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Despie
OK guys I have been toying with this idea for about a year now. I am a 3 year HVAC tech. The HVAC equipment of today is waaaaay over engineered and I wanted to Create something simple but extremely Effective!.
I am going to try and explain this in simple terms that everybody can understand. Keep in mind this setup is not for the grow room penny pinchers! IMO you must spend money to make money. If you are a rec grower then this setup is prop not for you because it cost $800. But it you are a grow room connoisseur and like things high tech and aren't afraid to spend a little cash this is for you!
First of all let me explain a little about conventional AC. And AC unit runs off a compressor. This compressor is 100% powered by electricity. they are typically 1200watts at start-up and runs a constant 1000watts (depending on BTU rating) but this is the most common scenario. Some people try to tap there Central AC into there grow room but this is useless as in most case's the thermostat is upstairs or in another room.
Others use "window bangers" AC units which sit in a window. These are ok but in a sensitive temp room like a grow room these are extremely power consuming and very unconventional! Remember what I said about the compressor! 1200 watts at start up. a window banger is not meant to turn off an on as often as a grow room would demand. the spike every time that juice pig starts up will make your elec bill go sky high. Another problem with them is they have an internal stat which is right on the unit! Obviously the air around the unit is going to be cooler then the other side of the room! But the unit is taking the signal from its internal stat. Point is in a grow room they are very inaccurate and will not give u a try temp of the entire room!
What I have built is made up of different controls and tech from 3 different pieces of HVAC equipment. This system works best in the Fall, Winter and Spring as out side air is extremely cooled But also works quite well in the summer because of the "core" ill get to that later though!
To understand how this system works we must first understand the primitive basics of how AC works! R-22 or HIGH EFF R-410A refrigerant is the life blood of AC. You can compare it to the oil in your car. When it is under high pressure it becomes a HOT gas approx 72 psi on the gauges. When is is under lower pressure 32 psi on the gauges it is a cool liquid gas. With out getting to technical when the outside air passes the hot coil it takes all the heat out of the refrigerant and the compressor pumps that refrigerant to the condensing coil (inside the house) The fan inside blows WARMER inside air passed the inside coil condensing the and thus creating Air conditioning. If you did not understand that all you must understand is that AC is created by condensing. This is why your AC creates water! So just to recap we now understand cool air is created by condensing a copper coil charged with Refrigerant which is in its cold liquid gas state.
The idea was to create AC which is primitive in design and uses as much energy as a old school light bulb 100watts NOT 1200! Most people just have a intake fan and out take fan (some don't even have this
) this is extremely important for plants fresh air is a major key to success and any old school grower will tell u this. I don't consider myself old school but i have been in the game for 8 years on and off. The problem is you cant control the temps with conventional fans! unless u feel like sitting in your room all day! another problem is your room will only cool to whatever the outside air temp is....sooo if your running 3 1000watt hps in the middle of the summer its pointless only good for an air change but odds are your room is hotter then it is outside. And vice versa in the winter if its -30 c you run the risk of bringing in to much cold air. and this air in all seasons is 100% depended on what it is outside. We must understand plants don't like drastic changes in temp. they prefer a routine which never changes and stays the same or close to it. People may say "well outdoor plants can handle magor changes in temp" yes there right but these are NOT outdoor plants....there indoor its like having a wild animal in captivaty...there more dependent.
Now lets get down to business! This is an HRV or also known as a "heat recovery ventilator". They are used to introduce 100% fresh air into a central air and heat system. I'm not going to get into how it works in a that application because it does not concern us. But that's what they are designed for. They work off of humidity and NOT TEMP! we are concerned with temp because we want cool air!
There are four ports. A fresh air to inside port, a stale air to outside port, a stale air from inside port and a fresh air from outside port. There is one 100watt fan inside which simaltantiously sucks air from outside to in and exhausts the stale air from in the room to outside. The picture diagram shows the movement of air.
