Chloramines??

[starter09]

Wondering if I'll have chloramine problems if I use local tap?

On their website (Denver) they say they average 1.27 ppm. Since they sample daily and the max allowed is 4 ppm I'm assuming that 1.27 is strong enough dose to disinfect the drinking water - i.e., enough to kill any micro-organisms if I try to develop a healthy root zone?

Any myco- gurus here with a simple solution? I'm in a small apartment so I'm limited in treatment options - and just letting the water sit doesn't remove chloramines, right?

 

[mjr99]

My tap has chloramine and i use it with no problems. Girls look awesome.

I let it sit out for atleast 48 hours just in case but cant say if that makes a difference or not.

 

[Bud Greenleaf]

My tap has chloramine and i use it with no problems. Girls look awesome.

I let it sit out for atleast 48 hours just in case but cant say if that makes a difference or not.

I use too - but mostly I try a boil and sit, and aquarium treatment specifically for removing chlora's.

 

[jammie]

if i can assume that your growing in soil since that's the thread, then 48hrs should be fine. its more of an issue in hydro.

 

[Lazyman]

Chloramines (like DM Zone) don't evaporate out like regular chlorine, Bud Greenleaf had a good idea there to check with Aquarium stores, they'll have some recommendations for you. Or surf an aquarium forum for tips. Or, you can just ignore it, unless you're trying to do organic hydro (shudder) I wouldn't want much living in my res anyway.

 

[bakelite]

I've been using TopFin tap water dechlorinator that also neutralizes Chloramines. You can use ascorbic acid (vitamin C) to do the same thing. Wikipedia recommends 1000mg per 75 gallons of water (13mg/gallon). I've also heard 25mg per gallon from another source.

To be honest I'm not even sure if chloramines are an issue. Supposedly they are destroyed fairly quickly once they come into contact with organic matter. I take precautions and treat my tap water anyway just to be safe. What ever it's worth, chloramines are only an issue with organics with the concern being the microbes in the soil (microherd).
Hope this helps,
-bakelite

 

[starter09]

Thanks all

Thanks all

Big help from all of you, thanks each one. Pretty much confirmed what I was thinking; I planned a ProMix medium because of myco presence figuring the happier I can make the roots the happier the ladies will be. I'll still go with it, just wait and see if there's any herd activity.

Thanks again. IC rocks.

 

[Vetus Fossor]

Vitamin C will remove chloramine. A little bit of organic matter will also. Both must be bubbled after mixing. Ya gotta break the ammonia/chlorine bond and get rid of the chlorine and ammonia. Thus the bubbling. But, hells bells, there ain't no tried and true answer to whether or not watering with straight tap water causes any problems. Outside of ph and that, ph, doesn't really matter in organics. To an extent. Qualifier added. lol Go with what works for you. And what makes you happy. And relax and enjoy.

 

[mullray]

Wondering if I'll have chloramine problems if I use local tap?

On their website (Denver) they say they average 1.27 ppm. Since they sample daily and the max allowed is 4 ppm I'm assuming that 1.27 is strong enough dose to disinfect the drinking water - i.e., enough to kill any micro-organisms if I try to develop a healthy root zone?

Any myco- gurus here with a simple solution? I'm in a small apartment so I'm limited in treatment options - and just letting the water sit doesn't remove chloramines, right?

Chem guy here starter 09. They use monochloramine to treat tap water. And yes it does dissipate completely within about 24 hours max when exposed to air. There's at least one product on the market that is simply monochloramine (Pythoff) that they plug for sterilizing water for use in hydro. Other than this it is used in agriculture for the same purpose. Hydrogen peroxide is used to chase monochloramine out of water supplies. Hydrogen peroxide is also used as a sterilizing agent in hydro. The two (MC and HP) react and become inert. Personally I think monochloramine for use with plants is noxious and can burn fine root hairs in too high levels (based on ag research so just not my opinion). So, expose the water to air for 24 hours and there will be no monochloramine present. Go well...

MR

 

[habeeb]

R/O system

run your water through carbon

"organic" vitamin C


why would you guys use fish aquarium stuff? treating chemical with chemical???

 

[mullray]

R/O system

run your water through carbon

"organic" vitamin C


why would you guys use fish aquarium stuff? treating chemical with chemical???

RO is Reverse Osmosis not carbon although a carbon prefilter for tap water supplies is used due to the presence of chloramine. Where chloramine is not present (e.g. bore or dam water) sediment filters are used with no carbon prefilter. Chloramine destroys the RO membrane so carbon is used to remove chloramine. "organic" vitamin C please explain. Are we talking citric acid monohydrate? (which reduces pH and is often passed off as organic pH down).

Chloramine can adversely effect plant growth: Note. excerpt from research by S. Date, T. Hataya, T. Namiki.

