clones in rockwool: yellowing and care tips

[cultiv8t0r]

Hey All,

I have some clones that are pretty large, with some roots showing through their rockwool cubes. i've had to hold off on gettting them into their dwc buckets, so i've been storing them about 6-8" under 3 20w flouro tubes.

They were put into the dwc buckets briefly and soaked with 400pm veg nute solution, but had to be removed and placed back under the flouros until some unforseen growroom issues are resolved.

now I just keep the rockwool moist, but not wet with a sprayer. they're showing some yellowing at the new growth on the tops, and I was wondering what I can do to take care of them until I can get them in

Thanks!

yellowing


clone area

 

[Allusive]

I need more info (temps, age, pH) but I would guess your pH is off (should be 5-6 hovering around 6) or that they need more Nitrogen. Can't really tell but they almost look like they have burnt tips, which means maybe the nutes are too much at this point, though I doubt that. pH?

 

[cultiv8t0r]

temps: ambient apt. temps, between 65-75 or so.

they were in the buckets for a nite...but the nutes were too rich, ~450ppm but pH adjusted to 5.4

then, for the last 36 hours, I've just been hitting em with pH 7 distilled water!

they're going back into the dwc in a hour or so...the nutes I've mixed are ~260ppm, ph 5.4-5.5...hopin' that sounds good.

thanks

 

[Guest]

hey cult.. im stalkin ya round here it seems

yea those nutes sound fine if they are in RO water.

you're saying that theyve been in prue water last 36 hrs? sounds and looks like hunger for nitrogen. i dont see why you have to address this now if its going into DWC in an hour.. there is no quick fix for these kinds of problems.. best way is to get dwc nutes dialed in properly, and it will fix itself over time.

also you should be able to move the flouros to within 1-2 inches away.. flouros are typically much cooler and arent known for their light penetration.


good luck..

 

[cultiv8t0r]

nice!...good to hear that the nutes sound good. we'll see if they start looking better once they get used to the new spot.

thanks once again man... check it out i got the grow log set up:

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?p=626545

 

[sproutco]

What is the ph? I think it is high or you have root damage or you may just need to feed more. Get the plants closer to the florescent light. Only 1-2 inches away (2.5-5cm) Looks like a micronutrient problem...

 

[stikky budz]

the nutes I've mixed are ~260ppm, ph 5.4-5.5

If it were me, i'd up the ppm to 700 and run it through at ph 5.8.

 

[Guest]

If it were you, you'd have some serious nute burn

 

[sproutco]

I am leaning toward simple iron deficiency from a ph too high, root damage, lack of oxygen from overwatering, or something else. What is exactly your nutrients and its content?

 

[cultiv8t0r]

my nutrients are botanicare pure blend pro... 3-1.5-4 . concentration of the nutes in the dwc solution is 260ppm.

after about 20hrs...they're looking alot worse actually...very droopy on some, with curling tips on others. they don't look happy.

pH has crept up alot. any ideas why? it was 5.4 and now its 6.0. how can i adjust it without a res change? I can't just drop pH down into the tubs...that'll shock the plants right? I was thinking of making some pH 3.0 acidic water and slowly titrating with that?

 

[MynameStitch]

yup sprout co is right, iron problem

if you got some rusty nails put them in water and shake real good a nd water your plants, thats one quick way or you need tofind some nutrients with iron, rockwool is am edium something that holes the plant in place, you either need to put your plants in hydro or soil, they need to be put in something that will hold nutrients so the roots can take them in, rockwool can only hold so much and it dries up its not something like peat, where peat holds in nutrients for long peorids of time....... so plants can take in what they need, but with rockwool it dies up before plants can take in what they need

sinc the roots are not long enough to put into a system, you should of made a bubble cloner to help the roots get long, buble cloners are almost definatly needed for hydro growers cause when clones grow the roots will grow out in search of water and tou want the roots to start to grow long so they can go through net pots

 

[Guest]

while I cant comment on iron as I dont know about that mineral, I can say you can be 100% fine without a bubble cloner.. while they may be useful i totally disagree that theyre close to necessary. never lost a cut with clonex, be it rapid rooters or rockwool (tho rapids finish faster).


first of all you're over-reacting to the PH. some PH fluctuation is to be expected. furthermore, theres nothing wrong with 6.0. I dont start adding down till they hit 6.2, and I only add down once a week, maybe.

you have a low PPM, which is normal for the size of your girls. there is a direct relationship between nutes and PH. although not all nutes affect PH, most do, and are PH buffered. so the more nutes you add, the lower the PH gets (although due to buffers it will level off at 5.5-5.8 when at full strength). when the plants are eating, if the PH goes up, this means they are eating more than they are drinking, and the PPM will likely also go down. if the PPM stays the same or gets higher, it means its too high, and they are drinking more than they are eating. so by watching your PH you can tell a lot about your plants. however you're over-reacting at the moment to the issue of ph 6.0.

yes, you do just drop the ph adjustment stuff directly into the tub. you're right though, too much will poison your girls. I've never experienced that though.

when I used a tub, I ended up switching to buckets mid-way through, because my GH dual diaphram was having trouble proving enough oxegyn. thats the one problem I had with bins, I felt it was much easier to aerate and maintain buckets. my symptoms were similar - droopy, curling (downward curling, like a rams horn). can you describe the curling more?

i have always been able to trace drooping to oxegyn problems, in my systems.

