crumbly now. I'll make sure to get that meter next time I'm out.

The one plant is really acting weird. When it was first transplanted it's stem was the worst, it really felt like rubber. This was the healthiest plant before the transplant. Now the stem is just about back to normal but the leaves are soft and very wilted. Hopefully it picks up, I'd hate to lose this one.

Oh, I have a EW casting tea, would that be alright to give them for watering? I know you said no more nutes but this is a pretty light tea.

 

[Desiderata]

DF, your plant might be suffering shock from being in a soiless mix originally and then being transplanted into a very rich organic soil. That will cause shock. Sounds like you gave them plenty of water. I would flush that one with plain water. That guano is very very strong, Verite said it was very Alkaline too. !-2lbs spread among 3 pots is a heavy dose.

What's your PH and room temp?

 

[Desiderata]

Just for the record:

GrowFAQ :Why do I need to transplant?
Added by: MedMan Last edited by: snoofer Viewed: 491 times Rated by 16 users: 9.27/10
Contributed by: Thurgood Jenkins

Roots grow outward for stability, so they naturally collect at the edges of the container and leave much of the soil in the middle of the pot unused. This will cause slowed growth because the roots may restrict each other. Transplanting allows for a more efficient root mass, as the space in the middle of the final container will be used.

Allowing the roots to collect at the edges of your 1-gallon pot, will ensure a more efficient root mass when transplanting to a 3-gallon pot. Each time you transplant, you can also bury the plant up to the first node or branch to shorten it's overall height.

Added by: Kunta wears a sarong

It might be worth mentioning that you can bury the plant low or high in the pot you are transplanting to as well; that way all your plants will start off being the same height. Transplanting high might be a good idea for patio growers in high rainfall conditions - this will help drainage.

When
Transplanting should be done a day after watering because moist roots and soil (not soaking wet or bone dry) will slide out of the old pot easier. The soil will hold together better, and less root damage will occur.

How
You should loosen the root bound roots from the bottom and lower sides of the root ball by teasing them out loosely and gently - this will help the transition. if there are too many hanging down after teasing, then it is ok to cut or tear a few handfuls of roots away. If the roots are wrapped around the root ball in the shape of the original pot, then it's best to cut these away to promote faster root penetration into the new pot.

Timing
The secret is the timing of the transplant; you want when the roots have filled the original pot, but before the roots have wrapped around and the plant has become root bound.

The danger of transplanting too early is that when you up can the pot and lift off the pot some of the soil and young roots may become damaged due to the fact that there is insufficient amount of roots to hold all the soil together.

The danger of waiting too long before transplanting is that growth will slow, as the plant has insufficient root room to match the above ground growth – ultimately yielding less. In addition, micro deficiencies, dehydration and other problems occur more frequently with root bound plants. Root-bound plants also take awhile to become vigorous again.

My Technique
My preferred method of transplanting is to moisten the pots I'm going to transplant, moisten the new soil at the bottom of the new pots with a garden mister (the pump up models are best - misters are by far the best way to moisten the soil because they act like rain and do not compact the soil).

Mist each 3-inch layer of soil - lightly sprinkle around the old root ball in the new pot - this will create the best conditions for new growth. Roots will reach out and grow much faster into a light, airy moist soil than the compacted mud created by a hose or watering can to wet down the soil

I believe that many problems are caused initially by compacting the soil.

Lightly moisten your soil before and after transplanting. If a lot of water is pouring out of the holes in the bottoms of your pots when transplanting, then you are probably over wetting the soil and creating soil compaction.

Tips:
If your soil is lacking in soil conditioners (e.g. sand, rock gravel, perlite, vermiculite etc) and the roots have penetrated the new soil - then water again. In normal conditions this would be 4 - 7 days after transplanting. Try to emulate the natural action of rain: pump up misters, watering wands, sprinkler type watering cans are best - forget about using a hose as this may compact the soil and it is also very easy to over water (quickly leaching out nutrients from the soil).

All the soil mix ingredients should be mixed in dry.... never stir or mix wet soil mixes, as they will turn to useless mud.
Last modified: 17:24 - May 31, 2001
GrowFAQ © 2000-2004 Overgrow
faq:993 "Why do I need to transplant?"

