Burned or deficient? Please Help!

[rave420]

Hello, i need a little help sorting out this "problem" here.

How long has this problem been going on?
for a week or so
What STRAIN are you growing?
Unknown Indica Dominant Bagseed from outdoor
What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?)
Seed
What is the age of your plants?
Planted on Feb 28, on 12/12 for about 20 days, flower for 11 days
How long have they been in the soil mixture they are in now?
Since the 21st of Mar when i flipped the switch
How Tall are the plants?
Tallest is a Foot or so.
What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in?
beginning of flower
What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc)
Plain old soil grow under 320W 2700k CFL
What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot)
1/2 gal pots
What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you using?(percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?)
I am using 60% Original Sea Soil 30% All Purpose container mix (containg Peat moss, Sand, Perlite, Mulch Sphagnum Moss) and 10% Dutch Perlite
What Nutrient's are you using?
I am using AACT's that i make with Wormcastings, Bone Meal or High P Guano, Molasses and Seaweed, as well as Power Grow wich contains some more nutrients, B1 and Yucca Extract. I also top-dress with guano and EWC
How much of each nutrient are you using with how much water? *Knowing the brand is very helpful*
Geesh, all these questions I feed my plants when i have the feeling that they are hungry. I use very lean teas that i use every 2nd to 3rd watering. I also foilar spray with Thrive Alive, Liquid Seaweed extract and Power grow (B1 and Yucca extract). I yet have to see a sign of overfeeding, as a matter of fact i think they can use a stronger diet.

• High P guano (2-17-0) - Rubicon Organics
• Powergrow- Rubicon Organics
• Fish 3-3-2 - Rubicon Organics
• Wormcastings - Rubicon Organics
• Thrive Alive - Technaflora Inc.
• Molasses - Wholesome Organics
• Liquid Bone Meal - Rain Grow Organics

How often are you feeding?
Whenever i feel my plants need it, so about every 2nd to 3rd watering. I water whenever the pots feel light to me.
If flowering, when did you switch over to using Bloom nutrients?
I fed Fish AACT once after transplanting in bigger pots, and continued to feed High P guano as a tea as soon as i saw flowers forming.
What order are you mixing your nutrients? (example: veg nutes 1st, bloom 2nd ect)
I add water to the jug, then pour wormcastings, guano in there, and then i add the molasses and seaweed, cap it, shake it and then bubble for 24 - 48 hours. What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used?
I have no idea.
What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"?
6.6 - 6.8
What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen?
Drops and Strips, both the same results.
How often are you watering?
Whenever the pots feel light to me, and when the soil can freely be poured out of the bucket
When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding?
Two days ago, usually they get Tea or EWC/Molasses twice a week
What size bulb are you using?
9 x 40W CFL's
What is the distance to the canopy?
3 - 4 inch
What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity)
20 - 30%
What is the canopy temperature?
75 - 82 F Day 65 F Night
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range)75 - 82 F Day 65 F Night
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.)
Box is 3*2*4ft, there is one fan circulating air inside the box, and there is one 50CFM Bathroom fan pulling air out of the top, passive intake is a long 2 inch wide slit at the bottom.
Is the fan blowing directly at plants?
Some of them are in the direct wind, yeah. The fan however is really gentle
Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist?
Pretty much moist all the time, but i allow it to dry between waterings
Is your water HARD or SOFT?
R/O
What water are you using? Reverse Osmosis (RO)? Tap? Bottled? Well water? Distilled? Mineral Water?
R/O
Are you using water from a water softener?
No
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched?
topped after switch to 12/12
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when?
No
Are plant's infected with pest's?
No




So, here are some pics. It is ONLY on the very bottom leaves, and i have no idea what is causing this. I was thinking P defficency? The tips look scorched/crispy and then they show some slight yellow bordering to the burned spot. I do not think it's a N def. because the yellowing is rather localized.

It's not a real issue, because it is only on a handfull of leaves. it is progressing though. That means, each day i find it getting more and more.
But i would like to know what i am dealing with here. I need to stop it before it affects the health of my plants

Thanks a lot guys

 

[Cruzin]

"What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used?
I have no idea."

Thats a problem. Not saying its your problem but you should know.

 

[Moldy Dreads]

"What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used?
I have no idea."

Thats a problem. Not saying its your problem but you should know.

If he's following the nutrient mix recommendations, that shouldn't be such a problem in soil.Those are just bottom leaves and the problem doesn't look too bad, many times I just remove those leaves closest to the soil.

I do think the cause is that your pots are way too small for flowering in soil IMO. They dry out too quickly, the roots get rootbound, and the nutrients get absorbed way too quickly. Then these little deficiencies start to show. In flower, the girls eat like pigs, and the lowest leaves will do that if Nitrogen levels are low, maybe add a little bit of Nitrogen to one watering and see if a week later it improves..then stop the nitrogen closer to the end because you want a bit of yellowing towards the last week right before the chop. Yellowing too early will starve them a bit though and they may not get as fat as they could be.

Next time get bigger pots, at least 5 gallon, and use more perlite, and by having a better draining medium, the irrigating will keep the salts and oxygen flowing through the soil better.. Use liners too, to catch the excess runoff, that way you won't get dry spots in the soil that could also cause that..Just my .02

 

[rave420]

"What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used?
I have no idea."

Thats a problem. Not saying its your problem but you should know.

Wow, are you ACTUALLY telling me you need expensive TDS/EC/PPM meters in order to grow ORGANIC? I don't think so. I am growing organic to avoid all that, and i don't quite see how it's relevant, considering i use ZERO chemical nutrients.

If i pour my guano in water i will get a PPM/TDS/EC reading, but i know it will be sooooo far off, because most nutrients are NOT disolved and need to be broken down by the organisms in my soil before they can become available!