 

[cultiv8t0r]

makes a great deal of sense. I fixed pH anyways...no need to worry about it, cool.

I raised the water level to 1" above the pots from 1" below them. They seemed very dry.

Now I'm most concerned that oxygen levels are the problem as you've experienced.

I honestly don't know whether to manually water the tops of them or not...when I do it seems to dry out within a couple hours

Check out how bad these look...does this amount of drooping seem to be consistent with the oxygen problem?

ouch....dead?


the rest arent' so bad... but definitely drooping...examples:



the tips of this one are curling and yellow, but its hard to see

 

[Guest]

alright, looked at em w/ my buddy and heres what we think:

looks like nitrogen and magnesium deficiencies. can you break down exactly what nutes you are adding and by how many ml/gal each?


what gallon are the tubs, again? we had 1 single 38 gallon tub, with approx 25 gallons of fluid in it, and the dual diaphram was unable to aerate satisfactorily. yea those do look like they have DO issues.

you can water on top with RO, ive done that a little as needed before.


edit: I see that you have 2 28 gal tubs. I only had 2/3 your total fluid, and the pump wasnt strong enough. something to consider.

personally, I'd say switch to buckets. in no way is it too late, and 5gals contain plenty of root space. you could easily link up all 6 of your buckets to a control, put a pump in control and recirc, and have rez keep control topped off, to address your desire to recirc. there are plenty of people who use tubs, but I think maybe 2x18gal or so might be more appropriate, if you want to keep bins.

 

[MynameStitch]

how much water you have in that tub and what ar you using for air stones and air pumps?


tubs are very hard to clean and maintain which is why lorax said using buckets

all that water

do you have anything wrapped around your tub to prevfent light?
how many gallons of water do you have in that tub?
if that is a 35 gallon you should be using at least 2 air pumps and 2 air stones not small ones

've just been hitting em with pH 7 distilled water!

heres one of your problems right here
if you are using distilled water, you can use it but you have to have the proper nutrients to suppliment with that distilled does not have

distilled has no mineral nutrients its nearly 0 ppm depnding on brand and filtration

what nutrients are you using and how much ?


ph goes up because the plants are taking nutrients out of the water and this rising the ph

you need to adjust ph with ph down and add nutrients to keep your ppms where they need to be

use ppm meter to watch pppms if your ph is up and your nutrients are where they need to be use ph down do not add more nutrients to adjust ph you can burn them

your ppms need to be on the size of your plant
you dont give high ppms to a small plant

sie of your plants i wouldnt go over 400 right now untill they recover

are these plants all the same strain?

 

[cultiv8t0r]

I started them with 10/ml per gallon, and it is now diluted to 5/ml gallon of the nutes, 3-1.5-4 .

It now seems clear that there isn't enough o2 in the water, regardless of nutrient issues. I'm definitely considering a switch to buckets, but I can't do it right now.

Tommorrow I'll add additional pumps and airstones, try to double the current flow. See if that helps.

Buckets are sounding better and better as i don't want to maintain 50 gallons of nutes. seems obvious now of course. :|

thanks.

 

[Guest]

wait why buy more pumps and airstones? its probably cheaper just to switch to buckets.

are you using cal-mag? its in RO right?

 

[cultiv8t0r]

i don't think i can budget the time for a switch to buckets before an ill-timed trip out of town for the weekend. not back 'til monday. my gf will watch everything.

i was hoping more airstones would help in the interim.

one thing i may be overlooking ~~ how deep into the 4" net pots should the rockwool cubes be buried? I only have like .5" of hydroton on top of them; they're pretty much sitting on the top

EDIT - no cal-mag ,but the nutes have those in them no?

 

[Guest]

eh, yes, but if you're using RO you need to use cal-mag. at least 5ml per gallon. I guess maybe not necessary if they havent hit rez, but the moment they do.

I do pretty much the oppposite. i only have 1 layer, MAYBE 2 of rocks below my rockwool.

 

[cultiv8t0r]

wow... so I can bury the plant's stems deep into the rocks? like say, close to the first leaves?