i may be starting an indoor garden shed grow---ive been reading up some on the diffrent problems with heat issues by summer and winter outdoor temps--also the thermal imageing issues---my question is about lighting at moment--i have 8ft by 4 or 5ft still decideing---it only has 5ft 6inches at sides but 6ft at apex----i dont realy want to go more than 2kw if possible as i allso need to keep my mothers in veg which i keep on 15 hours for out door grows over the winter---would 5ft by 8ft be more suitable even for space or 4ft by 8ft---im planing on keeping plants small as sea of green method---i will buy the suitable lighting---if light rails are advisable i will add them to----what would be best lighting for that space---i was thinking on duel lighting ceramic metal halide and hps or what ever is best in people oppinion--a total beginer---have very little experiace with indoor growing apart from keeping mothers over winter with bright wing enviro light and a 250watt metale halid---looking for what evers best--thanks for any help
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beginer
- Thread starter minime
- Start date
Well lets break it down.
General rule of thumb is a minimum of 50w per square foot.
5' x 8' = 40 square feet
4' x 8' = 32 square feet
In the 5' x 8' area with 2x 1k HPS lights you would get 50w per square foot and 7000 lumens per square foot.
In the 5' x 8' area with 3x 600w HPS lights you would get 45w per square foot and 6750 lumens per square foot.
In the 4' x 8' area with 2x 1k HPS lights you would get 62.5w per square foot and 8750 lumens per square foot.
In the 4' x 8' area with 3x 600w HPS lights you would get 56.25w per square foot and 8437 lumens per square foot.
Your best options are 2x 1k HPS or 3x 600w HPS.
I would choose the 3x 600w HPS lights as this is 200w less energy used and you would have three overlapping light sources...much better then two IMO and you can keep them closer to the canopy.
General rule of thumb is a minimum of 50w per square foot.
5' x 8' = 40 square feet
4' x 8' = 32 square feet
In the 5' x 8' area with 2x 1k HPS lights you would get 50w per square foot and 7000 lumens per square foot.
In the 5' x 8' area with 3x 600w HPS lights you would get 45w per square foot and 6750 lumens per square foot.
In the 4' x 8' area with 2x 1k HPS lights you would get 62.5w per square foot and 8750 lumens per square foot.
In the 4' x 8' area with 3x 600w HPS lights you would get 56.25w per square foot and 8437 lumens per square foot.
Your best options are 2x 1k HPS or 3x 600w HPS.
I would choose the 3x 600w HPS lights as this is 200w less energy used and you would have three overlapping light sources...much better then two IMO and you can keep them closer to the canopy.
cheers yes i understand fully what im doing--its called breaking the law unfortunatly hear in uk--peace ---so 3 600watts hps-is ample---this is just the flower room---i have a mother and veg room---sorry to pick your brains but is there any perticuler bulbs or makes i should go for---digi ballests or magnetic for an all round perfection price is not the issue safty and performance is my aim---once i know what lighting im going to use i can work out extraction and temp control part---thanks loads
yea the shed is 9ft by 9ft ---5ft4inchs at side 6ft in middle---im gonna go with a 7ft by 4ft flower room---4ft by 5ft mother room and clones--i have 2 bright wings allready 4tube--3 eviro lites and a 250watt mh---im useing plaster bord with polastirene---coverd in plastic sheeting---ill leave 1ft cavity at sides 6inch cavity front an back--ill have a 12volt pc fans leeping the outside air cumming in---the shed is coverd by a thick layer af greenery so hopefully i can hide the thermal footprint---trying to work out the temp changes outside in winter and the affects it will have on inside temps---maybe heating mats not sure still working it all out---come febury the flower room will be used for my outdoor plants get a good head start for 2010 lol--aint even finished this one allready planning next---problem is the electric use cant go to much--fans fillters lights it all adds up--willing to sacrafice some luxuries----like i said totaly new to it all---naboure might help me out with a line from her house in return i pay the electric bill mine and hers which means i can spread the cost plus less chance of overloading--a £15 a week on mine and £15 on hers not sure how much 2 600 watt possibly 3 600wats plus bright wings and so on wiill cost--i £25 to £30 a week for grow not sure what i could run for that--i think my KWH is 12pence----it gets a bit confuseing---gonna be growing in soil---so got to work out lighting exstraction temps--doing lots of reading getting there bit by bit---cheers for advice
Grønn
Member
Just some advice I wish someone had given me when I started growing.