I don't think me buying more expensive equiptment is going to fix that. Thanks though

 

[MrMortakis$moot]

Wow, are you ACTUALLY telling me you need expensive TDS/EC/PPM meters in order to grow ORGANIC? I don't think so. I am growing organic to avoid all that, and i don't quite see how it's relevant, considering i use ZERO chemical nutrients.

If i pour my guano in water i will get a PPM/TDS/EC reading, but i know it will be sooooo far off, because most nutrients are NOT disolved and need to be broken down by the organisms in my soil before they can become available!

I don't think me buying more expensive equiptment is going to fix that. Thanks though

you can still burn your plants with guanos. just because you are growing organic does not mean its a fool proof system.. it's more tolerant but shit can still happen.

 

[hempluvr]

Just looks like a lack of light to those lower leaves. I have a plant right now with the same issue. Trim them away. My Serious Seeds Bubblegum is doing the same thing. Only on 2 lower leaves. I trimmed them away and called it a day. All has been good.

 

[thecreeper]

dont trim them off. Plants store nutrients in the leaves so if it is a lack of light, the plant is just using the nutrients in those leaves, i would leave them on until necrosis has occurred. also bigger pots would help too i think. what ever you do good luck.

 

[rave420]

don't trim them off / trim them off yadayadayada now what am i gonna do ?
First of all, the only real problem i see here is that the leaves touch the nutrient solution, cause when i water them they are sometimes really thirsty and droopy, so the leaves touch the wet EWC/Guano top-dressing! But then, it's not localized.

If he's following the nutrient mix recommendations, that shouldn't be such a problem in soil.Those are just bottom leaves and the problem doesn't look too bad, many times I just remove those leaves closest to the soil.

I do think the cause is that your pots are way too small for flowering in soil IMO. They dry out too quickly, the roots get rootbound, and the nutrients get absorbed way too quickly. Then these little deficiencies start to show. In flower, the girls eat like pigs, and the lowest leaves will do that if Nitrogen levels are low, maybe add a little bit of Nitrogen to one watering and see if a week later it improves..then stop the nitrogen closer to the end because you want a bit of yellowing towards the last week right before the chop. Yellowing too early will starve them a bit though and they may not get as fat as they could be.

Next time get bigger pots, at least 5 gallon, and use more perlite, and by having a better draining medium, the irrigating will keep the salts and oxygen flowing through the soil better.. Use liners too, to catch the excess runoff, that way you won't get dry spots in the soil that could also cause that..Just my .02

sorry, but i am a little ticked off, everybody is telling me to get bigger pots etc.
yo, listen up: I DON'T WANT BIGGER POTS!
I see people flowering 12/12 from seed in 20oz pop bottles and they are just fine! I can not grow in bigger pots, since i need to be able to fit as many plants as possible! I got no problem watering / feeding my plants three times a day if i have to. Look at Dr.BudGreenGenes, he flowers his plants SOG style in 20oz bottles and his plants look marvelous!

tell me what info you guys need to diagnose the deficiency, and i do my best to provide that information.

Now that we've been through
TDS/EC/PPM meters
Bigger Pots

The only helpfull advice is that my feedings may be a tad too heavy. And i repeat again, I DO NOT WANT BIGGER POTS! Yeah, bigger pots will improve yield, i am well aware, but i am fine with the yield i can grow in these small pots.
See the last picture? The tiny ass pots to the right? yeah, i am flowering the same plant in there, single cola lolipop style, and these plants show no problems whatsoever. I guess i am going to get less than 3.5g per plant in the small pots, but whatever, i am cool with that!

Now, final try! What element does it need more/less off?
Thanks for everybody that posted a reply so far, sorry if i am being difficult. But it's my grow, i am around my plants all the time, and i know for sure that my nutes are NOT too strong and that my pots suit my needs. The rest of the plant is in spectacular health by the way.

dont trim them off. Plants store nutrients in the leaves so if it is a lack of light, the plant is just using the nutrients in those leaves, i would leave them on until necrosis has occurred. also bigger pots would help too i think. what ever you do good luck.

THANK YOU, that sounds like a logical, reasonably deduced answer. I can see why that would happen. kind of like, the plant is giving up those leaves, right? Because they don't get a lot of light, they can't actively photosynthesize, and therefore the plant uses up all the stored nutes and drops the leaf. Sounds pretty damn logical.

 

[hempluvr]

Plus with it being early in flowering,you can trim those damages leaves off and it will shoot the growth to the top of the plant and the plant can concentrate on what matters..buds

 

[VenturaHwy]

I've grown for many years and the bottom leaves always yellow and die as they flower, if they didn't you wouldn't be growing pot.... you'd be growing something else. Now stress will make them die sooner than they should but your's look just fine, quit stressing..... When the plants are finished flowering all of the fans leave will have yellowed, thats if you let them go all the way to the end.

 

[BURNING SKY]

Feed Them a little they are hungry. It looks like a phosphorus lack. Try it... Lower leaves showing symptoms can sometimes indicate mobile nutrients... The plant will move mobile nutrients to other parts to maintain growth... Just and idea...

 

[Cruzin]

"The only helpfull advice is that my feedings may be a tad too heavy. And i repeat again, I DO NOT WANT BIGGER POTS! Yeah, bigger pots will improve yield, i am well aware, but i am fine with the yield i can grow in these small pots.
See the last picture? The tiny ass pots to the right? yeah, i am flowering the same plant in there, single cola lolipop style, and these plants show no problems whatsoever. I guess i am going to get less than 3.5g per plant in the small pots, but whatever, i am cool with that!"

Maybe its just me but you seem to have a shitty attitude.

 

[Aeroguerilla]

nitrogen.. mix some worm casting on top give it a watering they will green right up