Botrytis is systemic, right?

[AgentPothead]

Botrytis is systemic right, not endemic? Like I have a plant that is obviously infected, if I take a cutting of a branch that looks okay, it is still infected right? Even if I grow that out into a clone and then take a cutting off the clone, it will still have botrytis in the plant cells? I have an outdoor plant that is obviously screwed, but somebody said I could clone a clone and it would be okay, but that sounds like bullshit to me. Ya'll would definitely know better than me though

 

[HHILL]

Botrytis isn't systemic I believe. PM is and will be in the cuts from an infected branch. With Botrytis, take a cut from a healthy branch preferably with a small flower on it as humidity can cause botrytis in a dense bud.

Also, if the buds are full of botrytis, why take a cut? Find a mold resistant strain for next year.

 

[Limeygreen]

Botrytis is an opportunistic mold, you are breathing it as we speak as am I, it is endemic for sure, it can get into the vascular tissue around a wound and rot the stem but not infect the entire plant through the vascular tissue.

You could try different pruning techniques to get more branches with smaller buds, do canopy thinning so that you get a better airflow around those buds and trim off lower branches/popcorn to increase airflow and less stress on the plant but you may still end up with botrytis, location is good as well, area with full sun, not at the bottom elevation and least prone to frost and condensation will help but not cure it if it is susceptible.

 

[AgentPothead]

Yeah, basically it's an outdoor plant somebody else started, supposed to be a very strong sativa in the order of 25%+ thc so just wanted to see if it was possible to save through a cutting. They have other seeds so it isn't a real genetic emergency or anything. Thanks for the answers guys!

 

[Medfinder]

Spore born and there are many types.

i had one type of downey mildew that when the temp and moisture was right fruited mushrooms.
Pseudoperonospora cubensis

used green cure hydroperoxide sulfur etc..etc.. recommended?
Tanos (famoxadone}

lost a lot of genetics from BOGS gear.

 

[Yard dog]

It's Systemic, it's clearly environmentally driven but is often asymptomatic so it will not show in some hosts. For instance bud rot can remain hidden right until it gets the environment it wants and even then it might not always show, it can be passed with seeds.
You can screen for it with PCR tests, I'd search out a paper on it by a M Shaw which was done last year on this.

 

[therevverend]

I agree with the above posters boytritis spores are everywhere waiting for the right conditions to sprout. If you take a cutting and move it indoors the cutting should be fine. Grey mold is a disease of opportunity waiting for cool temperatures, high humidity, and the proper PH. Change the conditions and it will be fine.
My area has stretches where it is cool and humid so I often suffer bud rot. This year was sunny and warm, I found spots in buds where grey mold had started and died. Killed by the sunlight and dry temperature. A dry dead spot in the bud that is easily removed.
have a problem with stem rot. The stem will get an infection, grey mold will start rotting through it. If I catch it, sterilize it, the wound heals. I've lost whole plants that way, all it takes is an inch of rot to cut through the heart of the stem.
I select for mold resistance but in the fall it gets so wet any large bud is prone to rot. High potency large yielding strains will always be susceptible at temperatures below 65 degrees and above 80% humidity. So it's a question of trade offs. I would rather grow the best ganja, letting it finish all the way then harvest early or grow less potent earlier strains. My losses aren't large enough to justify giving up on the stuff I like.

 

[Yard dog]

Botrytis is an opportunistic mold, you are breathing it as we speak as am I, it is endemic for sure, it can get into the vascular tissue around a wound and rot the stem but not infect the entire plant through the vascular tissue.

You could try different pruning techniques to get more branches with smaller buds, do canopy thinning so that you get a better airflow around those buds and trim off lower branches/popcorn to increase airflow and less stress on the plant but you may still end up with botrytis, location is good as well, area with full sun, not at the bottom elevation and least prone to frost and condensation will help but not cure it if it is susceptible.

It's systemic, just because you don't see something does not mean it is not there!... Botrytis can complete its cycle without showing symptoms but it is/was still there...