"Root injury occurred by chloramine treatment with all the pretreatments. After 6 h of chloramine treatment, 2,3,5-triphenyltetrazolium chloride (TTC) reduction activity decreased in root tissues."

It will also reduce or destroy micros. So when adding micros be using to use chloramine free water.

RO is great, not because it only removes chloramine but it removes elements from water that are not bioavailable or not as bioavailable as mineral elements used in formulating nutrients. They also remove turbidity, undissolved solids, lead, mercury etc. Standard RO units run off mains tap water pressure and you'll be left with pure water with an EC of approx 0.02.

Back to the problem at hand. Monochloramine is unstable and completely dissipates when exposed to air for a period of time. If you wish to speed up the process throw in a bubbler and use the water after 12 hours. And yes chloramine is used in tap water supplies to kill biological microorganisms such as pythium. 3 - 4 ppm tends to be standard with some countries using higher levels. Smarter countries (e.g. some places in Europe) use Ozone. I do not drink tap water and haven't for years. I certainly would not feed it to my plants.

 

[uglybunny]

Personally, I don't worry about chloramine, organic matter gets rid of it in a flash.

As far as tap water goes, chelates have an amazing ability to capture and sequester harmful heavy metals that may be in tap water. The same chelates that help our plants uptake iron, copper, zinc, etc also protect them from harmful elements like lead and mercury. Bacillus subtilis, for example, is a common soil bacteria which create the catecholate siderophore, bacillibactin. Bacillibactin has an affinity toward lead, plutonium, and uranium.

 

[mullray]

Personally, I don't worry about chloramine, organic matter gets rid of it in a flash.

As far as tap water goes, chelates have an amazing ability to capture and sequester harmful heavy metals that may be in tap water. The same chelates that help our plants uptake iron, copper, zinc, etc also protect them from harmful elements like lead and mercury. Bacillus subtilis, for example, is a common soil bacteria which create the catecholate siderophore, bacillibactin. Bacillibactin has an affinity toward lead, plutonium, and uranium.

Really mate. Now that is interesting because the by product of chloramine and organic matter is called Trihalomethanes. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trihalomethane

What we're talking about is cadmium, lead, mercury, arsenic etc. Got any links to the research which demonstrates this re B. subtillus. It sounds interesting. There is research on P fixing bacteria VAM reducing heavy metal availability in soils. NAM increases uptake. As for the chelates capturing heavy metals ---- any research papers on this? Chelates are synthetic aminos bonded to M ions. The synthetic aminos make the M ion more bioavailable. Heavy metals are more bioavailable in organic matter, particularly organic matter with high CEC (so much for organics huh?). Ive not heard a single thing about aminos reducing metal (of any kind) uptake. Aminos make all metals more bioavailable and that's why they are used.

Re bacillus to reduce heavy metal uptake.

"Abstract R. A. Abou-Shanab1 , K. Ghanem2, N. Ghanem2 and A. Al-Kolaibe3

Four bacterial isolates were examined for their ability to increase the availability of water soluble Cu, Cr, Pb and Zn in soils and for their effect on metals uptake by Zea mays and Sorghum bicolor. Random Amplified Polymorphic DNA (RAPD) analysis was used to show that the bacterial cultures were genetically diverse. Bacterial isolates S3, S28, S22 and S29 had 16S rRNA gene sequences that were most similar to Bacillus subtilis, Bacillus pumilus, Pseudomonas pseudoalcaligenes and Brevibacterium halotolerans based on 100% similarity in their 16S rDNA gene sequence, respectively. Filtrate liquid media that had supported B. pumilus and B. subtilis growth significantly increased Cr and Cu extraction from soil polluted with tannery effluent and from Cu-rich soil, respectively, compared to axenic media. The highest concentrations of Pb (0.2 g kg−1), Zn (4 g kg−1) and Cu (2 g kg−1) were accumulated in shoots of Z. mays grown on Cu-rich soil inoculated with Br. halotolerans. The highest concentration of Cr (5 g kg−1) was accumulated in S. bicolor roots grown in tannery-effluent-polluted soil inoculated with a mixed inoculum of bacterial strains. These results show that bacteria play an important role in increasing metal availability in soil, thus enhancing Cr, Pb, Zn and Cu accumulation by Z. mays and S. bicolor. "

The point is the question was does chloramine cause any problem with bios and yes it does. It's used to kill bios in tap water (that's why we add it to tap water) so it's an easy answer. Other than this it can damage root hairs (see the research) Looking forward to links to the research you're citing. Very interesting stuff. All the research I'm seeing suggests otherwise.

Water chemists use hydrogen peroxide H202 to render monochloramine inert. Why bother when you can just expose chloramine water to air.