Comprehensive Outdoor Watering Post?

[all_is_1]

Hey all,
I was hoping to start a discussion on different methods of setting up drip irrigation systems outdoor. One of the main issues in my mind at the moment (I lost 3 separate crops last summer to LEO/rippers) is how to do it and not attract any attention. Obviously step 1 is to bury drip lines and piping if it is used. Flyovers are often succesful because the equipment is more obvious than the cannabis. I like Backcountry's resovoir thread but I'm looking to grow a bit more than 4 plants per spot and also he hasn't yet put up any info on his exact drip arrangement. According to a friend who is an irrigation professional (literally) solenoid valves that run off of batteries are the way to go. A rain sensor can even be put in line so that the drip system shuts off if sufficient rain falls on the sensor. Anyways any ideas or comments are more than welcome, as I really don't have a clear idea what this thread should focus on. Peace.

 

[hamstring]

I second that discussion. Although on OG Backcountry did show his whole setup. Back Country would add some credibility to this thread.

I would just like to hear more peoples OJT. Even at OG many participated in discussion but never seemed like many of us had any OJT. Back Country was one of the few to add the OJT factor. Are there others with good/bad experiences.

I have purchased some of the required supplies. I hate to admit this but I have not found anything in the local big box stores to hook up the main supply line from the reservoir(25 gal container) to the plants. I have bought things and tried to jury rig but I am not satisfied they will work with out leaking the precious water. What will work to put a hole in reservoir and then connect to an irrigation supply line. They do sell a kit online to be fair but was hopping there was something off the shelf.

If it works well why wouldn’t there be more people using the system? I live in Midwest water is not a huge problem but if you could lug 25 – 50 gal to a 5 plant plot (before any plants are there i.e. better security) you would be good for quite awhile. In fact you would probably not have to turn it on until some time mid June when plants hit full stride. Sounds like a slam-dunk but I do not have any OJT. I would like a gravity feed system. KISS method.

You also have the problem of suspending the ferts in the water. If you use slow release ferts does it still give you the punch as water-soluble ferts?

 

[all_is_1]

Hamstring thanks for the exellent comments and questions.
I'm afraid I don't know the acronym "OJT" as I am not too up on the online lingo.

I have run into similar problems with finding attachments from Depot and the like but I know its doable. I live in western NY and generally we have rain during the summer but last summer we didn't have any for the majority of the growing season so I'm going to plan for the worst and hope for the best. I used vic high's super soil and I was flat out amazed at the health of my plants in using that soil. A few stunted plants were given AN's "Heavy Harvest" and though I'm not a fan of chemical nutrients (especially outdoor where it isn't needed) they worked amazingly well (I'm not kidding when I say 'amazing' either). They can and should be top-dressed at intervals of 3-4 weeks so they provide a very attractive option for guerilla growing. If a secure watering system could be setup than visits to the spot could be very infrequent.

I love the gravity feed system but this depends on a water source which is above the plants and I have yet to find a secure spot with water above the grow spot. Other options are noisier and less practical (gasoline powered pump, lugging water--this works but I would like to grow more plants than I can personally carry water for). Anyways hopefully we'll get some more experienced people into this discussion. Peace.

 

[Awol/CoA]

Some time ago, before I left for a 4 day trip, I just used 4 or 5 3litre Coke
bottles and put small holes in the lids, filled them up with water and used those
as a drip system. Some bottles I used had a narrower hole, some I used a wider hole,
that way the soil was nice and moist and not over-watered.
It worked pretty well and the plants came through fine in +30c temps.


Awol.

 

[hamstring]

All Is One
On the Job Training = OJT

Thanks for the input on Slow release ferts. Top-dressed you say. That’s what the directions said. I was wondering why? I guess the water dissolves them and sends it to the roots. Good luck with OD (outdoor). The only way to grow for some of us.
Like I said even on OG there were not many people who used irrigation systems or just did not wish to comment.

No beef with Backcountry. He is where I learned everything I know about irrigation but I wanted others with bush experience to chime in. Nothing like a little back and forth with others with OJT. Things you would have never considered always come out of these discussions.

By gravity fed system I meant a reservoir which gravity feeds the plants. As far as pumping water I am not in location that lends itself. Farmers own most land with small tracts of lowlands and forest. If it is a park we are not talking thousands of acres where a pump is not likely discovered or heard. I would be afraid the risk/reward ratio does not add up. You could spend a lot of money to see your pump and power source disappear. With gravity you may loose a hundred dollars in material (At the most.) not including product.

It has got to make you wonder if many people use this type of system. It may not fit the risk/reward ratio. Maybe we are ahead of our times. Just joking!! Wanted to see if Backcountry would chime in and hit me up side my head.

 

[BACKCOUNTRY]

I like Backcountry's resovoir thread but I'm looking to grow a bit more than 4 plants per spot and also he hasn't yet put up any info on his exact drip arrangement.