See the diamond in the middle which separates the four compartments? this is the core....the heart of the system. the core is made up of tiny slots which will only let air pass one way from the top right compartment (fresh outside air in) to the bottom right compartment (fresh COLD air into the room port). Now heres where it gets tricky! the slots in the core also let air pass from the top right compartment (stale HOT stinky air from inside) to the bottom left compartment (stale HOT air to outside).
Now remember back to what we learned about conventional energy sucking air-conditioning. We have just created AC with a single 100 watt fan motor.
Ok I know what your thinking now! Despie you didn't invent anything! you just wasted 20 mins of my time explaining to me how an hrv works! WRONG! The innovation I have came up with lets us control the temp! remember I told u an HRV is run of a humistat! not a thermostat! an HRV will not give you the same results just in a regular house because the inside air in a house is never as hot as it is in a grow room. This works for us growers only because our lights through off so much heat and make our exhaust HOT then the core lets that HOT air pass through the core which also has COLD air passing in the opposite direction, CONDENSING the air and creating AC. We want to control the temp!!!! and not at the unit like a window banger at the central part of the room!
I hooked up the HRV to a White Rogers fan relay.
Fan relays where commonly used in older central furnace and AC units. They are what control the fan control on your thermostat. if you don't want to heat or cool but rather just have an air change in your house. The fan relay is controlled by a thermostat which has been placed on the opposite side of the room in a central area. So lets just say we set our thermostat for 72
Once the thermostat hits 72 it sends a 24volt signal to the fan relay which closes a contactor which has broken the power to the HRV. So here is where another Key benefit of my system comes into play! we are only using 24 volts which is not even a watt of energy to start up the system VS. the 1200 watts it takes to start a conventional AC because of the compressor! no compressor, no energy spike! Also we must remember when we are trying to control a temp it extreme conditions like a grow room our cooling system weather is a conventional AC or my system is going to be turning on and off quite frequently because there is no such thing as a thermostat the will keep a temp say for example in between 68 and 72. They can only keep one temp and that's it. So for us growers this means it turning on and off and on and off etc etc.
Another benefit is the exhausted air is now cooler because it has passed the colder fresh air coming in thus making it extremely less stinky.
So for those of you who are wondering how well it will work in the dead of summer heres your answer. its infact the opposite of winter/spring/fall operation. the room is obviously going to create allot more heat when it is hotter outside. This air is much much more hot then what the actually outside air temp is. So again we have cold air passing hot condensing and air creating AC.
I will add to this thread as I think of more good points. If anyone has any questions or if there is any confusion I would be glad to answer them and clarify anything.
I am still working on the wire diagrams and general set info but I just wanted to share this break through in G room EFF! Save power money and be safe!
Just to recap the features of this set-up
-Acts as an air handler introducing fresh air
-Exhausts stale air
-Cuts down on exhaust stink and in a small grow room eliminates it
-Only 100watts to run
-Controls temp automatically extremely accurately
-Will pay for its self within 2 crops in hydro savings VS regular AC
-No spike in electrical current
This is my set-up
I added 2 inline booster fans which are wired in series with the HRV and are also controlled simultaneously with the fan relay. My stale air out is hooked up to a charcoal filter as u see in the picture. That filter was $350 but it eliminates ALL smell. I can be smoking a joint beside it and the exhaust air out side smells like clean fresh air.
happy plants 7 days since clones rooted
system hatch closed. this is what it looks like during normal operation
close up....plants with ample fresh air are happier plants!
Just to break it down for you price wise.
HRV: $450
Fan Relay: $100
Thermostat: $30
Wire/Vent/other:100
boosterfans:100
-----------------------
$780
you can make it more primitive for a smaller one light op and only buy the HRV, Thermostat, building materials and Fan relay which would only cost $680.
Still cheaper then a split system and use's nowhere near the same elec. And it does alot more then just cool!
Wiring diagrams to come with in the next two days!
Stay Safe....