Don't start a grow by thinking about how many lights you have space for.
Start by planning ventilation and odor control.
As it's your ventilation/cooling that defines how many lights u can have.
Just my two pence - as I see so many new growers invest a lot in lights and not enough in environmental control.
Don't start a grow by thinking about how many lights you have space for.
Start by planning ventilation and odor control.
As it's your ventilation/cooling that defines how many lights u can have.
Just my two pence - as I see so many new growers invest a lot in lights and not enough in environmental control.
cheers gronn ---the odor problem is not so bad as iv grown lots in garden outside---this perticular strain ill be growing is very low odor in veg and flower so lucky there--have seen it grown in a garage all the way just the last week it perks up---but once its dryed it stinks---very potent----no scrubber or filters used--just this strain im talking about--so real lucky there----ventilation is the key--iv read that and will certainly put a lot more thought in to it----still getting my head round it all--any advice you can give is appreciated---i will use a carbon fillter all the same so nobody will know which siuts me fine---stoping the thermal foot print is priority--so temps exstraction odor an all --the set up can be designed around these issuses--plus this has got to be the easyest plant to grow---snap a branch off stick it in ground outside or in pot inside--and it roots one hardy easy mould proof plant--its hard to kill---so got a bit of luck to start with--i dont mind spending money on good products like accoustic fans and decent exstraction and so on--so any advice on products or design im all ears--would like to start with near on perfect enviroment from begining and fine tune it as it gos along--cheers for any advice
i was thinking more on the lines of sea of green----lots of smaller plants----im growing more for qulity than over all yield---this strain is not a big yeilder but just easy and potent everyone loves it--low odor untill it drys then it stinks the house out----iv seen some impresive grows verticaly---not sure if it works for sog---the space im growing in is 150csqft---7ft by 4ft by 5ft so hight is an issue-----maybe one vertical side 4ft by 3half foot--the other horizontal--good learning curve but may coplicate things---theres so many other strains id love to try but ill stick with this for now---get a bit of experance under the belt befor i start with the harder to grow strains---but anythings a possibilty---the nabour said yes so i can get two lines of electric--will not be such an increse on one house holds bill---may use one for lights the other for ventilation got to work out the best way to spread it out evenly---mother room on in the day flower room at night---any ideas welcome
Grønn
Member
Here's a picture of my set-up
And 3-weeks into flower
I really like the vertical bulbs as they are a lot easier to cool, and imho you get more direct light from a vertical bulb than a horiz one.
As far as ventilation and odor control is concerned. Even though your lucky enough to have a very low odor strain I would still invest in a carbon filter as even a little odor escaping can cause huge ass-pains.
When it comes to fans and the like it depends a lot on your specific circumstances. i.e ambient temperatures, access to hydro stores, size of possible vents, intakes and more.
I'm running 2400w at the moment and using 2x6" fans from:
http://www.basementlighting.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?page=1/prod/cb3 - would probably have gone with the 8" fans and speed controllers if I could've, but my outtake vents are 6" and I'm limited by that in what size fans I can use and therefore also how much wattage I can use...
As of now temps are perfect, but when the outside temperature was 30c in the summer I was struggling to keep temps in check. Probably gonna have more temp problems when winter temps hit -20c.
Anyhow in the uk you have a few good hydro stores:
http://www.basementlighting.com/
https://www.progrow.co.uk/
http://www.growell.co.uk/
Check out the different prizes and shop around.
If your thinking about SoG I would recommend checking out Pirate's thread:
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=109231
Some extremely impressive stuff going on here - an inspirational thread if there ever was one.
