Bunches of co2 tank questions

[El Jefe]

I have been thinking about co2 more and I've decided that my 650 cuft garden is best served with tanked co2. No heat! And one less fire hazard to send my burgeoning career up in smoke.

I read that a 20lb tank will serve a 5x5 garden for about a month (175ft3 with a 7ft ceiling) so I'm thinking 3-50lb tanks will work for me and I won't have to lug them around so much. Does anyone have a ballpark for these?? Airgas doesn't list the price, I'm sure that'll be my vendor though.

Also I would like to run them from one regulator and one controller to minimize startup costs. Is this possible? If so, how exactly?

Can anyone recommend a good, budget controller? I have seen a couple models with "fuzzy logic" that prevents overshooting, I think that would be good.

And maybe my room's just too big and I have to bite the bullet and buy a water cooled propane gen? Should I drain to waste or run a reservoir and chiller?

I have trawled enough to not feel dumb asking all this. I really appreciate any input!!

 

[ceosam]

Bump. Interested in this as well

 

[the gnome]

el jefe,
i run around 2250cuft and went with water cooled tankless HW Heater,
with a 32 gallon brute rez you could recirculate it o chiller needed ime, ymmv,
I dtw on my ac condesate waste line.
the water gen is $110, a subpump for recirc. sys. $65
i did that for a few months then changed to run straight from tap with a $33 solenoid.
go to the dro store and expect to pay 3Xs that much for the exact same thing with a different plastic cover and the water gen sticker/logo

the burner i looked at was $450 and take 6-7minutes to cycle,
I didn't like the time or heat it would produce much less the price.
my home made water gen rocks,
in 30-45sec my room is topped off w/Co2.
if you do go with a gas Co2 get the tankless WH

$$ saved on that let me invest into a better quality Co2 sniffer and other things

I think for the size your doing tanks are the way to go

 

[Treetroit City]

I get around 8 weeks on a #20 tank in my 12x12x8 room. It all depends how sealed your room is. I pay $15 for the gas.

Sentinel, Titan and Autopilot all have the same controller. Only difference is the color and the logo. They work just fine. I use the Autopilot master greenhouse controller, I think I paid $420.

 

[Granger2]

Jefe,
3-50 lb tanks would be quite an investment. The weight of the tanks + 50 lb would be a lot to handle, and though you wouldn't have to do it often, you definitely would not want neighbors to see you taking them in and out, if that's an issue. When you take them in for refilling, there would be raised eyebrows.

Check the links appended, and I think you'll see that your usage will be way lower than your estimate. You can take 20 lb tanks from house to vehicle and back in a medium piece of luggage with casters for security if that's an issue.

To run them from one controller, just run one tank empty, switch to next tank, rather than some in series thing. Good luck. -granger

http://www.hydrofarm.com/resources//co2calc.php
http://growershouse.com/co2-calculator-for-grow-rooms

You are talking about a sealed room, right? If you're not, then I wouldn't bother with CO2 cuz it'll be almost entirely wasted.

 

[El Jefe]

Hey thanks for the good info again granger, you've been a big help with planning this out! If you're ever in Lansing, I gotta fatty rolled for ya.

I ran the numbers through that calculator; it put my mind at ease about running tanks. At 650ft3 I'll need ~1ft3/hr.

There is 8.7ft3 per lb of co2, so with a little slack in my numbers I can get 13 or 33 days from a 20 or 50lb tank, respectively. Now it does sound like overkill for 3 big tanks or a crazy multi-tank manifold. I think one or two 50lb tanks would be adequate, or maybe a few 20lb'ers.

That DIY co2 gen from a hot water heater would kill two birds with one stone! Plus Bosch and Rheem sound like quality brands compared to the various co2 gen companies. But I'm a renter and I don't think plumbing gas and water lines would get my deposit back lol. Hell it might get me sued (no lol), I'm already worried about putting a hole in the wood flooring.

Third coast, what's the model number for that autopilot controller? Their equipment seems solid from what I've read. And it sounds about on budget.

 

[Granger2]

Jefe,
I didn't check your math on the 1cu ft/3hour, but here's what I got.

1 cu ft/3 hour = 4 cu ft/day
8.7 x 20 lb= 174 cu ft
174 divided by 4 = 43.5 days

CO2 starts at lights on, runs at start of hour 3, hour 6, hour 9, shuts off at hour 12. [This is one option, but can be dispensed hourly or whatever you like]. Check it out. Good luck. -granger

 

[El Jefe]

So I'm off again, I was thinking 1cuft every hour the lights were on. But you only have to run it every few hours? That makes sense, and puts the life of a tank inline with other posts. Man I gotta quit doing drunk math...

So a simple 20lb tank will last a month and a half in my room. Well that makes this a whole lot easier proposition. Still probably gonna use two tanks, so I can get one cycle between refills.