 

[EsterEssence]

It's Systemic, it's clearly environmentally driven but is often asymptomatic so it will not show in some hosts. For instance bud rot can remain hidden right until it gets the environment it wants and even then it might not always show, it can be passed with seeds.
You can screen for it with PCR tests, I'd search out a paper on it by a M Shaw which was done last year on this.

Can you provide a link that proves it is systemic and be passed on in a seed. I search and can't find anywhere it says anything like that. I find that it is a fungus common in grapes. I can't understand how a spore is in a seed...

 

[Yard dog]

Can you provide a link that proves it is systemic and be passed on in a seed. I search and can't find anywhere it says anything like that. I find that it is a fungus common in grapes. I can't understand how a spore is in a seed...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4861902/
https://vegetablemdonline.ppath.cornell.edu/NewsArticles/Seed Infection and Transmission.pdf
https://www.canna-uk.com/botrytis_cinerea_in_detail
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18942979

spores are just the reproductive cells, I gave you the name for the link in the posts above. Grapes are sometimes actually infected with forms of Botrytis on purpose look up "noble rot". (I've added the last link as it's specific to seed)

 

[EsterEssence]

Thanks...

 

[Mikell]

PM is not systemic. This is a dead horse, easily discounted by any research on noncannabis websites.

Yard Dog appears correct on the systemic nature of Botrytis.


I highly advise people looking for accurate information in this regard to move away from cannabis forums, as Yard Dog clearly did.

One search string I find helpful is,

site:*.edu

Followed by your query. This will give more accurate result.

ResearchGate and scihub are very useful.

 

[mugenbao]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4861902/
https://vegetablemdonline.ppath.cornell.edu/NewsArticles/Seed%20Infection%20and%20Transmission.pdf
https://www.canna-uk.com/botrytis_cinerea_in_detail
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18942979

spores are just the reproductive cells, I gave you the name for the link in the posts above. Grapes are sometimes actually infected with forms of Botrytis on purpose look up "noble rot". (I've added the last link as it's specific to seed)

Only two of those links appear to work, and I'm very curious about what the others originally had to say

 

[Avenger]

Only two of those links appear to work, and I'm very curious about what the others originally had to say

for some reason ICMAG automagically inserts an S on the end of any external http links. If the linked page is not HTTPS, then this S in the link code prevents the page form loading.

simply remove the S from the link address and the link should work.

http[strike]s[/strike]://www.canna-uk.com/botrytis_cinerea_in_detail

 

[AgentPothead]

That last link at the library of medicine appears to show that not only is at least one strain of botrytis systemic, it definitely can be transferred to the seeds. Thanks for the links and information.

 

[MountainBudz]

I know one thing, I am battling the fuck out of it this year and I have took every preventative measure you could ever imagine.

It has not rained for over a week. I got out early this morning at dusk, sprayed an entire gallon worth of Seranade, BT and sea weed juice. Got in the shower and now it is pouring the rain, steady for over an hour. What bullshit!

I know one thing, if this nasty shit is systematic then I am going to attack it systematically, from the inside out in a few days when my $300.00 20 oz bottle of Bayer FLINT fungicide get's here. It is a systematic fungicide with a very low toxicity rate. I have had enough of this botrytis shitarious nasty shit! I will use FLINT for the rest of my entire life if it works like I hear it does. I have read where a guy had used it for 5 years straight running commercial sized crops outdoors and has not had a speck of rot since.

Kiss my botrytis!!

 

[Loc Dog]

I know one thing, I am battling the fuck out of it this year and I have took every preventative measure you could ever imagine.

It has not rained for over a week. I got out early this morning at dusk, sprayed an entire gallon worth of Seranade, BT and sea weed juice. Got in the shower and now it is pouring the rain, steady for over an hour. What bullshit!