-DESPIE
I am going to try and explain this in simple terms that everybody can understand. Keep in mind this setup is not for the grow room penny pinchers! IMO you must spend money to make money. If you are a rec grower then this setup is prop not for you because it cost $800. But it you are a grow room connoisseur and like things high tech and aren't afraid to spend a little cash this is for you!
First of all let me explain a little about conventional AC. And AC unit runs off a compressor. This compressor is 100% powered by electricity. they are typically 1200watts at start-up and runs a constant 1000watts (depending on BTU rating) but this is the most common scenario. Some people try to tap there Central AC into there grow room but this is useless as in most case's the thermostat is upstairs or in another room.
Others use "window bangers" AC units which sit in a window. These are ok but in a sensitive temp room like a grow room these are extremely power consuming and very unconventional! Remember what I said about the compressor! 1200 watts at start up. a window banger is not meant to turn off an on as often as a grow room would demand. the spike every time that juice pig starts up will make your elec bill go sky high. Another problem with them is they have an internal stat which is right on the unit! Obviously the air around the unit is going to be cooler then the other side of the room! But the unit is taking the signal from its internal stat. Point is in a grow room they are very inaccurate and will not give u a try temp of the entire room!
What I have built is made up of different controls and tech from 3 different pieces of HVAC equipment. This system works best in the Fall, Winter and Spring as out side air is extremely cooled But also works quite well in the summer because of the "core" ill get to that later though!
To understand how this system works we must first understand the primitive basics of how AC works! R-22 or HIGH EFF R-410A refrigerant is the life blood of AC. You can compare it to the oil in your car. When it is under high pressure it becomes a HOT gas approx 72 psi on the gauges. When is is under lower pressure 32 psi on the gauges it is a cool liquid gas. With out getting to technical when the outside air passes the hot coil it takes all the heat out of the refrigerant and the compressor pumps that refrigerant to the condensing coil (inside the house) The fan inside blows WARMER inside air passed the inside coil condensing the and thus creating Air conditioning. If you did not understand that all you must understand is that AC is created by condensing. This is why your AC creates water! So just to recap we now understand cool air is created by condensing a copper coil charged with Refrigerant which is in its cold liquid gas state.
The idea was to create AC which is primitive in design and uses as much energy as a old school light bulb 100watts NOT 1200! Most people just have a intake fan and out take fan (some don't even have this
) this is extremely important for plants fresh air is a major key to success and any old school grower will tell u this. I don't consider myself old school but i have been in the game for 8 years on and off. The problem is you cant control the temps with conventional fans! unless u feel like sitting in your room all day! another problem is your room will only cool to whatever the outside air temp is....sooo if your running 3 1000watt hps in the middle of the summer its pointless only good for an air change but odds are your room is hotter then it is outside. And vice versa in the winter if its -30 c you run the risk of bringing in to much cold air. and this air in all seasons is 100% depended on what it is outside. We must understand plants don't like drastic changes in temp. they prefer a routine which never changes and stays the same or close to it. People may say "well outdoor plants can handle magor changes in temp" yes there right but these are NOT outdoor plants....there indoor its like having a wild animal in captivaty...there more dependent.Now lets get down to business! This is an HRV or also known as a "heat recovery ventilator". They are used to introduce 100% fresh air into a central air and heat system. I'm not going to get into how it works in a that application because it does not concern us. But that's what they are designed for. They work off of humidity and NOT TEMP! we are concerned with temp because we want cool air!
There are four ports. A fresh air to inside port, a stale air to outside port, a stale air from inside port and a fresh air from outside port. There is one 100watt fan inside which simaltantiously sucks air from outside to in and exhausts the stale air from in the room to outside. The picture diagram shows the movement of air.
See the diamond in the middle which separates the four compartments? this is the core....the heart of the system. the core is made up of tiny slots which will only let air pass one way from the top right compartment (fresh outside air in) to the bottom right compartment (fresh COLD air into the room port). Now heres where it gets tricky! the slots in the core also let air pass from the top right compartment (stale HOT stinky air from inside) to the bottom left compartment (stale HOT air to outside).