Hey man! Good subject! I have to ask if you have been to my Guerrilla auto-irrigation thread? I go into much deeper detail about the system.

Here is a link-> Guerrilla auto-Irrigation (Watering your plants when you aren't there)

hamstring-I do think systems like this are used more commonly in western North america than they are in the east. Ya see the problem is that here, in my climate, there are no summer rains. If I want to leave plants to fend for themselves, I am forced to find very rare spots where soil moisture is maintained by a underground source. If I do not use a "Oasis", or water them artificially, I won't harvest much if any at all. I would not go to this trouble if I lived in a wetter summer climate, when I say it is dry here in summer, I mean desert DRY.

So, in other words, in a dry moderately remote area like mine, it is completely worth it!

How to connect the system to the rez was a problem I worked in my head over and over again in the early days. The best way is to use a siphon to draw the water up and over the side, insted of carving holes through the side of your rez, you will always wonder if it was sealed right, heheh. Originally I was trying to run the lines that way.

Here is a basic gravity fed Irrigation system, a very basic outline:

1. Water supply. It could be a resivour (like a barrel) or a natural source (like a spring, lake or creek). It needs to be clean water to prevent system foul-ups due to clogging. There should be at least a 10' drop in elevation to the plot, 40' would be even better if you want to feed many plants.

2. The line to the plot could be made from black Poly pipe or PVC painted black, or even from garden hose. I would personally prefer the PVC as my first choice, and would never use the hose permenently as I suspect they may be prone to leaking and damage by chewing rodents. Bury the line to protect it and hide it.

3. Timer valve. Its a valve that opens with a battery operated timer, I use the Gilmour brand, there are many others. I use Lithium batteries so they will last the whole season. The timer should be placed as close to where the system branches out as possible, this will hold the whole system above it full of water, and minimize air in the system which could cause uneven water flow. Having plenty of elevation on your rez will ensure good pressure and good even flow.

4. Splitter(diffuser). This is basicly the part that branches the water out to the plants. Usually you are kicking down from a 3/4" or 1/2" line to a 1/4" line(it resembles very hard plastic straw) for each plant. Usually the part will have a 1/2" female "in" and 4-12 1/4" male "outs" where each plants 1/4" line can be attached.

5. Flow ajusters. In order to make the system give a measured ammount of water each time it comes on, you need to be able to ajust the flow. The first place you can ajust is with your timer, usually you can water in increments of minutes, my Gilmour waters in 15 min increments. But you need to ajust the flow for each line, some lines will naturally flow more than others if left unajusted.
The more common way is with small valves on the end of each line, each can be ajusted so that you could give 1 gallon each in 15 minutes for example.

This is where my system differs a bit, I use a component made by Rainbird, called a "Hydroport". It combines the splitter and the flow ajusters in one package.

I will be getting 3 of these going this summer, dry season doesn't start until July here, but i am sure I will have the systems built and ready to go by late June.

These systems could be adapted to run with a electric pump, which could be a great thing in some situations. Maybe I will try one next year, heheh.

Peace guys!

 

[gras_macht_spaß]

I would like to direct your attention to an irrigation system called "Tropf-Blumat" which is produced by an austrian or german manufacturer.
See here:
http://www.blumat.at/Weninger_engl/seiten_engl/frameset1_engl.html
They have a north-american importeur in Canada:
http://www.rambridge.com/products/irrigat/tropf/tropfbu2.html
This importeur has a lot of distributors in whole North-America, this one in NY:
http://www.hydroponicgarden.com/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=541&cat=Tropf

The main advantages of this system are that it works noiseless and without any electricity. It needs only a reservoir which is at least 0.5-1 m (approx. 20-40 inches) higher than the drip units. It can also be attached via pressure reducer to a water pipe (if you have one somewhere in the woods!).
The principle is, that a water-filled terracotta-cone ist put into the soil. When soil gets dry it soaks water out of the cone, thereby creating low pressure in the cone. When the soil is wet enough a pressure spring, which is connected with a membrane closes by it´s pressure the thin drip hose. But now when soil gets dry, the low pressure inside the cone pulls the membrane (against the spring pressure) and so the drip hose gets free and releases water. When soil moistens again, low pressure in cone normalizes and the membrane could no longer keep the drip-hose open against the spring pressure.
The degree of moisture is regulated by the adjustable spring pressure.
This may seem complicated, but it´s only because things like this are better to explain with pictures than with words only. Check the links above! This system basically is nothing else than a kind of tensiostat.
If you use big pots, you have to use more than one dripper per plant, but they are not very expansive. It works also with plants growing directly in mother earth, the number of drippers needed depends on the size of the plant, the kind of soil and the climate (I don´t think that you would need more than 6 drippers even for a real big plant, and they don´t have to be all sensor drippers (with terracotta cones), the system has also cheaper distribution drippers, a couple of these (2-4) can be controlled by one sensor dripper).

