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DIY Co2 Generator

Einsteinguy

Member
Due to the limitations of the usual Do It Yourself CO2 generating method, in which yeast growing in a bottle of sugar water produces CO2 according to its age, temperature, and mood. This simply doesn't allow enough control over the gas output. If the yeast is old, cold, or lazy, you get lackluster performance. The goal here was to build an enhanced version of the traditional DIY CO2 system that while still cheap and fairly simple, provides MUCH greater control over CO2 output, and that even allows for control by Co2 measuring equipment should one eventually choose to do so. Having a reservoir of CO2 in the balloon means that much less vigilance over the fermentation process is required. There are also no expensive and hard to find high-pressure cylinders, regulators, needle valves, or solenoid valves. And there are no trips to the welding supply shop for refills.

The Basic Setup
The system consists of the standard two/three liter soda pop bottle fermenter, connected to an air pump distribution manifold with air tubing. This manifold feeds both a Mylar balloon (the reservoir), and a small aquarium air pump. Put a small bottle for a bubble counter and filter between fermenter and air manifold. Also you can use more than one fermenter this lets you swap and get more Co2 per day.



The Bubble counter
This is a good way to monitor Co2 production and filter for overflow of fermenter.


The Balloon Reservoir
Since Mylar balloons leak Helium so slowly, I'm assuming that CO2 molecules, being larger, will pass through even more slowly, and that air will be slow to pass into the balloon gas reservoir from the outside. How much this diffusion of air and CO2 through the Mylar and attached tubing would affect the reservoir CO2 concentration over a long period of time is unknown, but it hasn't been a problem so far. Needless to say, a rubber balloon won't do; it's simply too porous.

Very Important
Mylar balloons seem to have some sort of valve mechanism (Mylar flaps that push shut under pressure) inside the balloon so that gas can flow in but not out. Be sure to place the tubing into the balloon far enough so it gets past this valve -- about 6 inches or so. If the tubing is in far enough, air blown into the balloon will be come back out when the balloon is squeezed. Seal the tubing in place with aquarium sealant, Shoe Goo, Tape or whatever.

Pressure Release
If the pressure in the fermenter/balloon/lines gets too high some sort of pressure release mechanism is needed. If the pressure from the fermenter should get too high (i.e. the balloon is completely full) the excess CO2 just leaks out around the press-fit lines or pops red safety plug on manifold.

The Air Pump and Its Enclosure
The air pump is placed in a sealed container to keep air from leaking into the pump housing and mixing with the CO2. Putting the pump in a sealed container has an added advantage: it significantly reduces pump noise, especially if it is set on a balled-up piece of cloth to provide some mechanical isolation.



Air tight connections on your bottle caps.
This is simple. Use a drill bit that is smaller than tubing. (If it fits tight inside tubing it is just about right). After drilling hole cut tubing at a sharp angle on end 45 degrees or more. Use pliers to pull tubing through hole.

Off at Night
In my setup, the AC power for the air pump comes from the timer that controls the lights, so CO2 delivery stops at lights out.

Yeast Recipe
2 cups sugar, 1 tsp yeast, 1 tsp baking powder, 1 vitamin B pill

Directions
Place small amount hot water in bottom of bottle then pour in sugar. Shake well to dissolve sugar. Fill bottle with cool water two to three inches from top. Take temp of sugar water it should be 80 degrees or below. Add baking power and vitamin pill (some people do not use these two ingredients) Shake well. Pour yeast in and Do not shake it will lay on top and slowly sink into water. Do not shake fermenter after this it is not necessary and can cause it to overflow. Fermenter will also pull water out of bubble counter if squeezed.

The only maintenance required is recharging the fermenter bottle when the bubbles slow down. In bubble counter an advantage of this system is that since the quantity of CO2 going into the room isn't dependent on the state of the fermenter, you don't have to pay very close attention to how things are going in the bottle. You'll want to have a look at the pump every now and then to see how the diaphragm is holding up.

Einstein :wave:
 

Speedy

New member
How much CO2 can realistically be created using the system you are showing? Thanks for the write up. This is the kind of DIY shit I love here at ICmag!
-Request - A diagram of the whole process.
 

PHB

Member
Great post Einsteinguy! I also agree that diagram of the process and materials list would also be great. Where did you get the air manifold? Also, what does the baking powder and vitamin b do?