Building a grow is a journey - looking forward to following yours.
GL
And 3-weeks into flower
I really like the vertical bulbs as they are a lot easier to cool, and imho you get more direct light from a vertical bulb than a horiz one.
As far as ventilation and odor control is concerned. Even though your lucky enough to have a very low odor strain I would still invest in a carbon filter as even a little odor escaping can cause huge ass-pains.
When it comes to fans and the like it depends a lot on your specific circumstances. i.e ambient temperatures, access to hydro stores, size of possible vents, intakes and more.
I'm running 2400w at the moment and using 2x6" fans from:
http://www.basementlighting.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?page=1/prod/cb3 - would probably have gone with the 8" fans and speed controllers if I could've, but my outtake vents are 6" and I'm limited by that in what size fans I can use and therefore also how much wattage I can use...
As of now temps are perfect, but when the outside temperature was 30c in the summer I was struggling to keep temps in check. Probably gonna have more temp problems when winter temps hit -20c.
Anyhow in the uk you have a few good hydro stores:
http://www.basementlighting.com/
https://www.progrow.co.uk/
http://www.growell.co.uk/
Check out the different prizes and shop around.
If your thinking about SoG I would recommend checking out Pirate's thread:
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=109231
Some extremely impressive stuff going on here - an inspirational thread if there ever was one.
Building a grow is a journey - looking forward to following yours.
GL
nice grow gronn--yea iv been to a growell shop they have most of what i need---would 2 6inch fans do the 2 or 3 600watts---for my 8ft by 4ft grow area--thinking that you may have gone bigger if you could--more control means better enviroment to some extent-i was looking at the accoustic exstraction kit 2--250m3/hours--not sure what that means though will go bigger if advised---hears what i have in mind--------------------------------one intake partical fillter----2 6inch fans---should i use one big carbon fillter or 2 smaller ones---i was thinking of getting a pk tempriture controlled extractor fan--as it mentions the summer and winter issues---id like to do vertical lighting as you have shown can allways change at later date--but would like to design my first grow room to the best i can--as i said i dont mind spending money on decent gear--just unable to use to much electric--is my only issue---thanks again helping loads
Grønn
Member
Busy weekend - getting everything ready for next round.
Just to backtrack a little - you never said what your goals with this grow are.
Growing for personal use - you and a few friends - looking to make some cash?
Your motivation for growing affects what lengths you want to go to get as many watts into your space as possible. In my opinion 2*600w would be the best bet for your space.
Here's a floorplan for 2*600w vertival three grow 18 plants.
http://www.icmag.com/ic/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=782177&ppuser=7920
And one for 3*600w SoG grow 112 plants.
http://www.icmag.com/ic/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=782178&ppuser=7920
Also do you have a picture of your space/shed? Would help visualize what you have to work with.
Building your room within the shed with plasterboard and insulation will help keep temps steady, and if you cover the inside with reflective (http://www.growell.co.uk/p/4148/Diamond-Reflective-Sheeting.html) that should help with heat signature, and give u more bang for your buck from your lights.
Those acoustic fans are sweet - low noise and efficient - sizing ventilation can be tricky as it depends on so many factors. But if you give the guys at growell a call I'm sure they'll be more than happy helping you.
My guess is that the 150mm acoustic fan should be enough to cool 2*600w.
just a ?: why are you restricted on how much electricity you can run?
Just to backtrack a little - you never said what your goals with this grow are.
Growing for personal use - you and a few friends - looking to make some cash?
Your motivation for growing affects what lengths you want to go to get as many watts into your space as possible. In my opinion 2*600w would be the best bet for your space.
Here's a floorplan for 2*600w vertival three grow 18 plants.
http://www.icmag.com/ic/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=782177&ppuser=7920
And one for 3*600w SoG grow 112 plants.
http://www.icmag.com/ic/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=782178&ppuser=7920
Also do you have a picture of your space/shed? Would help visualize what you have to work with.