The most simple way to build a guerilla irrigation system would be to hang a (best would be green or camouflage-coloured) canister on a strong branch of a tree near the plants, best with a rope and an idler pulley, so your reservoir that can easily be lifted up and down.
It would be convenient to use a detachable hose-connector to connect the reservoir with the drippers, and to work with 2 canisters instead of one, so you can go with the filled one to visit your plants and take the empty one with you when you leave.
I consider such a Tropfblumat-based system as the best way to set up a guerilla irrigation system, because it´s so simple. You don´t need electricity and you have no trouble with the correct dose of water, because if the system once is well adjusted, the plants just take themselves what they need by the water tension in the soil ! (And you don´t need to construct much, all components could be bought ready-to-use !)

I had to look for some technical expressions in an online dictionary to write this post, I hope the translations are correct enough to express the whole thing understandable !

 

[hamstring]

Backcountry

Thanks for stopping in and helping out. I never thought of putting the hose/PVC right in the top. Good idea. I want to try and put my reservoir 10 –15 feet away from plants and only 12-24inchs above their level. I may be crazy but I want to try it. Your experience is much appreciated.

Gras Macht SpaB

Your translation was great. The Germans have a word for every variation. In English an opening could be a hole, window, door etc. Not in German correct? They have a separate word for each of these. My first trip and actually everyone after to Amsterdam was via Germany. Love the Urail Pass.
I have read about this mechanism before. It does seem to be for smaller planters. Have you tried this in the bush or on any garden plants in your yard? Not sure it could accommodate larger plants in dry conditions.

 

[BACKCOUNTRY]

gras_macht_spaß-My problem with a system like that is that sometimes you have to make do with less water than is totally ideal, sometimes you have to conserve water so it lasts. If the plants are constantly drinking when ever they like, you may have problems if you plant in a area where you can not refill your rez.

If you have a endless supply of water from a creek or spring, or if you can refill your rez whenever you like, then a system like that or a wick type system would be more ideal.
Looks like a well thought out system

hamstring- Good luck with that setup, I suppose you could get it to work, but its just a bit more difficult with such low pressure.

 

[gras_macht_spaß]

Hi hamstring,
I didn´t try it out, because in my region nearly every spot is in agricultural use, and even a not very big green canister would be noticed by a farmer or hunter, it´s already hard to find 3-5 little spots each for 2-3 plants between elders, nettles or wild roses. So it´s wise to avoid absolutely anything that could catch the curiosity of anyone.
Fortunately it´s not very necessary, too. We only have real try weather in mid of summer and mostly, this is not very extreme, our soil is rather heavy and holds the water well. If one enriches the soil with some water retaining polymer crystals, it´s not necessary very often to carry big amounts of water into the hidden garden.
Therefore the low necessity of an irrigation system would not righten the increased risk ! Beside of this, I have hold the components of this system in my hands at the local garden center, it really seems to be trustworthy, because fundamentally simple.
I don´t know if it´s perfect for much very big plants in extremely dry and hot climates with poor sandy soils. What I had in mind when recommending this was a normal grow-for-your-own user with 6-15 2-meter/7-feet plants in not to extreme conditions of climate and soil, and I believe that the Tropfblumat-system is a very good, simple and not very expansive solution for such cases.
Hi BACKCOUNTRY: You´re right, the plants take the water by themselves,
and the soil must not get extremely dry, otherwise, the vacuum in the terracotta-cones will collapse and the cones have to be soaked and refilled with water to work correctly again. It´s just the same as with a tensiometer, at a vacuum of 90 centibars or even less the vacuum can no longer be kept up.
But the water consumption can be adapted to a lack of water in some degree by adjusting the spring pressure harder, which will result in a stronger needed vacuum to open the drip hose. So the threshold will be shifted towards a drier level.

 

[BACKCOUNTRY]

Yes, I think its a great system, but it would never be as positive to set up for a fixed water buget system as a water timer. I can get it dialed in less than a hour, and I know it will continue just that way through the season and use exactly as much water as I want. Thats my only point, the "Tropf-Blumat" will never be as good for use in systems with very tightly bugeted water supplies.

 

[wkoots]

im years late to this thread but its common here to use black poly? 3/4 inch pipe to run gravity fed h2o down hill to your sunny spot. Bury the line not only to hide it but deers pointy feet will poke holes in your line. Also make sure it is always sloping down hill to avoid getting an air lock.Then a cheap battery timer water valve from wallmart. I have tried drip line ,soaker hoses (suck) and emmiter line (not much better).For my time/dime drippers at 4gallon per hour or more are the best bet. You have to adjust timer to your spots needs.Some add filters fertilizer syphons etc.I prefer just to top feed=less complications