Thanks,
PHB
 
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G

Guest

Having grown with co2 for years and it taking nearly that long to get right lol,there are a few things about it you must understand before embarking on one of these co2 projects.I hope people take this in the spirit its intended,I'm not trying to dismiss any ideas just putting info out there that has taken me a long time to understand.Before co2 enrichment is even introduced,you must make sure you environment is ready for it.With co2 everything has to be basically perfect including the method of enrichment,just letting extra co2 into a room accomplishes nothing.The environment to want is 85-90 F ambient room temps,I like to read 85 at the tips of my cola's with a lazer thermometer,some like it 5-10 degrees warmer.Humidity must be kept under control so in sealed rooms a dehumid is a must,I set mine at 40%RH 24/7 and use the water.You must have 50 watts sq ft,this is as important as temps and humidity.The absolute most important thing I've fopund about enrichment is you must have a way to determine and control PPM's,if you dont you are not enriching the plants.It takes some time for the plants to take advantage of the co2 enrichment,so a PPM swing of over 300 is ill advised.I grew with a 100 dollar cyclestat for years which controls length and duration of burn according to room cu footage,its totally blind to foliage which is its downfall.The PPM swings are normally just too much also.I really didnt start to see the real advantages until I got a controller.A controller recognises foliage and ambient co2 levels unlike a cyclestat,and thus uses much less propane.Also no more than a 300PPM swing occurs when using a controller(CAP PPM-3 anyway),a cap is your least expensive controller.The way it works is this.My setpoint is 1500PPM.When ambient levels drop to 1450 the generator kicks in and burns until setpoint(1500) although the co2 level rise rise to 1700PPM normally before slowly dropping back down to 1450,where again the generator kicks in.Small oscillators pointing upwards ensures maximum usage of available co2 also.I use much less propane with the controller as opposed to the cyclestat.My co2 level when lights come on is normally close to 2500PPM,so my generator doesnt kick in until the level drops to 1450 which takes hours and hours.On the cyclestat timer,my co2 would come on when the lights came on.I knew no better.I was overdosing them girls sure as shit lol.Not to confuse anyone,I said a swing of over 300 PPM is not a good idea.Why then would I let my growday start with 2500PPM when I know its eventually going to drop to 1450,a larger swing than the recommended 300 PPM?Thats a good question,half the time I turn on the fart fan in the ceiling for a few minutes to bring levels down to around 1800,sometimes I dont.I'd like to hear from experienced users on that subject.It takes literally half the day for the PPMs to go from 2500 to 1450,that saves a ton of propane.On the other hand,it goes against what I've realized about co2 enrichment.Also,at 2500 PPM I dont really know if the extra is just wasted or if I really should bring the level down a skosh every morning.
 
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Off

Member
That's a big help bob, do you happen to have a link for the CAP you're talking about? Also, is it as effective if placed outside a veg and flower cab?... Or would it be more efficient getting one for the inside of each cab? Thanks.
 
G

Guest

Shit go to thread below 2000-2400W sealed thred go to bottom of page three pico has link posted that works
 

Einsteinguy

Member
ATTN: If pump runs and balloon is emtpy or output plugged. the air pump will suck from fermenter causing it to collapse and such in the fluid, The air pump then becomes a fluid pumps and first fills the jar then flows out the output line.
:1help:

PHB - Yes I need to give a shout out to the aquarium guys. I got the ideas from them. Even this pic I hacked and edited.:wink: The Baking powder and vitamin are for the yeast to live longer.



Speedy - I am testing right now, I have changed to 3 1 Gal fermenters I am getting about 4 mins worth of Co2 per day. Not sure how much this is but I am working on quantifying it more.

Smiling Bob - Small Scale Cab Growers like my can always use a little Co2 enrichment. Allot of people put a fermenter in their grow area to add Co2. My goal was to control the co2 so it would not be wasted while fan was on and at night. Right now I am giving them a 3 minute shot first thing in morning before fan turns on. I disagree just letting extra co2 into a room accomplishes nothing. It raises the available co2 closer to outside environment. At least thats what I keep telling myself :chin:

I am looking at HVAC co2 controller like the telaire 7000 or 8000 series. Might be an inexpensive way to control co2 .

Einstein :wave:
 
G

Guest

If only co2 monitors were as cheap as carbon monoxide monitors,growers would know exactly how much especially vegging and stretching plants produce co2 during the dark hours,half of us may seal our vegrooms and possibly flower rooms.I'll have an exact co2 reading when lights go out tonight and I'll take a reading when the lights come on,my burner is off so it'll just be plant co2.Being I have 20 nearly finished and only six stretching,it probably wont go up too much.I've walked into 2500PPM many a morning though when the rooms full of stretching plants and the burners going,should be interesting to see how much the plants will make and how long it'll take to use.Damn non-existent cheap co2 monitors grr arrr expressions of anger..
 

PHB

Member
Thanks Einsteinguy. Have you ever measured the PPM of your cabinet with this setup? It would be really interesting to see how much O2 is produced and distributed to the cab.

Thanks,
PHB
 
G

Guest

Co2 levels were 580PPM lights out and 725PPM lights on,apparently nearly finished plants ustilize very little co2,they make very little during the dark hours.I imagine all the co2 was produced by the 6 stretching WW a few weeks in,had all 25 plants been newly flowering PPms would have been much higher.Maybe not 2500PPM because part of that is my burner,but pretty close I'm sure
 
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