Building your room within the shed with plasterboard and insulation will help keep temps steady, and if you cover the inside with reflective (http://www.growell.co.uk/p/4148/Diamond-Reflective-Sheeting.html) that should help with heat signature, and give u more bang for your buck from your lights.
Those acoustic fans are sweet - low noise and efficient - sizing ventilation can be tricky as it depends on so many factors. But if you give the guys at growell a call I'm sure they'll be more than happy helping you.
My guess is that the 150mm acoustic fan should be enough to cool 2*600w.
just a ?: why are you restricted on how much electricity you can run?
im growing for personal use and a few friends---im not restricted by the time it takes betwwen crops--if it finishes in 8 weeks or 12 --im in no rush--i dont need to cram them in for maximum yield---if fewer is better im fine with that--not worryed about cost---would rather get whats needed and build the room to its best performance--restriction on electric is that i only have a large one bed room flat with big garden--i use on average about 10 pound a week if that when my veg lights are on it goes to 18 pound--so im thinking tha 20 or 30 pound on top of that may be noticed--but my upstaires nabour has said i can run a line from her house--ill pay her bill in return--out of princable--so that will spread it out some--just worryed that to much electric may alert the officals---baseing it on 3000watts with lights and ventilation at 12pence a kwh--it works out at 60 pound roughly a week --i think i got my sums right but if that is the case spliting it between to house holds less chance--as its comeing up to winter the bill gos up some---other than that id have to steal the electric which i dont realy want to do----not sure if im be a little para on the electric just a 50 pound hike might be to much--lol--yea ive heard good things about the accoustic fans and seen or heard the diffrence at friens little grows---you get what you pay for kind of thing--cutting costs sometimes dont pay off---i will get some pics up this week just starting the shed--im a builder by trade and have city and guild in plasterbord laminating sound proofing and such so know exactly what to do as biulding the grow room---just getting all the electric cables and stuff --i have a good electrican to help me set it all up safely----just havent a clue on indoor growing---i grow outdoors only apart from my little mother and clone room got that down to a tee though so im not a compeat novice as far as growing gos just never done it in door---cheers loads
Grønn
Member
Sounds like you're as sound as a pound, and off to a great start.
Having friends in the trades is a huge advantage.
My friend who's a bathroom flooring specialist put down watertight floors for me in my rooms. So now when I have the inevitable leak from my hydro system I'll only come home to an indoor swimming pool - not the fire brigade, pissed downstairs neighbors and the law.
At the moment I'm located in a scandinavian country, but used to live and grow in fair Scotland. What I was told by several people in Scotland was that as long as I paid my bills on time I didn't need to worry about electricity costs giving me away, but this is 7 years ago so the situation might have changed. But what ever you do don't steal electricity - as that's something the power companies are on the lookout for constantly.
Looking forward to seeing this take shape.
Having friends in the trades is a huge advantage.
My friend who's a bathroom flooring specialist put down watertight floors for me in my rooms. So now when I have the inevitable leak from my hydro system I'll only come home to an indoor swimming pool - not the fire brigade, pissed downstairs neighbors and the law.
At the moment I'm located in a scandinavian country, but used to live and grow in fair Scotland. What I was told by several people in Scotland was that as long as I paid my bills on time I didn't need to worry about electricity costs giving me away, but this is 7 years ago so the situation might have changed. But what ever you do don't steal electricity - as that's something the power companies are on the lookout for constantly.
Looking forward to seeing this take shape.
wotamess
Active member
YO.
3000w is a lot... build it up, maybe? like start one bulb and the fan for a month or whatever, then the next then the next... no spikes in pricing? dunno...
now go post 'nice bud' and 'oooh' for every pic in the 'flower pix' section to get your post count up! 50 for pm's
later
-wam-
3000w is a lot... build it up, maybe? like start one bulb and the fan for a month or whatever, then the next then the next... no spikes in pricing? dunno...
now go post 'nice bud' and 'oooh' for every pic in the 'flower pix' section to get your post count up! 50 for pm's
later
-wam-