 

[the gnome]

That DIY co2 gen from a hot water heater would kill two birds with one stone! Plus Bosch and Rheem sound like quality brands compared to the various co2 gen companies. But I'm a renter and I don't think plumbing gas and water lines would get my deposit back lol. Hell it might get me sued (no lol), I'm already worried about putting a hole in the wood flooring.

if your really in the DIY water gen you don't have to cut any holes anywhere
the water lines and gas are all self contained in the room
if you go with the trashcan res and sub pump,
the smalle tankless water heaters are usually propane for outdoor use like camping etc etc, natgas is available too.
the $110 aqua king is plenty for my room and cycles 30-45 or seconds or less,
many of the rheems and bosch Ive seen are larger units for whole house applications.
and way over kill for a room your size
i use a 20lb tank for a gas grill and the line runs 10-12ft to the gen

 

[El Jefe]

Hey gnome that sounds really doable now that I've read it through again. What made you switch to drain to waste? How much water do you use for you garden? I doubt it could be too much if it's only running a minute at a time. I would probably go with this option and plug into water lines in the basement as I'm already putting in holes to remotely mount my ballasts.

And what kind of controller/timer do you use? I was thinking if went with a gas gen I would get a recycling timer and a co2 meter, playing with the timer until I get it dialed in.

How much heat, if any, are you noticing from the unit?

 

[Granger2]

Your total amount per day can be dispensed however you like over the 12 hour light period. I guess it would be best to dispense it a little at a time. But I would stop dispensing it early enough so that, at lights out, you would be close to 400 ppm. -granger

 

[the gnome]

Hey gnome that sounds really doable now that I've read it through again. What made you switch to drain to waste? How much water do you use for you garden? I doubt it could be too much if it's only running a minute at a time. I would probably go with this option and plug into water lines in the basement as I'm already putting in holes to remotely mount my ballasts.

And what kind of controller/timer do you use? I was thinking if went with a gas gen I would get a recycling timer and a co2 meter, playing with the timer until I get it dialed in.

How much heat, if any, are you noticing from the unit?

i switched from DTW because i needed the pump to water my plants from a hose plus it did away with another 32gallon brute trashcan and using the subpump to supply water to the water gen. in the room so freed up more space.
I go thru 30 gallons every other day.
heat isn't an issue because its on on for 30-45 seconds.t
he gas gen i looked at, and using the calculator for my room it would have to run for 6-7 minutes.

timers? never used one really but sounds like a pita to dial it in.
you can get a monitor with fuzzy logic for tanks that'll help with overshooting, a must with tanks imo.
I have a green air SPC1, I set it at 900ppms and its on auto

 

[packerfan79]

I got my autopilot for about 400 on Amazon tried using a timer and didn't see any in increase in yeilds

 

[El Jefe]

Hey Gnome, got some more questions for you!

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B009YDMKV6/ref=redir_mdp_mobile
Would this solenoid work for this application? Im thinking I'd be golden but it sounds like you would know for sure.

Also would any propane regulator/hose work for this heater? I see a bunch of gas grill hoses but most of them have 3/8" threads. I know the aquaking has 1/2" US threads for all of its connections.

And same question about the water hose, what's gonna fit?

Thanks in advance!!

 

[unregistered190]

Interesting...good info folks!

 

[the gnome]

Hey Gnome, got some more questions for you!

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B009YDMKV6/ref=redir_mdp_mobile
Would this solenoid work for this application? Im thinking I'd be golden but it sounds like you would know for sure.

Also would any propane regulator/hose work for this heater? I see a bunch of gas grill hoses but most of them have 3/8" threads. I know the aquaking has 1/2" US threads for all of its connections.

And same question about the water hose, what's gonna fit?

Thanks in advance!!

hey el jefe... that solenoid is for 12V DC,
personally I'd get the 110/120V solenoid but

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-2-Brass-E...236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4612aba7dc

other than that its what you want,
1/2" threads, or 3/4" either will do, and solenoid in the normally closed position.

yes, a reg.gas grill regulator on the tank does it,
my tank is 15ft from the gen so I used a 3/8" gas line from a single ply roofing torch,
I couldn't find the right gas fittings to connect to the 1/2" NFT threads on the aqua king so I cut the the line and i used a 3/8" barbed insert connected to a 1/2"-3/8" reducing bushing to get on the 1/2" NFT thread on the gen using a 1/2galv coupler.
not the best thing using the barb and clamp on the gas line, the barb is very tite in the hose and clamped its solid and gave me enough time to have a gas line made with proper clamped ends.

for all the specialty fitting and adaptors check the hardware store, there's a ton of adapters, reducers etc etc for gas lines and from NFT to water hose threads.....
lol it took me about a day to get all the fittings and lines right

i piped the water supply with pex to a hot water hear flex hose then to the water spigot again using adapters from NFT threads to hose thread adapters.

for the hot water waste line i used a rubber air hose, not vinyl,
again fitted at the gen with a 1/2" pex female fitting and a few inches of pex line with a 1/2" coupler clamped to the air hose.

I could have used pex all the way but I had the air hose handyand its easy and flexible to route back to the drain.
you can use a good grade garden hose for your drain line
BUT
take into consideration its going to be handling hot water,
only for 30-60seconds,
still make sure your waste line can handle the heat.

..

..

 

[El Jefe]

That's awesome stuff man thanks a lot! I'll be posting my own install soon.

 

[steadydets]

Very clean!