I know one thing, if this nasty shit is systematic then I am going to attack it systematically, from the inside out in a few days when my $300.00 20 oz bottle of Bayer FLINT fungicide get's here. It is a systematic fungicide with a very low toxicity rate. I have had enough of this botrytis shitarious nasty shit! I will use FLINT for the rest of my entire life if it works like I hear it does. I have read where a guy had used it for 5 years straight running commercial sized crops outdoors and has not had a speck of rot since.

Kiss my botrytis!!

Not sure if you are still around since old post. You mentioned Flint as low toxicity. Do you have any other info about it used on cannabis and/or halflife?? Myclobutanil is low toxicity when eaten but produces cyanide when heated over 400F.

Was researching and active ingredient is on list of prohibited products for CA cannabis.

Cannabis Pesticide Testing | Hemp Lab | Green Leaf Lab Oregon & California

Green Leaf Lab offers compliance and analytical cannabis and hemp testing in California and Oregon. We test for pesticides and many other factors. Call 503-253-3511

greenleaflab.org

 

[St. Phatty]

Botrytis is systemic right, not endemic? Like I have a plant that is obviously infected, if I take a cutting of a branch that looks okay, it is still infected right? Even if I grow that out into a clone and then take a cutting off the clone, it will still have botrytis in the plant cells? I have an outdoor plant that is obviously screwed, but somebody said I could clone a clone and it would be okay, but that sounds like bullshit to me. Ya'll would definitely know better than me though

Systemic - Endemic - in some contexts they are the same thing.

TRIVIA - the wine industry ended up basing a product on Botrytis infected plants.

A lot of diseases - in animals - involve semi-pathogens that are very, very small viruses - e.g. Herpes or Covid19.

They hide in the body and cause little if any damage. e.g. Covid19 virus particle is about 60 nanometers, whereas the 'average' atom is about 0.2 nanometers. So it's difficult for the immune system to "get them all".

Then when the immune system is weak, or the blood chemistry favors the virus, the virus becomes destructive.

Do plants have immune systems ?

If you have an extra area where you can isolate the infected plants, I would continue growing them there, and give them the best possible treatment.

 

[Ca++]

Interesting it can be passed on. For a moment I had ideas about seeds destined to grow rotten plants, but I need to wake up. The chances of having a seed with no rot in it's ancestry, makes winning the lottery look easy. I'm thinking the quantity present is the only real issue.

Has anyone found damping off of seedlings, to seem more common in some seed batches than others? I'm guessing only an outdoor breeder has had the misfortune to be keeping seeds from rotten bud. Then probably wasn't watching for any correlation. Perhaps even thought that cross was particularly prone. Thinking genetics, not contaminates.

All the cleaning of seeds some people do. Kinda looks futile if the mold is inside. I think it's probably a non-starter though. I have had packs with high losses I couldn't explain, but being on the outside does seem more likely. Inside the plant, the plant has means of control. Outside the seed case, it has just the local biology to contend with.


Interesting

 

[Loc Dog]

Systemic - Endemic - in some contexts they are the same thing.

TRIVIA - the wine industry ended up basing a product on Botrytis infected plants.

A lot of diseases - in animals - involve semi-pathogens that are very, very small viruses - e.g. Herpes or Covid19.

They hide in the body and cause little if any damage. e.g. Covid19 virus particle is about 60 nanometers, whereas the 'average' atom is about 0.2 nanometers. So it's difficult for the immune system to "get them all".

Then when the immune system is weak, or the blood chemistry favors the virus, the virus becomes destructive.

Do plants have immune systems ?

If you have an extra area where you can isolate the infected plants, I would continue growing them there, and give them the best possible treatment.

There is a product CS 2005 which claims it is safe on cannabis and uses nano copper that can get into plants through stomata. When I mentioned I was a hobbyist company stopped replying. Smallest amount I see for sale is 2.5 gallons for close to $200. I probably only need a few ounces. I just want to be able to salvage genetics without having botrytis in the clones. Seems anything that can cure it is on banned list for CA. Had considered Myclobutanil but half life is 60 - 220 days so could be years to get it completely out of plant.