Now remember back to what we learned about conventional energy sucking air-conditioning. We have just created AC with a single 100 watt fan motor.
Ok I know what your thinking now! Despie you didn't invent anything! you just wasted 20 mins of my time explaining to me how an hrv works! WRONG! The innovation I have came up with lets us control the temp! remember I told u an HRV is run of a humistat! not a thermostat! an HRV will not give you the same results just in a regular house because the inside air in a house is never as hot as it is in a grow room. This works for us growers only because our lights through off so much heat and make our exhaust HOT then the core lets that HOT air pass through the core which also has COLD air passing in the opposite direction, CONDENSING the air and creating AC. We want to control the temp!!!! and not at the unit like a window banger at the central part of the room!
I hooked up the HRV to a White Rogers fan relay.
Fan relays where commonly used in older central furnace and AC units. They are what control the fan control on your thermostat. if you don't want to heat or cool but rather just have an air change in your house. The fan relay is controlled by a thermostat which has been placed on the opposite side of the room in a central area. So lets just say we set our thermostat for 72
Once the thermostat hits 72 it sends a 24volt signal to the fan relay which closes a contactor which has broken the power to the HRV. So here is where another Key benefit of my system comes into play! we are only using 24 volts which is not even a watt of energy to start up the system VS. the 1200 watts it takes to start a conventional AC because of the compressor! no compressor, no energy spike! Also we must remember when we are trying to control a temp it extreme conditions like a grow room our cooling system weather is a conventional AC or my system is going to be turning on and off quite frequently because there is no such thing as a thermostat the will keep a temp say for example in between 68 and 72. They can only keep one temp and that's it. So for us growers this means it turning on and off and on and off etc etc.
Another benefit is the exhausted air is now cooler because it has passed the colder fresh air coming in thus making it extremely less stinky.
So for those of you who are wondering how well it will work in the dead of summer heres your answer. its infact the opposite of winter/spring/fall operation. the room is obviously going to create allot more heat when it is hotter outside. This air is much much more hot then what the actually outside air temp is. So again we have cold air passing hot condensing and air creating AC.
I will add to this thread as I think of more good points. If anyone has any questions or if there is any confusion I would be glad to answer them and clarify anything.
I am still working on the wire diagrams and general set info but I just wanted to share this break through in G room EFF! Save power money and be safe!
Just to recap the features of this set-up
-Acts as an air handler introducing fresh air
-Exhausts stale air
-Cuts down on exhaust stink and in a small grow room eliminates it
-Only 100watts to run
-Controls temp automatically extremely accurately
-Will pay for its self within 2 crops in hydro savings VS regular AC
-No spike in electrical current
This is my set-up
I added 2 inline booster fans which are wired in series with the HRV and are also controlled simultaneously with the fan relay. My stale air out is hooked up to a charcoal filter as u see in the picture. That filter was $350 but it eliminates ALL smell. I can be smoking a joint beside it and the exhaust air out side smells like clean fresh air.
happy plants 7 days since clones rooted
system hatch closed. this is what it looks like during normal operation
close up....plants with ample fresh air are happier plants!
Just to break it down for you price wise.
HRV: $450
Fan Relay: $100
Thermostat: $30
Wire/Vent/other:100
boosterfans:100
-----------------------
$780
you can make it more primitive for a smaller one light op and only buy the HRV, Thermostat, building materials and Fan relay which would only cost $680.
Still cheaper then a split system and use's nowhere near the same elec. And it does alot more then just cool!
Wiring diagrams to come with in the next two days!
Stay Safe....
-DESPIE
Last edited:
), and having a chance to re read this post I think I need to agree with twojoints and what he has to say below. I fail to understand how a heat exchanger can cool an incoming air stream, if you can elaborate in a technical fashion or illustrate the science behind this a little further it would be helpful.