 

[Desiderata]

I'm adding this other FAQ because it brings up other good reminders about why we transplant. Root Bound:.....we can use this as a reference in the future.

What is root-bound?
Added by: MedMan Viewed: 100 times Rated by 12 users: 8.82/10
Root-bound is where the roots of your plant outgrow the container they are contained in.

The following symptoms may be observed if you allow your plants to become root-bound:
Stunted Growth.


Stretching.


Smaller and slower bud production.


Needs watering too often.


Easy to burn with low % nutrient solution mixtures.


Wilting.


Here are two ways to remove your plant:
Before you start, always run a transplanting trowel or a long, flexible knife (dedicated for gardening only) between the old pot and your plant's root-ball.

For a root-bound plant with a strong, woody stem: hold the stem firmly and lift up so the pot is off the ground. Tap down around the pot rim with a rubber hammer or piece of wood until the pot lets go.

Another way is to turn the plant and pot upside down, holding the plant so it won't crash on the ground when it comes free of the pot. Make sure there's enough clearance to the ground, or you'll smash your plant. (One way to do this: cut a cardboard disk the size of the pot opening, cut a slit to accommodate the plant stem and slip the disk over the top of the pot before turning the pot upside down). Have your friend or family member pull upward on the pot. If you're working alone, tap the rim down on the edge of a table or bench. You may have to do this all around the rim before the roots let go of the pot. (The plant may come free from the pot all at once, so hold on!)

Once you've freed the plant from its old pot, inspect its roots, if the roots run in a tight circle around the outside of the root ball, you got there just in time. Dig your fingers into the outside 1/2" of these circular roots, loosen the ends up and pull them gently outward. If the roots are very tight, cut two or three 1/2" incisions from top to bottom on the outside of the root-ball. (Space the cuts around the root-ball.) This process may seem cruel, but it gives the roots an opportunity to stop their circular growth habit and begin to grow outward.

If the roots are extremely tight, slice a thin layer off the outside of the entire root-ball. Set the root-ball into its new pot, hold the foliage out of the way and add soil. Do not forcefully pack this new soil as you want the soil to be settled (with no air pockets) but loose enough to allow root penetration. One way to achieve this is to water the new soil in layers as you add it and this is also a great time to add SUPERTHRIVE.

Do not cover the top of the root-ball with a thick layer of new soil; IMO the surface of the old root-ball should also be the surface in the new pot. Once your plant is settled into its new pot, clean the foliage as dust keeps light from reaching the leaves and makes the plant more susceptible to mites and other pests. Make sure all H.I.D lights are switched off and give your indoor plant a shower in lukewarm water or dust the leaves with a soft, damp cloth.

Outdoor plants can be sprayed with a garden hose or spray bottle. If the potting soil you used doesn't contain fertilizer and you didn't add a root stimulator/fertilizer solution, give the plant a light feeding of diluted fertilizer. It is important that your newly re-potted plant receives the right level of light, newly re-potted plants will suffer if placed directly under your H.I.D lights or in direct sunlight. It may take a up to 2 weeks for your plant to become accustomed to its new accommodations so until you begin to see signs of new growth use reduced levels of light.
Last modified: 15:54 - Jul 05, 2001
GrowFAQ © 2000-2004 Overgrow
faq:1083 "What is root-bound?"

I got my rubber hammer out!

 

[Deadly Fear]

Not sure of the temp but it's cool in there. Only a vague sense of heat when you open the door. I've never done a pH test before; have all 3 soil samples waiting to dry overnight. I will have the results tomorrow.

Two of the plants look fine but the third one is acting weird now. A lot of the top leaves are curled and dried (basically dead) but the ones on the bottom are doing ok. Should I prune the dead ones? Or some other ones? Or just leave them alone?

Here's a pic:

Poor baby

 

[Desiderata]

I would wait to trim any dead crispy crumbly leaves until the plant has perked up more AND you see new growth, or new full leaves. Because we don't want to stress/shock her any more than she already is. That girl is tuff because she sure is trying to hang on to dear life. Hang in there bro, time is all we have now for your babies.

If you are going to be more serious with growing you need to know temperatures and soil PH, plus some idea of humidity. What about a fan too?

This is how you get started.